Worried about losing home - Mums Care

[Snafs]

Hi Snafs

The best organisation I found for giving advice over property was Age UK. They have a tier system the first answering more general questions and the second tier answering more technical stuff. The second tier advisor was very clued up and gave me much more information than the CAB. I'm under 60 so wasn't sure they would speak to me, but they did as it involved mum who was 81 at the time. It might be worthwhile speaking to them.

Thanks for this.
I'm getting very mixed messages about CAB
Doctor told me to go to them first.
Someone at work told me to get in touch with them.
Some other people said they are not much good and only people who give a bit of advice and can't do anything. Not experts.
The today the council person telling me, yes CAB knows it all.

Leaving me really confused.
I will look at AGE UK thanks for the advice, seems to be getting complicated with starting talks soon with some, but no ONE actual person who's really here for me yet

 

[Snafs]

Is there a reason why there was not talk about your Mother returning home with a care package as that seems to be the norm nowadays from reading other stories on here?

This all seems to stem from the fact that the hospital have told social that mum is at danger of falling, I think they have told them that twice.
Quite how they know I don't know.
She's got an alarm, so she'd not been able to get up by herself for weeks now. So how do they know she might fall if someone comes running every single time she gets up and the alarm goes off?
Even today, I said to the social people. Do they wish me to show them mum walk, as mum could walk for them, holding the zimmer frame up in the air, but they said, no, we need to wait for the nurse to come get her. The nurse came, gave mum the frame and mum walked back with the frame without any demonstration of her abilities.

2 Weeks ago, mum told the 1st lady, she'd like to come home, but now, 2 weeks later I feel mum has got to know the staff more, and a few of the people in other beds, and she gets her dinners, so she's now changed to say, she would like to stay exactly where she is.

So you have mum NOT saying anymore that she really wants to come home, and the hospital telling social that mum is at danger at any time of falling (how they know that I don't know) hence why they are seeing a home with 24/7 care the place for her to end up.

Mum really does not wish to leave there, and she was getting a little annoyed with these two strangers telling her she can't stay.

She also was getting annoyed at the thought of the home at risk,

 

[Snafs]

The thing is the CAB can advise you and give you links to others who might be able to do so but they are not the ones who have the power to make a decision. I hope you can get an earlier appointment with someone who can help there so that you can see things more clearly.

Well that's not much use to me if that's true.
I have enough people now giving me links to things, and me trying to make phone calls to ask for help, but as yet, nothing. Seems like it's going to take months to actually make progress.
Unless I could get directly to those who I really need to speak with.

Perhaps if they find me in a pool of blood in my bedroom in the next few weeks FINALLY someone might take notice! That's the way it's feeling

 

[Snafs]

Hi Snafs
I can feel your anguish as I was in a similar place a couple of months ago.
The main difference that I can see is how "capable" your mother is and her current level of mobility. I am just offering some random thoughts to consider- approach social services and ask if they can provide a falls monitor- like a lifeline pendant but triggered if anyone falls. Is mum on the ground floor and if so can you relocate her to ground floor?

You also say your mother could go on for years- what stage do you feel she is at? In my own case Dad had got well into stage 7 before Social Services started making things really difficult, so Dad was falling every time he tried to get up , double incontinence etc and int he event he only lasted less than a month once admitted to nursing home.
If you are at home supporting mum it seems unreasonable to not let her return home with some care visits.
If you don't have POA, maybe it is still possible- I received an excellent piece of advice and the quote I remember was to "surround yourself by a group of sympathetic people" and it could still be an option for you (and avoid the nightmare court of protection scenario)
I also looked into live in care as alternatives so another thing to look into?

Wish I could do more to help.

It's just a very small 2 bedroom bungalow. No floors or stairs.
Mums not really any different now to how she was before her fall.
Honestly, if I had known where this was going I'd never have called 999.
I would have checked mum over, washed her hair, got her sorted out and nursed her back for a few weeks, and she'd be back to how she was.

Not sure what you mean by stages.
Mum can get up quite briskly in her chair and walk a distance without anything.
They are insisting she has the frame for safety, but she's no worse now than before.
She just really needs a stick to steady herself from time to time.
Live in care can't be done really, it's a tiny 2 bedroom bungalow with almost zero privacy.

I can see me never seeing mum again if this happens the way I'm scared it might.
I won't be able to live around here, too expensive, which would mean me trying to find a tiny place, probably hours away, and unemployed.

Seriously this will destroy my life, and hurt my mum also if she knows our long term family home has been stolen.

Home any work are my two safe places. I can't deal with other social surroundings (part of the reason why things are as they are)
I'm just no where on anyone's "Care Radar" yet at all. and I fear something really bad had to happen before anyone will take notice.

 

[Cat27]

@Snafs
You could always talk things over with the Samaritans while you’re so worried

CONTACT US NOW

CALL US

• 116 123 (UK)
• 116 123 (ROI)

Whatever you're going through, call us free any time, from any phone on 116 123.
We're here round the clock, 24 hours a day, 365 days a year. If you need a response immediately, it's best to call us on the phone. This number is FREE to call. You don't have to be suicidal to call us.

• EMAIL US
  jo@samaritans.org
  
  
• VISIT US
  Find your local Samaritans branch.
  
  
• WRITE TO US
  Freepost RSRB-KKBY-CYJK, PO Box 9090, STIRLING, FK8 2SA

https://www.samaritans.org/how-we-can-help-you/contact-us

 

[Amy in the US]

I think @Selinacroft is talking about stages of dementia. I am not sure of your mum's diagnosis, but given you are here on TP, I have been assuming she has some sort of dementia. Apologies if that is not correct.

I am sorry you are so upset and overwhelmed.

 

[Saffie]

Why would I say something that is not true when I was trying to help?
The CAB is comprised of mainly volunteers who will advise you of your rights and guide you.
Perhaps the attached will help.
http://www.thevillage.org.uk/whatisacab.htm

The only way you will know exactly where you stand as regards your mother’s house and payments for a care or nursing home is to have a financial assessment by your local authority. The CAB can advise you of a likely outcome and would probably act as an advocate on your behalf if they think it would help. This assessment will take place when a decision is made either by you or the Social workers that a home is the better option. The fact is that this cannot take months as you suggest it might because your mother cannot remain in hospital indefinitely and with no LPA in place, there is nothing to stop the social workers making the decision themselves if things are protracted as they have a duty of care towards your mother.

I am not trying to worry you but I think your state of mind isn’t being helped by all this churning around in it and once a decision is made I think you will feel a little bit better whatever the outcome.
Will the Social workers not agree to a trial period at home for your mother? From what you have said it seems that would be the option that would make you happier.

p.s. Once you decide or help your mother to decide you will be on the ‘care radar’. Until then things are at stalemate. I really hope can get an early appointment with the CAB if that is your choice or ring Age Concern. They might be the better option as the CAB advises on so many other matters apart from those affecting the elderly.

 

[MaNaAk]

Thank you so much, you gave me a little spark of hope with your words.

I have thought and hoped in my mind. Say I'd just moved back home a year or two ago, then I'd appreciate I would have little/no standing.

But I've prayed that, it being my home, my life and full of my possessions since the age of 7, then that should count for something.

It's been hard to know what to do until now, as, you never know with hospitals from one day to the next what they are going to tell you.
Before I knew, more care was going to be needed for mum, i'd already bought a new chair for her bedroom, bought a new TV for her bedroom, fitted up some lovely net curtains, and done some decorating for her return, which may now not happen.

Thank you for those links. I suppose my faith in not tearing the home I've only ever known, away from me, might have some meaning with someone in authority with a decent heart.

Dear Snafs,

At 53 I'm in the same position as you and a year ago I posted a thread called 'House'. Since then I've spoken to my local authority and they have said that they would negotiate with me and a social worker and I would not be out on the street. After all what purpose would that solve? I have a few plans in my head should dad need to go into a care ( he had another fall last night and is now at home with a fractured collar bone) in order to help pay for a care home when his finances run out.

Good luck Snafs I know what you are going through

MaNaAk

 

[MaNaAk]

I have no secrets, long story short, mums, never been "academic" her life has only been housewife, dolls house hobby, and the garden. When dad passed away, she really was not able to handle things that well, I'd always done DIY and projects around the home.

In answer to your question. No. Well, when your parents are both alive and you buy say wood for a shed, or a bathroom suite, you don't tend to think, I'll keep that receipt as I may need it in, 30 years time! It's simply not anything to ever consider.

I'm aware, dealing with mums banking/finances, just with her verbal agreement and the help of online banking, and getting my name added to some accounts like the gas bill and one joint bank account that is in both our names, is not exactly legally by the book.

But in my defense, when you are living with someone, and trying to do the right thing, and getting things running smoothly, it's not really something I felt was that important, as I was just making things better.

It's going to destroy me if my home gets sold. Mum will be devastated also, and yes I have had some "bad thoughts" I won't go into here, about such a worse case scenario.

How do I empty a home containing my life (which is still going - hopefully a few years left in me yet!)

I suppose I'm picturing the worst, going round and round in my mind.
Which is what I put my posting here tonight as I needed to let it out to someone, even if it's a forum of caring people here.

Their worry is mum is in danger of falling, they have a string and alarm on her to stop her getting up from her bed, as someone needs to be around her.
There is nothing terribly physically wrong from a medical viewpoint just old air and frailty, washing needs some assistance, toilet likewise some assistance, but she gets confused, does not remember instructions and in danger of another fall, which was the initial reason for her to end up in hospital in the 1st place.
So even with 3 or 4 home visits at home, she could in theory fall over 5 mins after they leave.
Which is why Residential Care, when there is someone always "around" has been hinted at.

But as I say, the forms were sent off today, with the nurses? assessments, and someone else is going to look at this decide what's best, then I'll be called in for a "Family Meeting" and then all the "issues" I'm worried about here are going to kick into action.

I should also say that if you go to your local CAB they can advice you and you can fill in the POA online. It's not as difficult as you think it is and when you want to get the signatures at the end to try get your neighbours to sign as witnesses (it's cheaper). Also don't let assessments scare you. After our assessment with the falls clinic and other assessments our house is now more secure and we also know that there is quite a lot of help out there. I try to look on everything that I have done for dad as a little achievement and I recommend that you look at some of my recent threads to help you feel better.

MaNaAk

 

[Snafs]

I think @Selinacroft is talking about stages of dementia. I am not sure of your mum's diagnosis, but given you are here on TP, I have been assuming she has some sort of dementia. Apologies if that is not correct.

I am sorry you are so upset and overwhelmed.

Well, I'm guessing she does have an element of dementia mostly that she does not very well retain brand new information.
Once it sinks in a bit over time, it will be there.
I don't know what the big fuss is, she's been this way for the past few years, she has had her same routine for the past few years, the fact she can't name the place she is in, or she thinking it's a care home and not a hospital or what town it's in, I don't see why that matters at all.
But they are marking her down on it.

 

[Snafs]

I should also say that if you go to your local CAB they can advice you and you can fill in the POA online. It's not as difficult as you think it is and when you want to get the signatures at the end to try get your neighbours to sign as witnesses (it's cheaper). Also don't let assessments scare you. After our assessment with the falls clinic and other assessments our house is now more secure and we also know that there is quite a lot of help out there. I try to look on everything that I have done for dad as a little achievement and I recommend that you look at some of my recent threads to help you feel better.

MaNaAk

I think POA could only potentially happen if she did come home, get settled, and THEN with assistance try and get thru it. And need someone to be ok she understands.

right now we are not on that page, and the American lady today from social, seemed pretty sure of herself that mum was not capable of deciding things for herself.

It was a route I was thinking was going to be an option a couple months ago when I was convinced she was coming home. I can't see them allowing this to be done now, after social's report.

 

[Snafs]

Dear Snafs,

At 53 I'm in the same position as you and a year ago I posted a thread called 'House'. Since then I've spoken to my local authority and they have said that they would negotiate with me and a social worker and I would not be out on the street. After all what purpose would that solve? I have a few plans in my head should dad need to go into a care ( he had another fall last night and is now at home with a fractured collar bone) in order to help pay for a care home when his finances run out.

Good luck Snafs I know what you are going through

MaNaAk

Sorry to hear about your problems past and now, and my best wishes for you dad.

Well yes, i guess part of me is still praying an angel who cares is going to swoop in at the last second and sweep me off the bridge before it crumbles into the sea and the crashing waves below.

The human in me still thinks "They won't really take my and mums family home away will they" but the other side of me thinks, this is all cold and done by the book.

With my wages, and some savings I know I can keep my little bungalow running, and also pay for some work to be done that's needed to be done for a few years.

If they take almost anything from me, I'm screwed. We've never had pots of money or old millionaire uncles die and leave us their fortune. We've always just "got by"

An idea I did have which I don't know is an option would be, basically nothing happens to me or the home, but they get the home upon my death. After all, I won't need it then, and have no family to leave it to. I don't even know if that's something they ever do.

I'm hoping someone soon is going to meet up with me, and see what I emotional wreck I am and how vunerable I am. All I ask is to be left along to live my life in my life long safe place, my home

 

[Snafs]

Why would I say something that is not true when I was trying to help?
The CAB is comprised of mainly volunteers who will advise you of your rights and guide you.
Perhaps the attached will help.
http://www.thevillage.org.uk/whatisacab.htm

The only way you will know exactly where you stand as regards your mother’s house and payments for a care or nursing home is to have a financial assessment by your local authority. The CAB can advise you of a likely outcome and would probably act as an advocate on your behalf if they think it would help. This assessment will take place when a decision is made either by you or the Social workers that a home is the better option. The fact is that this cannot take months as you suggest it might because your mother cannot remain in hospital indefinitely and with no LPA in place, there is nothing to stop the social workers making the decision themselves if things are protracted as they have a duty of care towards your mother.

I am not trying to worry you but I think your state of mind isn’t being helped by all this churning around in it and once a decision is made I think you will feel a little bit better whatever the outcome.
Will the Social workers not agree to a trial period at home for your mother? From what you have said it seems that would be the option that would make you happier.

p.s. Once you decide or help your mother to decide you will be on the ‘care radar’. Until then things are at stalemate. I really hope can get an early appointment with the CAB if that is your choice or ring Age Concern. They might be the better option as the CAB advises on so many other matters apart from those affecting the elderly.

Thanks for your lovely post.
Yes, I'm sure you are right. The financial assessment will be done.
I will then go into total panic mode as I know it's going to be bad.

I'm very much off the radar at the moment, hell I could be the milkman for all they seem to care about me right now.

I did just throw in the idea of me caring at home, and she looked at me, in a odd way and said, what, and getting up during the night?

It's odd that they seem to be making zero effort to get mum well again.
When I say well, I mean as well as she was before the drugs caused her to fall.

If everyone got their nose out of it, I got mum home for a couple of weeks, back into her routine I'm moderately still confident she's get back as she was.
Ok, she only flannel washed, and didn't do anything much, but she was ok.

I can't just do that now, as others have their eye on things.
It's still one of the options in my mind that I have not 100% ruled out.

Only difference is now, mums stopped saying she wants to come home, as she's "got comfy" where she is. If she'd been screaming today about coming home I'm sure the outcome would have been different.
Mum still thinks in her mind, staying there, means her son is not free, has the home and all is well with the world, she's not grasping the reality, as I'm sure she thinks no one has any right to touch the home. as it's ours (or hers)

 

[Snafs]

@Snafs
You could always talk things over with the Samaritans while you’re so worried

CONTACT US NOW

CALL US

• 116 123 (UK)
• 116 123 (ROI)

Whatever you're going through, call us free any time, from any phone on 116 123.
We're here round the clock, 24 hours a day, 365 days a year. If you need a response immediately, it's best to call us on the phone. This number is FREE to call. You don't have to be suicidal to call us.

• EMAIL US
  jo@samaritans.org
  
  
• VISIT US
  Find your local Samaritans branch.
  
  
• WRITE TO US
  Freepost RSRB-KKBY-CYJK, PO Box 9090, STIRLING, FK8 2SA

https://www.samaritans.org/how-we-can-help-you/contact-us

Thank you very much for that.
Perhaps I should consider a call to them.
If perhaps even they may be able to tell me what to do.

I have a phone meeting with the "Time to talk" people wednesday morning, but again I don't know if they are actually (no offence) useful in any official way or just smile, listen and sympathize.

This is the problem I also find at work, and I don't know why it is.
No one seems to take any notice of me, until something bad happens.
I think it's cos I bottle up emotion (men don't show emotion and should not cry) so it only ever comes out when I'm at breaking point.

 

[Snafs]

I thought I may you all smile a bit, by taking a photo of my blazer I still have in my wardrobe from when I was 7 or 8 and came to this home and my new junior school.

Still has my name inside written by mum on the sewn in label

Happy Times.

 

[Theresalwaystomorrow]

Dear Snafs
Iv been keeping up with your post and I am so angry, really angry!
I want to scream from the roof tops regarding this self funding unfair rule!!
It needs to be challenged ! It’s an old daylight robbery rule!

If you lived in a council property in this situ your mum would be funded and your home would be safe. How unfair is that ?
My advice Would be to get a good solicitor to me that’s where your money will be best spent, 50yrs in this house with your mum and you feel threatened like this is cruel!
Wills should also be taken into consideration, they should state if they wish it to go to family or on their care? It’s their well earned money after all. That would be interesting wouldn’t it?
Iv said before and say it again someone needs to challenge this, get your MP involved and a good solicitor .
The government is already saving thousands on you by putting your pension age to 67yrs !
I’m with you all the way and wonder what the outcome would be if your MP & solicitor between them refused to pay ?

 

[Selinacroft]

It's amazing what you keep isn't it when you live at home forever. I'm getting round to decluttering-eventualy and who knows what I will dig up.
I think given your mum's level of ability, your best bet would be to encourage social services to allow mum home but with home carers attending 3 or 4 times a day so they can support you both. Has this option been discussed- I can imagine it would be the cheaper option if SS are paying (house diregarded in assessment for domicilary care) .
From my own experience , I shot myself in the foot by telling SS that no one was going to get their hands on my house and I think the delightful woman got the hump and started reciting the riot act at me. I realise how hard it is but try and impress on SS that it is your mother's welfare at the centre of your concerns and not your family home and own circumstances.
Is there any reason why they feel home care would not be sufficient?

 

[Snafs]

It's amazing what you keep isn't it when you live at home forever. I'm getting round to decluttering-eventualy and who knows what I will dig up.
I think given your mum's level of ability, your best bet would be to encourage social services to allow mum home but with home carers attending 3 or 4 times a day so they can support you both. Has this option been discussed- I can imagine it would be the cheaper option if SS are paying (house diregarded in assessment for domicilary care) .
From my own experience , I shot myself in the foot by telling SS that no one was going to get their hands on my house and I think the delightful woman got the hump and started reciting the riot act at me. I realise how hard it is but try and impress on SS that it is your mother's welfare at the centre of your concerns and not your family home and own circumstances.
Is there any reason why they feel home care would not be sufficient?

Yes, because they have in their mind mum is at danger of falling at any second, and ever 4 visits a day, would not cover that eventuality. And of course, we'd still have to find perhaps, £500 a week to pay for 4 visits over 5 week days, but I'm guessing there.

If it were not for the falls aspect I suspect she'd be home now
They have it in their mind she's going to fall any second.
She fell at home whilst under the side effects of medication.
She had 3 small falls at the 1st hospital, when she was still poorly and getting over the medication.
She's vastly improved now since then, but the second she got to this second hospital they strapped an alarm to her, as they were told (the notes that came with her) she was at risk of falling, and as far as I've seen, their just covering their asses, as if she does fall, given this warning, they will be liable I guess.
I will agree she needs a stick, for sure, for security and to steady herself, but she can walk with carrying a zimmer frame (with me there just in case) and I've never needed to step in to catch her.

If she put her mind to it, she can walk totally unaided for a certain distance, though of course, I'd want her to have a stick for security.
She's has a stick for a few years before she went it, and sometimes used to walk between rooms at home forgetting she'd not go the stick.

If I'm brutally honest, I am almost of the opinion we could go back to how things were, she can walk from room to room, and use the flannel. I'd need to check out the changing the underwear, but if I'm honest after some testing at home I'd right now probably feel confident she's be ok even alone as things used to be whilst I was at work.

If social did not have their noses stuck in, and deciding she does not know what's best I'm be tempted to try it

And yes, I know what you mean.
It's all about My Mother, and if I dare to mention "me" I'm almost looked upon as an uncaring daemon who's only thought it for himself.
Hell even mum was betting beyond angry when I told her, there were home issues to deal with.
In her mind it's her home (which is it) and she's handing it over to me and that's final. No one can over ride those wishes she has.

 

[Snafs]

Dear Snafs
Iv been keeping up with your post and I am so angry, really angry!
I want to scream from the roof tops regarding this self funding unfair rule!!
It needs to be challenged ! It’s an old daylight robbery rule!

If you lived in a council property in this situ your mum would be funded and your home would be safe. How unfair is that ?
My advice Would be to get a good solicitor to me that’s where your money will be best spent, 50yrs in this house with your mum and you feel threatened like this is cruel!
Wills should also be taken into consideration, they should state if they wish it to go to family or on their care? It’s their well earned money after all. That would be interesting wouldn’t it?
Iv said before and say it again someone needs to challenge this, get your MP involved and a good solicitor .
The government is already saving thousands on you by putting your pension age to 67yrs !
I’m with you all the way and wonder what the outcome would be if your MP & solicitor between them refused to pay ?

Thanks for the support.
Yes, it seems like you get punished for doing the right thing.
My parents both worked till I was born, my mum gave up work for I think the 1st few years (can't recall obviously) but she was back part time from the age I 1st went to school at 5, until she retired at 60.
My father struggled to pay the mortgage for his entire life, No fancy cars or fancy holidays.
His best car was only ever a 2nd hand fiesta he bought after retiring.
I think they only ever went abroad twice for a week on a package holiday.
He literally spend his entire life paying off the mortgage.
Dads will left everything to mum.
Mums will leaves everything to me.
Simple and cut and dried.
Dad passed away 18 years ago at the age of 70 from prostate cancer. And was happy mum and me were doing ok, and told mum that I'd be there for her, as I have been.

Now 18 years later, mum naturally wants and expects the same for her son (me)

If say I was 35. I'd sold my own home, moved back in with mum for the past few years then hell yeah, I'd fully expect I would probably be overlooked as I could go back to how I was before I temporary went back to mum.
But given I'm 56 (3.5 years short of the magic number) And lived here my entire life, helping dad out with projects, working on the home myself and adding bits here and there (no receipts of course or proof of this) and been looking after mum more for the last 18 years since her husband died (my dad) Hell you'd think that would count for something.

I'm still hoping it does. But as I keep saying I need to explain everything to the right person.
Depending on my chat with people in the next few days I think I'm going to have to draft a long letter and do as has been suggested tonight,

 

[Selinacroft]

Hi
I think if your mum has more than 23250 in the bank she would be fully self funding for domiciallary care but any less than that I believe there is a sliding scale of contributions she would need to make.
I sincerely hope that you can get her home . You may find like me that one day she may need full time care but hopefully only at the very end and not for months or years on end. I would look into making things as safe as possible for her in the eyes of SS and perhaps try to hold back on the "what about me?" line as it seems to be like a red rag to a bull for Social services. If mum would be self funding , make some enquiries with agencies and show willing to pay the bill and organise it so they have less need to step in and throw their weight around.