1. Ann Mac

    Ann Mac Registered User

    Oct 17, 2013
    Morning everyone,

    Amy, expecting your Mum to be upset/unsettled about the room move is one thing - its a lot different from actually dealing with that upset, as Slugsta very wisely says. Its no wonder its impacting on you, Hun, so 'ramble away'. Its helpful for me in that its got me thinking more deeply about how Mil will be when we finally (hopefully) get her moved into the home - so much fuss and hassle about just getting the paperwork and meetings and all that stuff sorted, that I actually hadn't really thought about her reaction after the move and what I should be thinking of doing to make it easier for her (if that's possible!) as much as I should have been thinking about it. Your posts have prodded me into looking into what happens afterwards, not just for Mil - but in terms of how it will impact on us, so thank you - forewarned is forearmed, as they say x I hope that you are able to settle the financial/legal stuff soon, just to guve you some peace of mind, hun. And we get the almost identical signals to leave, when we visit, from mil as your Mum gives - her becomming concerned that we will be 'late for that other place you have to go to', or 'If you don't go now you will miss the bus/train' or 'get stuck in traffic' - and if you don't leave promptly enough, a very plain 'Go now!' and the start of agitation. Like you, we just go along with her and act on the cues that she gives.

    Grace, I absolutely LOVE Katrine's suggested responses - just brilliant! A 'family meeting'? - I reckon that its not so much a meeting they want, as a chance for them to gang up on you in a group, to try and force you to take the main responsibility for Mil. Keep ignoring the phone calls, but if they do try and pin you down, tell them that there is no point you going to any meeting as your are under 'Docotrs orders' to take it easy and would be unable to offer any help at the present anyway. Hope the physio went well for you x

    Sounds as though the vendors are very keen, Slugsta - (she says with fingers tightly crossed) - hoping that you find the absolutely perfect flat during the viewings, Hun x

    First news - Busta dog is better, but still not 100%. Some sort of infection - and of course at his age, that's always serious :( However he has managed to drink and go to the loo throughout - though we have had to carry him into the garden up to yesterday late afternoon - and he has now started eating again, thank goodness - he's on a diet of very bland steamed chicken and rice, which is easy on his tum and tempting in comparison to his usual doggy fare, I guess. This morning, he actually attempted to climb up on to 'his' sofa in the dining room - and did manage to get down off it himself when he wanted to. Not completely out of the woods - but on the mend, and I am so, so, relieved. I can't bear the thought of losing him, he's very much 'My boy' and always has been.

    Managed to speak to the social worker yesterday, and the meeting is set for Wednesday next week, at 11.30, which suits me. SW informed me that she wasn't even told that the ward had cancelled the meeting until the actual morning of the meeting - it seems that a lot of the mis-information/lack of information originates with the ward admin! She also was surprised that Mil was back on the EMH ward, as she had been told that she was 'very ill with pneumonia' - which is a little different from the 'mild chest infection' that we were told she has had! Once again, she wasn't impressed with the communication from the ward.

    Cold is - I think - finally starting to go. So fed up of it - I've rivalled Mil for tissue usage over the last week or so! A bit of a cough still, a bit of a snffle - but throat a lot better, thankfully. Work is manic, but the major IT issues are now sorted - which involved me making another trip to the nearest service base, a round trip of over 30 miles, which turned out to be a complete waste of time - but still left with niggles- and I am so fed up of having to phone the IT department - and I'm sure they are sick of me, too. Seems as soon as I sort one issue, I'm back on the phone about yet another one - they have been lovely, and assured me that none of it is down to any mistakes I've made, but its still so annoying. The niggles are on the 'must sort' list for today, as is confirming a trip to Manchester next week, and organising the travel, and then sorting out expense claims and several other admin based jobs. I also have a massive list of emails to get through - no sooner have I dealt with 20, then another 20 arrive!

    I also have to sort my own pc problems, as for some reason, all my 'pinned' aps and programmes have gone from my task bar - and so has my search facility :confused: At the moment, can't access my images, or photo editing stuff, or my documents directly - which is infuriating! And I have no idea why! ARRRGGGHHHHHH - hate technology at times!

    Hope all of you have a good day xxxxx
  2. reedysue

    reedysue Registered User

    Nov 4, 2014
    Ann, I am glad to hear that Busta is improving, it is always so worrying when a dog is ill as they can't tell you what is wrong and look so sorry for themselves xx.
  3. Amy in the US

    Amy in the US Registered User

    Feb 28, 2015
    Ann, sending very best wishes for the Busta dog and glad to hear there's some improvement. Hope he continues on the mend.

    Your IT woes seem never ending. I wish you an end to them, so you can concentrate on something else. Also an end to your head cold!

    It is reassuring to hear that you get the same sort of thing from MIL, when she is ready for you to go. I know you've told us that before, but I don't always piece these things together right away.

    I don't normally visit my mother by myself but had to go to the care home yesterday to drop some things off. Monday night I took two phones calls from a staff person telling me my mother was asking for an over-the-counter medicine and I was to bring that in straight away. They have never, ever asked me to do this before (they get all meds, prescription and otherwise, and supplies, from their pharmacy supply company, who can deliver anything the same or next day) and so I was flustered by this. Also I'm not sure this staff person is someone who knew my mother from the Assisted Living side, and I actually blurted out at one point in the conversation, "you do know she has dementia?" as it seemed to me that my mother was spinning a confabulation. In fact, I'm almost certain of it, but of course it can be hard to tell.

    The staff person then directed me to purchase an over-the-counter fiber supplement in capsule or tablet form, and gave me the brand name. She stated she'd called the doctor and gotten an order. My pharmacy was closing in half an hour but I hurried over and made it there just before they shut. I told the very kind pharmacist what had happened and he said, that brand doesn't make capsules or tablets, and then worked out what they were likely talking about and I bought that.

    Only to get a second call from the care home, telling me to buy something else, and when would I be bringing that? Tomorrow, I told them firmly.

    So yesterday I went to another pharmacy and bought what they told me to buy (having ascertained it would be a harmless fiber supplement in case my mother doesn't actually need it, and wouldn't interact with her other medications as far as I could tell, and wouldn't harm her IBS as far as I could tell) and went to deliver it.

    I had another pile of "stuff" for my mother and darn near lost my courage and just left it all outside her door, but knocked and went in. And then ended up staying for well over an hour, which is usually longer than my mother wants company. I find that I spend so much energy being calm and in control of my body language and responses to her and the dementia, that it can be a bit tiring.

    My mother and Miss T were in my mother's room, sitting on the sofa, eating biscuits and (sort of) watching telly.

    My mother was much less agitated than when I saw her last Saturday, which was good. Only a couple of comments about not liking the room, instead of the steady stream we heard the other day. She also gave no indications (verbal or non-) of being in pain; also good.

    She was wearing the same clothes as she'd had on, on Saturday. I am now 100% sure she takes her clothes off at night and puts them back on in the morning. She is never smelly (body odor or urine or otherwise) and I suppose it doesn't matter, but it would be nice for her clothes to get washed once in a while and maybe a fresh top every now and again? Or perhaps I'm being unreasonable, unless I want to go and oversee it myself? I have it on my list of questions, at any rate. I wasn't able to investigate her pants situation surreptitiously but thought I saw more soiled ones at the bottom of her wardrobe. :(

    My mother did exhibit some confusion that was a little different. I had taken her, as requested, snacks and some little cans of Coke for her mini fridge. I handed her the Cokes and she went into the bathroom with them (hmmmm) and then came out, very confused, saying that she "can't find anything in this place" and "I want to put them in the fridge but I haven't got one." But later she was aware of her fridge.

    Her snacks are disappearing fast (sometimes they just sit for a long time) and we suspect that she and Miss T are spending more time in my mother's room now, and of course likely snacking away. My mother and/or the pair of them had eaten most of what we left on Saturday! (And if my mother ate three pints of ice cream by herself in as many days, it's no wonder she was constipated, if she was. I took her dried fruit, prunes, and biscuits and crackers with oatmeal yesterday, and no sweets.) I don't really care but don't want to take her things that will make her sick.

    One of the nurses, who seems to be the second-in-command on the memory unit, bumped into me on my way out and gave me an update. He reports my mother is, from their perspective, settling well, and better than might be expected. He also said she's not asking for as much pain medication for her arthritis/old injuries, as she was on the Assisted Living side, and that she seems to be going to sleep more easily at night. That is all VERY good news and helps to underscore that the move was a good choice.

    Then I bumped into the manager and the maintenance guy and chatted with them. The paperwork for the move and the new fees was painless (no scary clauses about me being responsible for things) and has been completed and the manager, who is very nice, wanted a chat to see how I was feeling about the move.

    So with one thing and another my "quick" errand ate up most of the afternoon and I hadn't time to go to the park for a walk, but had to head to the grocery store to fill my larder and find something for dinner. On the way, a child (he looked about 12) rode his bike into the street, against the light, on a main road, without looking for cars. I saw him enter the intersection and slammed on my brakes in time and mercifully so did the cars behind me and next to me, so no harm done. I burst into tears, from nerves, no doubt. I was travelling under the speed limit and had a green traffic signal but if I hurt anyone, especially a child, even if I weren't at fault, I would never forgive myself. He wasn't wearing a helmet and I know what a collision with a motor vehicle could do. I stopped to get myself under control and went on to the store.

    When I checked out at the store (I don't think you have Trader Joe's in the UK) the nice young man at the checkout, who gets bonus points for calling me "miss," asked how I was, and being honest due to being upset, I hesitated and said I was just okay. He seemed concerned and I reassured him I was fine, it was a lovely day, et cetera. As I started to gather up my bags to leave he presented me with a lovely bouquet of flowers! I demurred but he said, no, this is to brighten your day, please, we insist. Apparently he'd signalled a manager while I was looking for my wallet. I almost cried again on the spot and did, in the car, because it was so kind and I was feeling so wretched. (And apparently looked fairly wretched as well.) My day was much nicer after that and the flowers are lovely on my kitchen counter. I call that a deliberate act of kindness and sent the company an email to thank them.

    I've rambled on at length again, and again expect no responses. Thanks for the safe place to get this all out of my head.

    Sending you all good wishes and flowers for everyone!
  4. cragmaid

    cragmaid Registered User

    Oct 18, 2010
    North East England
    What a lovely young man Amy....:D:D

    I don't know what the situation is in the US regarding extra medications ( OTC or not) but over here the CH would only ask me to supply things like a mouth ulcer gel but even painkillers or nappy cream were provided under prescription, Mum's CH were concerned that no drugs were left in a resident's room in case they were mishandled.

    I hope that you can arrange a meeting to discuss Mum's Care Plan asap.

    Ann....glad to hear about Busta:D:D I wonder if an update has upset your settings on your computer...try a system restore.
  5. Slugsta

    Slugsta Registered User

    Evening all,

    Ann, I'm so glad that Busta dog seems to be improving - I hope you are soon going the same way!

    I think you are wise to consider the effects on MIL and yourselves when you get her into a CH. For you, it will be another reminder of how down the road she has traveled :(

    Amy, it sounds as if your mother's CH are being a PITA (do I need to translate that?)! You would have thought that anyone with experience with dementia would check a story with NOK before asking for anything to be taken in! Your description of your mum and her friend sitting together remind me so much of my Mum and her friend - and I'm thankful for that friendship, even if it does seem that Mum is only wanted to run errands!

    How lovely to be given the flowers! OK, it's a bit of a shock to realise how rough you must look, but what a thoughtful young man the cashier must be :)

    Mum was in quite good form today - at least she was clean and dry throughout! Her washing machine seems to be not working properly so we need to get that sorted out. Someone is also going to look at her shower, I discovered that it is not working when I was cleaning her up on Sunday. She won't allow the carers to shower her but I might get away with it if she is 'dirty' again.

    We have viewed 3 properties today. The first one was almost perfect but no easy way to arrange access to outside for Alfie (or any future cat). Neither of the others were right for us. I have decided not to tell Mum about this until/unless I have to - she would either forget completely or constantly mither!

    It's still pretty mild here during the day - I put the furry collar back on my coat when the weather changed but, actually, it is still too warm for it. I'm certainly not complaining!
  6. jugglingmum

    jugglingmum Registered User

    Jan 5, 2014
    Haven't managed to post on here for a bit as always want to write a long post.

    Grace glad to hear you are progressing well, sounds like the in laws are starting to realise the problem, but still want you to fix it. I hope you have strategies in place for every move they think of, perhaps tell them you have a lodger, so they no longer think you live alone is all I can think of to help.

    Ann - I hope the assessment happens soon, and that your IT problems settle down, I well remember the shock to my system of going back to work after maternity leave, and guess you are experiencing something similar but worse with finding your feet in a new job as well as still trying to fit everything else in.

    Hope Busta has continued to improve.

    Slugsta - hope flat viewing progresses - as you say you need somewhere for cats to come and go. Hope you can get your mum's shower fixed. From what you are posting she is needing more support, is it worth getting her reassessed? and more daycare days?

    Amy - sounds very odd getting you to buy the supplement from the phonecalls. Did you ask the manager the policy? Wouldn't have thought you'd want to get those without a Dr say so and only to be taken with supervision so she doesn't take too many. Dirty underwear in wardrobe sounds to me like the carers aren't doing their job properly. I think your mum will work out where everything in her room is, but slowly as it takes her longer to adjust to things.

    Update here - dau is slowly improving, don't know if I posted that OH being an engineer calculated it would take 6 months to get fully sorted. We can see improvements in her all the time, not feeling the cold like she did this time last year, much less sleep needed. She is cycling more, but then tired from it - a very fine balance. She had to reapply for her place on the Welsh MTB programme - which we weren't sure if she'd get - but she did so she is going to South Wales for 3 days in half term. She is getting the train there, as she normally does, however I have to go to a meeting there at the end - so an 8 hour round trip to pick her up, I've asked if I have to go to meeting as my friend can pick her up, and the answer is yes!

    As her training camp is the end of the week, I've had to move her blood test so it is now the same time as mum's rearranged memory clinic, so OH is going to meet me at the hospital to take dau in for blood test.

    And I had an asthma appt yesterday, was told they would change meds to one thing, and then a Facebook message from the nurse to say something else this morning! Nurse lives in my road and her son plays with mine - so not an official NHS communication method!
  7. Grace L

    Grace L Registered User

    Jun 14, 2014
    NW UK
    Hello everyone.....

    jugglingmum.... In laws have been fully aware of MiL/Mum for a long time.
    Thing is, it is better for them if they move MiL in with me. I promise you , that will not happen.
    They want to hold onto mums bungalow and not have it used as payment towards fees.

    When MiLs mum became frail, it was decided between the brothers and sisters, that Granny was going to move in with her daughter and Son in law. They were forced.
    This family lived in a bungalow, fairly flat, not many steps etc....
    They did not have the space, had several teenage kids, but Granny was moved in.

    Of course the family (MiL own brothers and sisters) promised to help out, but they never did.
    Granny did not have any property to 'inherit' as it was council owned.

    I wont be bullied, forced into having MiL move in with me. Why they think this is a good idea is beyond me.
    MiL has lived in the same town for over 50 years, why they want to move her out is a 'mystery':rolleyes:

    Knee is getting better, though having a few bumps in the road.
    My 'good knee' has started hurting . And this morning my lower back is really painful.
    I need to talk to the physio about what is it I'm doing wrong.

    I need a lot of stair practice at the Hospital gym. I am still very shaky , especially going down stairs.

    Slugsta... What a shame you are not up North. I have the perfect flat for you.
    We are not meant to have pets here (Lease) , but as people have always had them I think it gets overlooked.
    Good luck with your move and flat hunting.

    I'll catch up with the rest of you over the weekend xxxx
  8. Spamar

    Spamar Registered User

    Oct 5, 2013
    Grace, pain in other knee and hip, probably means that you are now walking properly again, not awkward or lop sided that you would have been doing. The pain is a good thing, showing that you are doing things correctly once more! It'll go soon, promise! ( couldn't find a crossed fingers emoticon!)
  9. HillyBilly

    HillyBilly Registered User

    Dec 21, 2015
    Amy - I had somehow missed this. What a lovely gesture!
  10. Ann Mac

    Ann Mac Registered User

    Oct 17, 2013
    #6290 Ann Mac, Oct 22, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2016
    Hello everyone,

    Had an absolutely manic couple of days, and though I've popped on and had quick skims of whats been happening with you all, I honestly haven't had time to read properly, or respond. A lot of it is down to the fact that the IT issues seem to have mainly been sorted (she says, turning cartwheeels, punching the air with relief - and crossing her fingers, just in case!) and I've been fathoms deep in databases and catch up. Oh and Maureen - we did a systems restore in the end, and everything went back to normal on our house pc - so yep, probably an update causing the issues there.

    I also have news about Mil - more of that later!

    Thanks sue and everyone else for the good wishes for Busta-dog. He is very, very much better - to the point where I am now having trouble convincing him that he no longer needs the specially cooked invalid diet that I've been providing him with :rolleyes: He now believes that steamed fish or chicken, with rice and doggy-suitable vegetables are no more than his due, and he is very reluctant to go back to his usual food. If I thought that teenagers had the monopoly on scathing looks and the ability to stalk off with their noses in the air, I was wrong - that old dog of mine could teach any teen how its done properly, every time I try putting a bowl of plain old dog food down in front of him!

    Amy, how odd that the home would ask you to buy and bring in even an over the counter medication! Especially as you say that have access to their own pharmacy supply company. As cragmaid says, over here, there are very few OTC things that homes would ask for - in fact, where Mil went for DC and respite, unless something was prescribed as a regular thing by a GP, they were not allowed to give it to Mil, even down to paracetamols and aqueous cream for the dry skin on her legs. I think its odd when your Mum has moved to a unit that provides more support, that more support isn't being given to encourage her to change her clothes - I don't know exacty what the various catagories of care homes are in the US, or what support each catagory is expected to provide as a general rule - but 'memory unit' suggest to me that its a place where the issues associated with memory loss (including forgetting to change clothes, wash, etc) are recognised and the appropriate support should be provided. On the plus side, it does seem as though your Mum is settling pretty well in her new accomadation - which is briliant news :)

    And how absolutely lovely of that young man to be so kind and considerate! Heartwarming to read something like that xxx

    Hope you can get your Mum's shower and washer sorted quickly, Slugsta - things like that are trying at the best of times - add in trying to deal with incontinence when both those items are on the blink, and it must be a nightmare! Sorry that the first few viewings were no good for you and your OH (and the cats!) - got fingers crossed that you find the perfect place soon xxxx

    JM, so glad to read that there are some improvements for your dau, and that she got her place back on the MTB programme. I feel for you having the long journey to attend a meeting - had a lot of that lately, myself, and it is exhausting. A mate remarked that it must be fab for me to go 'gadding off' all round the place, all in the name of work - but its all starting off in the dark, spending several hours in meetings, then heading home as it gets dark, and ending up shattered! No time to appreciate the sights of whereever it is I've been to!

    Grace, I agree with Spamar - the pain in your good knee is probably due to you 'walking properly' now your bad knee has been sorted. I have had similar associated pain (and swelling) on my 'good' leg when I've had some effective pain relief on my 'bad' hip. I am so glad that you are not being 'bullied' where Mil is concerned, by your out-laws - stay strong, hun xxxx

    OK - onto Mil!

    Firstly, OH picked up some washing for me at the weekend. I was really annoyed to see it consisted of the tops from two of her new pj's - but no bottoms - 2 pairs of netties (which are neither hers, nor are they effective in dealing with ehr incontinence) 2 tops and a just one of her new bra's. So now I'm wondering if the bottoms from her new pj's have already gone walkabout! Anyway, I washed it all, and took it back yesterday morning, on my way to an early meeting I had. I felt well enough to risk seeing Mil properly - first time in nearly 2 weeks - and found her very laid back and chilled, telling me all about how she was going back to work - and she added that though she knew I wouldn't approve (?), she had decided that 'hairdressing has changed so much, whilst I've been ill, Ann, that I've decided to go for office work instead' . I just went along with it - though to my certain knowledge, she has never in her life either been a hairdresser or done 'office work', so I have no idea where that's come from. Still, she was calm and smiling, so that's the main thing. She seems to have lost an awful lot of weight over the last couple of weeks, though - her face seemed very thin to me, and she looked far frailer than she did a few weeks back :( I also left with a bulging large bag of laundry - some wet stuff separated out into bags within the big bag - which was pretty pointless, as there was more urine-soaked stuff just mixed in with the main load :rolleyes: Its been washed and dried, and on todays agenda is sorting through and seeing if the missing pj bottoms are amongst the pile.

    As I was leaving, I was told (almost as an after-thought, by the nurse who has to escort you out to open all the secure doors) that the home had actually come out the day before and assessed Mil - and that it seemed to go well. Driving to the meeting with my fingers crossed was tricky - but I figured it could well be worth it!

    Back home, after the meeting, straight into my little office and got stuck into work. Came down to make a coffee and the phone rang. The assistant manageress from the home. Did we still want Mil to have the vacanct room there? I said yes and she informed me that they were happy to accept her, that she had already phoned the hospital and it had been arranged - subject to OH or I giving the go ahead - that Mil would move there - NEXT WEDNESDAY! The woman must have thought I was a bit on the slow side, as I repeatedly asked was she sure that the hospital had agreed to this? Afterall, all the meetings that I'm told we have to have are scheduled for next Wednesday - and here was this manageress saying that the move had been arranged for that very same morning! She was very sure, she said. So I thanked her - and rang the hospital.

    Ward manager not there, but spoke to one of the staff nurses who said that there was absolutely no reason why Mil couldn't be moved - that the meetings were more or less 'formalities' as everyone is in agreement about the care Mil needs, and the 117 funding is a given. She did say I could phone the ward manager on Monday morning to check if I wanted. I'm actually off to Manchester (again) on Monday, but I've decided to get a later train so that I can definitely make that call! Because the SW has definitely left me with the impression that Mil cannot be moved until these blasted meetings are repeated. If there is yet another mix up, if it goes wrong because of wrong info being given or another mess up on the part of the hospital, I am seriously going to go ballistic!!!!

    So (Hoping and praying that there won't be any more mix ups or incompetence) another busy few days ahead! Son and oldest are back home for a few days next week - its oldests 24th birthday on Halloween, so she is coming down during her schools half term so we can have a bit of a birthday celebration - I have the Manchester meet (won't be home till nearly 10 that evening!), I have to try and sort out what Mil has at the hospital, what I need to buy and get it all to Mil's new 'home' by Tuesday night, so that its all set up and (hopefully) welcoming for her on Wednesday morning. The home and the hospital have both strongly advised that we let staff from the hospital escort Mil to her new home and settle her in, and that we then phone later in the day to check the advisability of visiting. I really think that's a good idea - I suspect that if we try to take her, there may be some upset, as goodness knows what expectations us taking her anywhere might raise in her.

    Talk about a rollercoaster! Its just been a long ride of hopes raised and then dashed for a while now, so I am scared to believe that a move to somewhere permenant and settled for Mil is finally going to happen. Both OH and I had an initial response of huge relief - but sat there last night, we both were hit by the reality of the fact that Mil is going in a home - something we had hoped so hard that we could avoid for her. So there is sadness. And a little guilt. because although we are telling ourselves that it isn't 'us' that has 'put her in a home' (such a flipping negative phrase!) - its the dementia that has made this unavoidable, we haven't failed, we haven't let her down, that we couldn't have done more - there is still that niggle at the back of your mind that asks "Are you really sure about that? Could you have done more?". Doing our best to hit that GM with the big stick, but I think its almost inevitable that these feelings will be there - and that we just have to ride them out and come to terms with it all.

    So - please all keep fingers crossed that this all goes smoothly for us and Mil - and that this home turns out to be the best place for Mil. It ticked the vast majority of the 'boxes' that OH and I had, and despite the collossal let down of the first placement being lost due to a mix up on the part of the home, OH and I remained impressed by it looking and smelling clean, by the general atmosphere, by the staff interaction with the residents that we saw when we visited, and by the reports of how well they cope with challenging behaviour. The fact that its so close is a big bonus too. So I really hope that we have chosen well for her.

    Take care everyone - hope you all have a calm and peaceful weekend xxxx
  11. Grace L

    Grace L Registered User

    Jun 14, 2014
    NW UK
    Ann, I'm keeping everything crossed for next Wednesday.
    I hope you don't have to cope with any more delays.

    Knee OK this morning.
    I think my good knee pain is due to me walking in a new way, and using muscles in a different way.
    Physio said I was sitting straighter as well, not leaning over a bit. Wasn't aware I was before.
    It takes a of of concentration in walking, trying not to fall over, negotiate obstacles...

    Not bothering with Halloween this year.
    We only have a few local kids (in our road) call, not many at all.
    I cant be doing with getting up and down, or waiting for someone to knock the door.
  12. Onlyme

    Onlyme Registered User

    Apr 5, 2010
    Ann I was going to pm you but your up inbox is full.

    Once your MIL moves out into the community then the hospital SW will not be on that case and you will have to start again with a new SW. If she us self funding ( due to **** up of 117) SW won't want to know. Do you have 117 in writing? If not you will have to go through that again too. As long as she is in hospital they will be willing to go through hoops, as soon as she is out in the community she is invisible.
  13. cragmaid

    cragmaid Registered User

    Oct 18, 2010
    North East England
    Ann, please do not knock yourselves out trying to get "everything" right for next week.....do the basics and wait and see what else is needed as and when .:D:D

    Remember that you will probably need to return to the hospital ward a couple of days later to collect the rest of MIL's unwashed laundry:rolleyes::mad::rolleyes:
  14. Amy in the US

    Amy in the US Registered User

    Feb 28, 2015
    Ann, that is fabulous news and if they foul this up again I will get on a plane to come and beat them up personally!!!!!

    From experience: DEFINITELY let the hospital staff arrange/transport/accompany her. Don't even think of doing this yourself, please. Given the history, I strongly agree that if you do this yourselves, nothing good will come of it.

    My experience with the moves is that it's impossible to have everything you need the first time. You know the drill with labeling things and not taking anything precious or irreplaceable, so do what you can, make sure she has enough clothes for a few days, and you can fill in the gaps later. Please try not to make yourself insane in the process. Much easier said than done, I know.

    I am so pleased you may finally have a place for MIL, and that your technology problems for work are getting better, and thank goodness Busta is feeling better, and you will get to have some time with your kids, and that the end could be in sight for the DHW (Dreaded Hospital Washing)!!!


    Grace, hope your physio/OT/PT continues to go okay and they can sort out the pain you're having in your other knee. Please take good care of yourself.

    JM, pleased to hear some improvement with JugglingDaughter and hope she continues to be on the mend. Good news on the place for the biking programme.

    Slugsta, good luck with house hunting and viewing and getting your mum's shower sorted.

    I have a meeting (a "care conference") with the nurse manager for the Memory Care unit where my mother is now living, on Monday. I have a LONG list of questions and concerns. I will let you know what I find out!

    Greetings and good wishes to everyone and hope you have a good weekend.
  15. reedysue

    reedysue Registered User

    Nov 4, 2014
    Ann, keeping my fingers crossed for you xx.
  16. MrsTerryN

    MrsTerryN Registered User

    Dec 17, 2012
    Ann that is wonderful news !!!! I think that is a great idea of the nursing home staff tsking her and settling her. She will probable think it is her new job
  17. Ann Mac

    Ann Mac Registered User

    Oct 17, 2013
    #6297 Ann Mac, Oct 23, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2016
    Morning everyone,

    Glad the knee is feeling better, Grace - hope it keeps on improving for you :) Halloween can't be ignored in this house - its my oldest daughters birthday :D And its been a fab excuse, over the years, for some amazing fancy dress parties to celebrate!

    Maureen, yep - you are right - I need to focus on making sure she has the basics, and sort everything else out gradually. Late Tuesday afternoon, I will be going to the hospital to collect the bulk of her clothes that are there - clean items will go straight to the home, along with personal belongings that I've sorted out as appropriate to take there. The aim is to make sure that she has at least 4 clean changes of clothes, and a good selection of nightwear. The laundry I picked up for her yesterday, when we visited, won't be going back to the hospital - that will go straight to the home. I'll check on toiletries at the same time, and stock up on anything she needs on route to the home. And yep - I think you are right - a return visit to the hospital is probably inevitable, if not for laundry, then possibly (probably) to track down what I am sure will be an extensive list of missing items :rolleyes:

    I've sorted out some personal items to take, Amy, and everytime I bring washing home from the hospital, I've been checking that all the clothes are still clearly marked with her name (sometimes tags come off, or even laundry marker can fade) The personal items have been a bit of a worry, TBH - there were several things that I had earmarked to go to the home with her, but lately she has developed a habit of throwing things, it seems :eek: So, I have revised the list, and have tried to include items that are not too breakable and which would hopefully not cause serious injury if Mil decides to lob them at someone! Which means that a lot of framed photographs are currently on the 'don't take' list - I'm planning on putting them into a series of small, light albums, so she will still have them - but there won't be the worry of broken glass or injured others to worry as they won't be in frames!

    Thanks Lemony - you've actually put into words my concerns over the issues that may be caused by the shambolic approach that the hospital have had :( Despite the fact that at the last meeting we were told that the DST meeting would be organised straight away, as I've said, we found out last week from the SW that it hadn't been done - I do have notes that I requested from that meeting, where it says very clearly that Mil will be funded under 117 - though not sure how much use they will be:( I also wondered about there being yet another change of SW once she was discharged, and if this might cause problems. Not knowing how much good it would do, I've made it crystal to the hospital that if there are any delays or ****-ups due to them not having followed the procedures that they are supposed to, that I will be causing a ruckus - after last time, when they tried to discharge Mil without warning and without following procedure, they know that I will do that. I've been given the impression that there was some serious fall out for them over that, so I was hoping that this would mean that they would be very careful this time. And I think that they are being, because when we visited her last night (more on that later), one of the staff came to speak to us about what was happening - which makes a change from us having to chase them for info!

    Basically, Mil is not being discharged on Wednesday - she is being given 2 weeks (minimum) leave - same deal as when we tried to bring her home. This will allow her to take the placement at the home, yet remain as a patient at the hospital, giving them time to ensure that procedure is followed correctly. That means she retains the SW she has now, that the DST meeting will take place prior to discharge (its scheduled to take place actually on Wednesday morning) and it even means that if there are any issues, then a bed will be held for her on the ward. I am hoping that all this means that we won't encounter any issues with more delays, mess ups over funding or anything else. The only potential 'snag' I can see is that until the boxes are ticked to confirm 117 funding, she may be charged fee's - however, that's not based on anything that's been said to me or that I've read, its just me trying to anticipate what might happen. And to be honest, if its just a couple of weeks, its not a biggie to me or OH - she has the funds and if it ensures that she can take this place at the home we think is best for her, then it will be worth it. Priority has to be getting her settled somewhere safe and appropriate.

    I am also left wondering if part of the reason for the 'leave' rather than full discharge could be down to a deterioration in Mil's behaviour, after last night's visit. The staff who let us in went to take us through the last set of doors onto the ward, when we pointed out that we had youngest with us - because she is under 16, she isn't allowed to visit the ward and instead, when she comes with us to see her Nana we have to use a small room just outside that last set of doors. The staff looked a bit concerned and told us that Mil had been 'very agitated today' - OH I think took this to mean that they were worried that our visit might upset her more and was quick to tell her that if Mil seemed to be agitated by us being there, we would leave straight away. She didn't look particularly reassured by this, but opened up the small room and let us in to wait for Mil. Another staff brought Mil through to us - and tactfully, but quite strongly, reitterated what the first staff had said - that Mil had had a 'very bad day'. Mil was greeting us with big smiles, so though that struck us as a bit odd, we weren't particularly concerned. Until two minutes later, when another staff - one of the seniors this time - came in, primarily (we thought) to tell us about the plans for leave rather than discharge. But he then also handed me a personal alarm, and (not quite as tactful as the previous staff) made a point of emphasising that they had had a REALLY bad day with Mil, he mentioned 'verbal aggression', 'extreme agitation' and 'pretty bad swearing' and told us if there were any problems to 'press that red button' (on the alarm) and if there was an 'emergency' (!) to pull the cord on it and 'we will come running' :eek: He added that he felt that it was a good thing that she wasn't being discharged - 'just in case', which seemed to be a reference to whatever behaviour they had been dealing with from Mil during the day. We have visited with youngest lots of times, but previously, even when we have been told that Mil is agitated or had been having a 'bad day', we've never been given an alarm 'just in case' before!

    It was clear Mil wasn't at her best - every few minutes she would ask 'isn't it time we were going home now?' or 'Come - time we went home'. Over and over we gave her the story that she would be going home in a couple of days when she felt better - each time she would say something that indicated she accepted this and agree, only to ask again about home with her very next sentence. There was no aggression or nastiness (that we saw) but she was clearly getting more confused and anxious about leaving, so the visit didn't last long. When she stood up and said she was going to the toilet and then we 'WERE' going home, OH led her back to the ward and we left (without even a good bye :( ) as she was guided towards the loo. It just seemed the most sensible thing to do - especially as we were just a bit concerned about having been given an alarm, and we were wondering exactly what had been going on. The staff that saw us out reitterated that Mil had had a 'bad day', and said that she had been 'really swearing' - but she obviously had to get back to the ward, so there was no chance of getting her to elaborate.

    Mil is still on oral antibiotics, after the chest infection - the ward had told us it was a 'bit of an infection' and a 'mild infection, the SW told us that she had been told that Mil was very ill with pneumonia, we don't know yet which is more accurate! - and remembering how Mil nearly always had a bad reaction a few days into any course of AB's, I wondered how much of an impact they were having on her behaviour. But even if it is that, both OH and I found it really worrying that we were given that alarm - to us it suggested that the staff really expected Mil to potentially present a danger. With hindsight, we both wished that we had taken daughter straight out, but with staff not elaborating too much and the sheer unexpectedness of the situation, at the time, we just didn't think. The fact that the senior staff also said that the leave rather than discharge was a good idea because of her behaviour is concerning - was he implying that her behaviour was so bad that there were concerns that the home could mange/would keep her? We need to find out exactly what was going on to have the staff feeling that we neded to be provided with that alarm - that's on the list for the questions I'll be asking at the meetings on Wednesday!

    Hoping to do a zoo trip today - we haven't been even once this month, between work and the flu lurgy we've had - but depends on the weather. At the moment, its tipping down :( I really want to go today, not only for a chance to get some more shots of the baby otters, but because there are apparently two new litters of bush dog puppies that I am dying to see :)

    Wishing you all a peaceful and stress-free rest of the weekend xxxxx
  18. Onlyme

    Onlyme Registered User

    Apr 5, 2010
    Normally a case is prepared after the SW prepares paperwork, collects info etc and then that goes to panel for discussion. The panel only sit every so many weeks etc. Until they stamp the paperwork then 117 is not a cert. If the person is bed blocking, will be cheaper to fund out in the community or is very close to end of life they speed things up and it can be a few days/week. IIRC.

    To be honest I agree that your MIL is at real risk of a failed discharge. The panic alarm shows the hospitals grave concerns over their safety. I would hazard a guess that they only deal with your MIL in pairs to protect themselves. She must be on a watch to ensure safety of other patients. If this doesn't meet 117 then what the hell does?
  19. Slugsta

    Slugsta Registered User

    Evening all,

    Ann, Hurrah! for Busta-dog, it's great to hear that he is almost his usual self. I did laugh at your description of how he is reacting to his normal food :D

    I'm very glad that your IT issues are now sorted so that you can spend your work time actually working rather than faffing about with the comp.

    I'm even more glad that there is now a bed in the CH for MIL - although I do share your concerns about MIL's behaviour causing problems. I hope that the CH is still the best place for her, for everyone's sake. Fingers crossed that everything goes smoothly regarding the CH admission, transfer, funding etc.

    (Onlyme, thanks for pointing out potential problems, forewarned is forearmed etc.)

    It sounds as if Halloween is fun in your house, I'm glad that your daughter will be home again this year. Coincidentally, both of my Godsons (who don't even know each other) were born on 1st Nov. The youngest will be 23 this year, so I think he is a bit too old for a party - but his mum used to make a lot of effort when he was younger.

    JM, I'm so glad that your daughter is clearly improving, I do hope that she is soon back to normal.

    Grace, I do agree that your knee and back pain is possibly caused by your altered gait since the other knee op. It's certainly worth running this past your physio.

    Well done for standing firm against your out-laws. I suppose it's not realistic to dream up a bad attack of a nasty communicable disease so that they couldn't even think of MIL living with you?? :D

    Amy, I have everything crossed that the meeting goes as well as it possible can. How are you feeling now? You have been under a lot of pressure for a long time and that kind of thing really can take its toll. Please be kind to yourself - don't forget that you are only human!

    My Mum's shower is fixed - although she's not letting anyone help her use it at the moment. The washing machine was a different matter as it was deemed irreparable and a new one is due to be delivered tomorrow. We did wonder whether to bother as I do a lot of the washing. However, if she has no machine I will have to do it all, there will be no option for the carers to get dirty bedding sorted out on the days I don't visit. I'm a bit apprehensive that this would be considered a mis-use of her funds, as it is helping me as much as her. However, I will just have to hope that it is never called into question!

    The staff where Mum lives have spoken to their Housing Officer about Mum and the HO is asking that she be reassessed, she is not sure that the flat is still the best place for her. I'm not sure who I should approach about this - I don't think her GP is the right person but don't know whether the Memory Clinic would see her early if I asked them? After all, what can they do? The SW can be asked to do another needs assessment, which might give us another day at DC, but I don't know whether it will say whether or not she should be living where she is? Mum will not be self-funding and I can't see the LA wanting to find a CH yet, even if Mum is asked to leave where she is currently living!

    We had a good time in London, even though things didn't really work out as planned. TBH, one of the best things, for me, was knowing that I was 'off duty' for the weekend! I really don't know how you people cope who have this 24/7 with little/no respite!

    The play last night was excellent ( http://www.lovetheatre.com/tickets/...HGF2N-JWA3YERn7G6kad_TeLumeEhDNFoKxoCFFTw_wcB ) I'm not usually into slapstick, but they must have caught me in just the right mood as I laughed pretty much non-stop for the whole 2 hours :D If you get the chance to see this, do give it a go. I would also like to see 'The play that goes wrong' which is by the same company.

    I wondered how Sky would be when we got back, as this is the first time we have left her. As expected, she was a little more skittish when we first got home but she happily came for a cuddle, so I don't think we will see much of a 'relapse'.

    No aquagym for me tomorrow, Mum's washing machine is due for delivery between 7.45 and 9.45 and we need to do a bit of shopping too (we ran out of time on Friday). We have a couple of viewings tomorrow afternoon and I will see my friend in between.

    Sending ((( hugs ))) and ~~~vibes~~~ to all who need/want them.
  20. Ann Mac

    Ann Mac Registered User

    Oct 17, 2013
    Morning everyone,

    Thanks for all this info, Lemony - I didn't realise that 117 has to go to panal - that's something we haven't been told, and given the info that I've found on 117 funding, it isn't something that I thought would happen. I've looked over the bits of info I've found and saved and came across this

    "Section 117 states that aftercare services must be provided to patients who have been detained in hospital:

    For treatment under Section 3
    Under a hospital order pursuant to Section 37 (with or without a restriction order) or
    Following transfer from prison under Section 47 or 48.

    This also includes patients on authorised leave from hospital and patients who were previously detained under Section 3 but who stayed in hospital after discharge from section.

    It also includes people who are living in the community subject to a community treatment order and restricted patients who have been conditionally discharged"

    The bits that I've underlined apply to Mil (and having looked at this again, it seems that even her care whilst on leave from the hospital should be funded under the 117) and the impression I've been given by the hospital is that the funding is pretty much autmatic in Mil's circumstances - the SW says she must be present at a DST and that she may recommend that CHC is also awarded to Mil (which would have to go to panal as I understand it) but that either way, Mil's funding will be covered. Obviously, from the info you have given, I need to chase this up and verify that there are not going to be any handy (for them) and unexpected loopholes or tactics to allow them to change the goalposts last minute - awful that you have to spend so much time anticipating slippery, underhand actions and trying to work out how to deal in advance :( If worst comes to worst, Mil has the funds to pay for around 18 months or so (talking into account her private pension, as well as her 'savings') but its after that I am worried about. Yes the LA should step in at that point, but I know they tend to pay a lower rate - and if Mil is as difficult, even if only on some occasions, as the provision of that panic alarm suggested the other night, then I am worried that the home will feel that her needs are too demanding to be covered by that lower rate, will say 'Can't cope' and it may mean more upheaval for her.

    Even if the 117 turns out to be sorted quickly, the provision of that alarm when we visited has set other alarm bells ringing in my head. It just strikes me as a quite - I don't know, is ominous the right word? - thing for the hospital to do. And for the senior nurse to then very clearly imply that her behaviour was yet another good reason to go with giving her 'leave' rather than immediate discharge makes those bells ring louder. Is there some worry that even an EMI nursing home won't be able to cope with her behaviour at its worst? And if that is the case - what then? It hadn't occured to me that the home coping with Mil might be an issue - but this nurse seemed to be suggesting that it might be :(

    Slugsta, so glad you enjoyed your trip to London and that Sky coped so well with you being away :) I honestly wouldn't worry about spening your Mum's money on a washer - its a completely justifiable spend! When Mil lived here, she paid for the alterations to make our bathroom suitable for her needs and I queried it (repeatedly) on the grounds that part of the need for the alterations was to make things easier for me because of my back . I was assured, over and over, that it was still acceptable, because the end result was for Mil's benefit - it was better for her (at that point) that I should be able to provide assistance with her personal care, so with any expense that resulted from that, it was appropriste that she cover the costs. Same goes for your Mum buying a new washer - its to deal with her washing, its for her benefit - no one could argue that she shouldn't pay xxx

    When its come to reviews involving a 'change in needs' for Mil, her CPN seems to have been the best person for us to speak to, Slugsta. I know when Mil lived here and the question about whether or not the first DC she went to was still suitable arose, it was the CPN that we spoke to, and as she agreed, she was the person who found an alternative and completed all the paperwork needed for Mil to transfer to a secure DC. At meetings prior to us trying to bring Mil back home to us, her consultant, senior staff nurse and (again) the CPN all spoke and strongly recommended that Mil should not come back home but should go into residential care - now they agreed to us trying again, BUT it was very clear that had we agreed with them, then that's what would have happened at that point. If your Mum has a CPN I would ask them for a review based on the staff and HO's concerns, and failing that, I would contact the SW.

    Off to Manchester today, and as its a long day (won't be home till around 10 tonight), I only have to work a half day tomorrow, leaving us with tomorrow afternoon for OH and I to run to and from the home, sorting out Mil's new room. Wednesday I have all those meetings to attend and Mil will actually be moving (or at least, thats the plan) - its going to be one heck of a mad few days, and I'll update everyone when I can. Wish us luck - this feels so disorganised and 'last minute' that I think we will need it!

    Take care and have a good day, everyone xxxx

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.