Please..if there is a god out there..

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JPG1

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Jul 16, 2008
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Gigi,

This may be of use to you when trying to work your way through the Mental Capacity Assessment.

An IMCA service will refuse to be involved if a person has family/friends/involved others involved in his/her life. That was the case, and I don't think it has changed recently.

The person who carries out the assessment should be the person ‘responsible for making the particular decision’ a.k.a the ‘decision maker’. Also, that person should have received suitable training in assessing mental capacity. Changing Residence is considered to be a ‘welfare’ decision, rather than a ‘health’ decision – which is why a SW carried out the assessment, in our case, rather than the Consultant.

In our case, regarding the specific decision about a move to residential care, the assessment was carried out on the 2nd, 8th and 15th of the same month. It was carried out in the assessment ward, twice in the quiet room, once in the garden. No family member was present – but it is most definitely a possibility for a family member to be present, and that is something I would have wanted if only I had known then that it was a possibility. But you learn more as you go along, and the MCA was brand-spanking new then - the 'team' have since apologised for many faults on their part, citing their 'newness' to it all. They had all been on the 'training course', so I won't forgive them for many of their errors.

Also, the assessment should be carried out in a place and at a time when the ‘assessee’ is not disorientated and not at maximum confused-point, so not at that “sundowning” time. And if Eric is 'unhappy' about going to the day centre, then your SW should perhaps think again about the location, because he is most likely to say "I want to be at home". But it's down to the assessor to decide whether he actually knows what/where home is.

If/when it takes place, you should make sure the SW (or whoever) knows in advance that you will want to receive a copy of the assessment documentation.

The one thing you may not have seen is the ‘blank’ Mental Capacity Assessment and Decision Documentation. I don’t have a blank, but I do have a completed form, which I can’t scan and post because it contains personal and 3rd party detail.

If you wish, I could post the full form questions/documentation/assessment process required. Then you may be able to assess whether your SW is showing the capacity to understand it all. Ours certainly did have that ability. But she was not ‘very young’.

I'm quite willing to post the full documentation detail - anonymised, of course - if only because it may help others too. But it's your decision, and it will be a fairly long post. But I'm happy to do it, if you think it might help.
 

JPG1

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Gigi,

I have now found an online example of the kind of documentation required, for assessment of mental capacity, so that'll save me a lot of typing.

It's not my particular part of the country, but the actual form is very similar. You'll need to scroll down to page 22, before you get to the actual document, and I haven't read all of the 30 pages, but it does give a good guide as to what is required.

http://www.hackney.gov.uk/mental-capacity-act-leaflet.pdf
 

gigi

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Many thanks, JPG, for taking the time and trouble to find this for me. I appreciate it.


I had actually seen it on one the links posted previously..but the information which you've provided in your previous post is valid and useful. The SW is planning to do the assessment when Eric is next in respite..and that's 2 weeks away yet.

The AS Advocates will have seen him before that point to start gathering information.

Many thanks all for the tips on how to get Eric to the Day Centre tomorrow..:)
I'll keep it simple, I think! The job idea is too complicated and could lead to all sorts of questions..:rolleyes:

I've spoken to the CH Manager today and we've decided it's a good idea to tell Eric that he's been invited to Sunday lunch, they really want him to go and are sending a taxi specially for him.

Love xx
 

Lynne

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Jun 3, 2005
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So glad that you are receiving good support on TP, Gigi, you know we are all behind you (look out behind you! :D) and other people have gone to so much effort to dig up relevant info - you're Brilliant, you lot!

On the "keep it simple" track for tomorrow, could your Mum perhaps develop a sudden urgent need for your presence (not wanting to tempt fate here though!) and would Eric accept that? And of course he knows they do lovely Sunday lunches at ...(whatever it's called).

Not that your lunches aren't superb too Gigi, of course! :)eek: think I'd better shut up there - I'll get me coat .. :cool:)

Love 'n Hugs
 

Skye

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Aug 29, 2006
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Gigi, just wishing you all the best for tomorrow. I hope Eric is delighted with his lunch invitation, and you have a lovely relaxing day.

Love,
 

susiesue

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Mar 15, 2007
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Fingers crossed for tomorrow - I do hope Eric enjoys his day nearly as much as David enjoys his Day Care - you never know he might surprise you!!

Love
 

gigi

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I do hope Eric enjoys his day nearly as much as David enjoys his Day Care - you never know he might surprise you!!

A surprise would be lovely...:D

When I was talking to the CH manager she reassured me that they will look after Eric..I know they will. She made quite an important observation...

"When Eric is with us he is fine..but lets us know he is not happy to be here. We realise from looking after him that he is one of those people who is generally not happy. He's not happy at home, he's not happy here. He's probably just very unhappy with the way he is..and nobody can change that"

That sums it up very well...

Food for thought.

Love xx
 

JPG1

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Many thanks, JPG, for taking the time and trouble to find this for me. I appreciate it.
....
The SW is planning to do the assessment when Eric is next in respite..and that's 2 weeks away yet.

My apologies - where I said "day centre", I meant "respite"!
 

Skye

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"When Eric is with us he is fine..but lets us know he is not happy to be here. We realise from looking after him that he is one of those people who is generally not happy. He's not happy at home, he's not happy here. He's probably just very unhappy with the way he is..and nobody can change that"

I hope you've made a note of that, and are going to quote it to everyone concerned!:D

Love,
 

burfordthecat

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Jan 9, 2008
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Gigi

Yet another first for you and Eric. I do hope that it all goes smoothly tomorrow. Does Eric still play the piano? My reason for asking is that if they have one in the Care Home, do you think that Eric would want to play. I just seem to remember him responding so well when he was able to play on his birthday. Only my thoughts.

Sending love and hugs to you both

Carina x x
 

gigi

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So far, so good...

We've been up since 5.30..so plenty of time for me to wake up and find an opportunity to spring the news that Eric is going out today!

When he started to complain about the bits on the carpet and the dust on the furniture I grabbed the chance...:cool:

Making sympathetic clucking noises..(no comments please..:D) I patiently explained how difficult it was to hoover the lounge without disturbing him. Then said I could do it today as he'd been invited out to lunch at ****** He asked if I was going too...and if he'd have to pay..:rolleyes:

I said I'd love to go but who would hoover the lounge?

Job done. He's accepted that he's going and that the girls are looking forward to seeing him again...even though he has absolutely no recollection of the place.

I think he rather likes the idea that a special taxi has been ordered just for him to take him and bring him home...and he doesn't have to pay for it..:D

The carer has just turned up to shower and dress him..we're almost there!

Sadly, Carina, there's no piano in the CH. Eric only plays very occasionally now and for a very short time.

Love xx
 

Grannie G

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Apr 3, 2006
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That`s wonderful gigi. Clever you. :)

Better make sure those bits and that dust are gone before Eric`s return.
 

susiesue

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Mar 15, 2007
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Gigi! - I am astounded at how inventive you are;) at least you can explain things to Eric and he does understand, up to a point.

I do hope he enjoys himself and you do too....

Love
 

gigi

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Thankyou !

I suppose I'll have to hoover the lounge and flick a duster here and there..:rolleyes:

It's incredible that Eric has accepted this with very little question..I really thought he'd give me a hard time.

Which just goes to show how wrong I can be!

Of course I still have to get him in the taxi....

Love xx
 

Grannie G

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It's incredible that Eric has accepted this with very little question..I really thought he'd give me a hard time.
It shows he is ready. The same happened with us, only it was permanent.
 

Skye

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Aug 29, 2006
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Brilliant, gigi.:):):)

But does this mean you;ll have to hoover the lounge every Sunday?:eek::eek::eek:

Hope you have a lovely day.:)

Love,
 

Grannie G

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Apr 3, 2006
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Kent
My fingers are crossed, my heart is in my mouth. I can`t get on with my work until I know Eric is safely on his way.
Please post gigi.
 
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