Why do we have siblings who won't help?

[Palerider]

I will have to have a long discussion about altruism with you one day @Palerider

Is this why women are attracted to firefighters? (Or is it the uniform...?)

I'll dust off my books in preparation.😁

 

[MaNaAk]

I'll dust off my books in preparation.😁

When I was studying in Chichester there was a local army barracks and when my friends came to visit they were very interested in this fact😁!

MaNaAk

PS: Sorry for diverting.

 

[Muttimuggle]

I sympathise with you a lot. I'm one of four children, or I was. My younger sister died in 2015, but she, me and my mum were very close, and I know she would've had no problems helping me out with Mum's alzheimers.

I also have two older brothers - there's a bit of an age gap between my brothers and me (we're all full blooded siblings). My eldest brother is out of the picture - his choice. He's been difficult to deal with for decades and I believe is quite toxic. He (like the poster's brother) is well off, kids at boarding school etc. But he just doesn't want to know - there's been no communication or gifts for close to ten years now, I thought my sister's death might have given him some common decency towards our mum, but no. He's a choatic person who gas-lights people (especially me) when he's around so frankly, I don't mind not seeing him. However in the last year or so he's been in contact with my brother and knows about mum. He's been sniffing around asking questions about mum's will, power of attourney. Him and his wife are very money orientated so I have to wonder...

My older brother is completely different. He helps out a *lot*, calls me daily etc but he lives almost an hour away from me, and I was mum's live in carer until she was sectioned (she has just been released and will go into a nursing home that has a space for her when she's recovered from her pneuomnia). I think until you're in the situation of being someone's offical or unoffical carer, it's very difficult to explain and even imagine. I can tell him about mum not eating, or being up all night - and worries about delussions and half a billion things but it's not the same as living.

My mum's currently in hospital having been sectioned two months ago but thank GOD she's finally been accepted by a nursing home - problem is she's managed to get pneumonia! I thought when she went into hospital it would be a break, and it has been, but there is so much work still - constant phone calls, health updates, finding nursing homes, not to mention fixing the house because she and my stepdad let it fall apart - and it wasn't until mum was in hospital that I noticed now bad the house had got. But that's all on my shoulders. My stepdad can't help (and wouldn't if he could) due to his own mobility and memory problems.

I'm lucky I have support from my brother but it still feels very lonely and exhausting because I'm the one everyone has to talk to - I lived with her, I know her symtoms. So I get the calls about her latest fall, or virus. I'm also a bit hampered because I can't drive (blaiming my dyspraxia and ADHD on that!)

So there's stuff he doesn't fully understand about the daily grind of caring, how mentally and physically exhausting it is. He also is keen for people to get on - including my eldest brother. He's not naive about my eldest brother's bad - and frankly toxic behaviour, but he worries I'll regret it. Unlikely. I have no desire to 'get on' with my eldest brother. For years I looked up to him before he decided our family was 'too stressful' - this from a man who reguarly threatened to kill himself due to his depression, 'functioning' alcholism and mental health issues.

I don't think there was really any discussion about me becoming mum's carer. I was living at home - always have - due to mum's mental health (long/chronic depression) and physical (cancer). I think it's almost envitable one sibling ends up the primary carer, even if all the siblings are very involved in their parents care.

I'm kind of glad my eldest brother isn't involved, because he's a self proclaimed expert on everything and if there is something he doesn't know either his wife or MIL are experts. Except on human decency and compassion. Your questions are interesting and very thought provoking.

I think a lot depends on the family structure, parent, relationships etc. Odds are any sibling that's a jerk as a kid may be the same as an adult. Yes people can mature and can change but only if they are willing to. I think to an extent (and I hate to say this) it starts with parents. At least to a degree.

Yes there are a *lot* of things at play: genetics, brain chemistry, age order, parents history/mental health/state of marriage, environment, mental health, culture...I could go on and on. But If a parent makes excuses and justifications for someone being **** - odds are they'll continue. I think it partly is to do with gender (please don't hate me for this) but most of the women I know end up caring for relations/friends/neighbors because it's expected. Women are considered care-givers, nurturers, reguardless if that's what they want. I just want to add I do know plenty of amazing men who are devoted carers too, but I think a lot of things sort of fall into women's laps because of assumptions of gender.

When one sibling picks up most of the slack it can allow other siblings to take a step back. They know mum/dad is being cared for, so they don't need to worry. For some it's out of sight, out of mind, they might be caring but unaware of the realities. One thing that's always puzzled me and actually angered me, was when I ended up caring for mum full time, I read a lot as I love researching and I kept coming back to how 'rewarding' caring was. To be honest, I never saw that, never felt it. I did it because I love my mum. We have always been close. I do it because I need to. Because it's expected of me. Because I live here and I can't ignore stuff.

One other issue could be - and I'm not excusing absentee siblings - but their perception of relationships. I don't mean in cases where there is abuse/neglect/bullying - because I think we can all understand a sibling not wanting to get involved if that was the case, but how they view relationships - both past and present.

For example, my eldest brother has a 'narrative' about his childhood, his relationship to mum, to us that is vastly different from what he remembers. He uses this narrative to justify cutting ties. I was a 'rainbow' baby - my mum lost a boy two years prior to me and had miscarriages so my brother thinks I was favored and spoiled. Maybe I was. But I was always the one to look after mum physically and emotionally from when I was quite young.

Does the sibling believe one was favored over the other etc. Perception is key, in interpersonal relationships and how we think about ourselves within a relationship. I think your relationship with your sibling(s) growing up can often set the tone for the future - especially disputes and how they were handled. Was a parent more leanient to one child consciously or sub-consciously etc. Was someone the 'baby', does gender play a factor, is there a culture/socialial pressures involved in caring etc. There are so many things at play.

Some people just can't and won't see it as 'their' responsibility. They get away with it because other people pick up the slack. Siblings - myself included tend to revert back to our childhood patterns of how we deal with siblings. Me, I hate conflict, would avoid it no matter how unhappy someone - including sibling behavoiour made me. I was a homebody, an introvert and never had Grand Plans etc so I think that set the tone -I stayed home and gradually ended up caring for my mum for over the past decade. My sister's death shattered a lot of assumptions I had about my family, my life and my eldest brother - that's when I lost faith in him. Not for myself, but that he still wouldn't talk to mum or bring his kids to see her. My sister was my best friend - but growing up when kind of hated each other. But we always had a clear sense of working together to look after mum.

I think our personalities as children do inform us as adults too. My elder brother he's always been chilled, kind and supportive - and that's how he's largely remained. My eldest brother was a born aggitator - he craved attension and conflict. He was a nightmare child (apprantly) and constantly in trouble. He's changed somewhat - he's become very right wing - but when it comes to our relationships - there's still that spark, he loves to play mind games, gas light - that's never gone.

Sorry for the long rambling post, it was a very interesting post and I'm curious what other poeple think. I do sympathize a lot with you over your brother and I completely understand your frustration that your mum enables and excuses his behaviour. I can't tell you know many people I know who have the same issue.

Weirdly my stepbrother is similar to your brother - so I'm not close to my stepdad - he's not a warm person and has been deceptive (and is) about finances. But because he lives with me I end up looking after him to a degree. His daughter is a bit involved but they have a bit of a distant relationship (he never rings his daughter). Now his son is the golden child - however he never calls about my stepdad, offers any help. He lives some distance away but is comfortably off, his wife doesn't work, they have one child who's almost a teen. I think because I'm here there's an assumption I'll sort things out. That's a nice theory but until recently I was mum's full time carer - I just didn't have time.

I think assumption is another key element. People assume that someone else will help. THat's what their sibling is there for (I imagine that's the case with your brother perhaps?) That they are closer (logistically or emotionally), that they aren't needed - or frankly they don't want the hastle. They justify that they have enough going on in their life. Some people jsut don't care, they will put their parent somewhere and forget. They don't feel they 'owe' their parent or siblings anything - especially if they'd never been made to take responsibility or they are just let off. It's always someone else's job because usually someone else (ie one of us) will take responsibility out of love, duty, responsibility, guilt, necessity, compassion, and a whole range of things.

Guilt's another primal motivator (big guiltor here!) if I *don't* do things, I feel horribly guilty. I know quite a few siblings who will pray on that too in a very unfair way - or ones that will pass judgement on your 'caring' but won't lift a finger to help and often we allow it. we don't tell the hospitals, care homes, social workers etc to our sibling because it's easier to do it ourselves, we are conditioned that it's our duty and responsibility. I sometimes wonder what would happen if we made neglectful siblings involved - obviously not talking about the amazing, supportive ones!

I just wanted to say that much of what you say is "spot on". and makes me feel less alone. And when you say this -

"I think a lot depends on the family structure, parent, relationships etc. Odds are any sibling that's a jerk as a kid may be the same as an adult. Yes people can mature and can change but only if they are willing to. I think to an extent (and I hate to say this) it starts with parents. At least to a degree."

...I thank you for your bravery in speaking this truth. No parent is perfect(and neither is any carer!) and some are unable to see what they are doing when they bring up a child a certain way and how the dynamics within the household are affecting the children. Sometimes I still find myself trying to show my mother the inadequacies of my sibling and how his actions and words, or lack of them have affected myself and so, indirectly, my mother. She understands some of it and in one way seems to agree but then also has this way of excusing this brother for everything, even those things which affect her. She will say he can't come to see her because "He's got 3 houses" or "He doesn't understand because he's got no children" or "I think his wife has got a lot to do with it" or just "He is alright with me!" The thing is - I get nowhere and don't really go in to see her intending to have these discussions. I think it is my frustration and tiredness talking - and the overwhelm at clearing her large house alone and never having a text replied to by this brother....and ultimately wishing that the mother who had a role in raising this sibling could understand how I I felt and how he is and was has hurt me. But really - it is too late now - I have to just do the right thing and get on with it.

 

[Duggies-girl]

I am most of the time rendered utterly lost for words on how my brother and his kin have behaved over the last several years, it also breaks my heart the child that was given the most has no incentive to even acknowledge his mother anymore and it will be a long time before I can find it in my soul to forgive the behaviour, if ever at all.

@Palerider I could not have said it better myself, you have described my brother and his wife perfectly.

I find it very hard to understand that the child who was given everything could behave so selfishly when the parent who gave him so much needed just a bit of help and a bit of time.

 

[Palerider]

@Palerider I could not have said it better myself, you have described my brother and his wife perfectly.

I find it very hard to understand that the child who was given everything could behave so selfishly when the parent who gave him so much needed just a bit of help and a bit of time.

Yup I don't have anymore words to add😞

 

[canary]

find it very hard to understand that the child who was given everything could behave so selfishly when the parent who gave him so much needed just a bit of help and a bit of time.

I suspect its because the "special" child feels entitled to being "let off duties"

 

[ScaredyCat]

Watching someone with alzheimers deteriorate and having the courage to even manage a couple of hours with them is just too much for some.
I'm not offering any excuses; I have no contact with my sister for far more serious reasons than this but I know this is why she acts the way she does. And I can't forgive her for it. I feel the same but someone has to be brave for mum.

 

[Muttimuggle]

I can't go into too much detail here but I looked after mum for over10 years, first with mild cognitive impairment followed by a diagnosis of Alzheimers. A few years ago, I just could no longer cope and felt that mum needed full time care, both for her own sake and for mine. By this time she could often not find the toilet in a house she had been living for decades and was having accidents and was leaving the house to mention just a few things. It was only down to very good neighbours that she didn't get very far. Yet according to my sister, you'd think that I had commited some heinous crime by saying I could no longer cope, I've been accused of all kinds of dreadful things that are not true. She didn't seem to get it that it was not a cas of me not wanting to look after mum, I simply couldn't. My sister does have a track record of upsetting people to the point that they don't want anything to do with her. I'm convinced that had I gone on any longer, I would have ended up in hospital myself.

That all sounds so tough and really resonates with me....even some of those finer details. I am so glad you did the right thing for both yourself and your mother. I wish you wellness now - the sort of wellness wish you could not expect from that sister. ...as I know how that feels too.

 

[CAL Y]

Thanks @Muttimuggle. I would always say that if someone has been caring for someone and reaches a stage where they feel they can no longer do it, they should never be judged harshly for it. Everyone has been lovely except for my sister who has accused me of being the most selfish man she has ever met. We all have our limits. I think a lot of this is that she doesn't want to loose her inheritance. I reached the stage where I just didn't care about that anymore.

@Rob-E. Oh yes. Many people on here have been there. Invisibles playing the selfish card. They don’t want ‘Their’ money spending on fripperies like decent care for their relative.
Take no notice. We all know who who is being selfish here. It make me fume.😡

 

[Muttimuggle]

@Rob-E. Oh yes. Many people on here have been there. Invisibles playing the selfish card. They don’t want ‘Their’ money spending on fripperies like decent care for their relative.
Take no notice. We all know who who is being selfish here. It make me fume.😡

Yes, but they don't deserve our fuming - I keep trying to tell myself that more often, of late. Why should I let him have my anger too?

 

[CAL Y]

Yes, but they don't deserve our fuming - I keep trying to tell myself that more often, of late. Why should I let him have my anger too?

@Muttimuggle . You’re right of course but it’s very hard not to want to retaliate.
Fortunately, if that’s the right word, that all ended for me when my husband died a year ago.
Its just a shame that it had to cause an irretrievable breakdown with the persons involved but my mind is at peace, I sometimes wonder if they have that .

 

[Muttimuggle]

@Muttimuggle . You’re right of course but it’s very hard not to want to retaliate.
Fortunately, if that’s the right word, that all ended for me when my husband died a year ago.
Its just a shame that it had to cause an irretrievable breakdown with the persons involved but my mind is at peace, I sometimes wonder if they have that .

I am so sorry to hear about your husband and if yours was a love match it must make those unkind words and actions of other relatives even more painful. I have had a bit of a turbulent relationship with my mother, now with dementia, but I just had to bury all that and get on with it, despite the criticism, despite the unkind words. Someone had to do what was necessary an I am not inhuman.

 

[CAL Y]

I am so sorry to hear about your husband and if yours was a love match it must make those unkind words and actions of other relatives even more painful. I have had a bit of a turbulent relationship with my mother, now with dementia, but I just had to bury all that and get on with it, despite the criticism, despite the unkind words. Someone had to do what was necessary an I am not inhuman.

@Muttimuggle . Thank you. It was very much a love match and we were lucky to meet not long after my first husband died. I was only 40 at the time and didn’t believe it was possible to have more than 1 love of your life But 30 years together disproved that.
The problem relatives were his daughters who let him down very badly, didn’t support us and refused to believe that his condition was that bad. Host Mode.
Im certain that you are not inhuman, you wouldn’t be on this page if that were the case.
Its a rotten job but as you say someone has to do it. Wish you strength. Hugs.x

 

[mojogirl]

@Muttimuggle . You’re right of course but it’s very hard not to want to retaliate.
Fortunately, if that’s the right word, that all ended for me when my husband died a year ago.
Its just a shame that it had to cause an irretrievable breakdown with the persons involved but my mind is at peace, I sometimes wonder if they have that .

Whats really devastating is when your 2 daughters one distant in kms..but the other a 20 min drive.. both detached from me during this crisis... ...leaving me with no family emotional support....I know they are grieving too....and i try to see it that way...but bloody hell??? anyone else out there dealt with that????

I lost my husband Aug. 18th 22

 

[CAL Y]

Whats really devastating is when your 2 daughters one distant in kms..but the other a 20 min drive.. both detached from me during this crisis... ...leaving me with no family emotional support....I know they are grieving too....and i try to see it that way...but bloody hell??? anyone else out there dealt with that????

I lost my husband Aug. 18th 22

@mojogirl . What you are talking about is almost the same as my story only in this case they were my husbands daughters and both lived a 15 minute drive away.
It was sad because I had a good relationship with them up until then.
I wasn’t the wicked stepmother.
They came to see him 3 times in his last 6 months.
My closest family, sister and BIL live 300 miles away but still came to stay and help for a week in every month.

My condolences on the loss of your husband.

 

[Toopie28]

Ah my brother... the favourite son. Mama smiles so broadly when he calls... which is the extent of it (1 min, every second day driving back from work).

Now mind, he does his "duty" by coming over every 2 months for 2 days which then takes weeks to undo (he gets her out of her routine and thinks she's just old and losing it - his words).

Why don't you pop over for Xmas brother since this may well be the last one that she will remember us...
oh, flights too expensive and she'll forget anyway so what's the point (his words)

Gotten used to doing this alone now. It is what it is.

 

[Duggies-girl]

Ah my brother... the favourite son. Mama smiles so broadly when he calls... which is the extent of it (1 min, every second day driving back from work).

Now mind, he does his "duty" by coming over every 2 months for 2 days which then takes weeks to undo (he gets her out of her routine and thinks she's just old and losing it - his words).

Why don't you pop over for Xmas brother since this may well be the last one that she will remember us...
oh, flights too expensive and she'll forget anyway so what's the point (his words)

Gotten used to doing this alone now. It is what it is.

1 minute every couple of weeks. My parents called him 'the minute man' because he could never stay for more than a minute, he was always on his way somewhere else. Sad thing was he only lived a five minute walk from their house. Yes I am resentful of this, he could have done so much more at little cost to himself.

 

[Dutchman]

1 minute every couple of weeks. My parents called him 'the minute man' because he could never stay for more than a minute, he was always on his way somewhere else. Sad thing was he only lived a five minute walk from their house. Yes I am resentful of this, he could have done so much more at little cost to himself.

Hi there @Duggies-girl. There is no reasonable answer to this all too common problem. Either they want to stay / visit longer, make an effort, take some responsibility and help or they don’t. I’m afraid at that level of non commitment there’s nothing you can do.

Personally I think it’s a lack of care, basic human empathy and being completely selfish. How this has arisen it’s only you that would have a clue.

You either make a fuss and confront him or don’t waste your time

 

[Duggies-girl]

Hi there @Duggies-girl. There is no reasonable answer to this all too common problem. Either they want to stay / visit longer, make an effort, take some responsibility and help or they don’t. I’m afraid at that level of non commitment there’s nothing you can do.

Personally I think it’s a lack of care, basic human empathy and being completely selfish. How this has arisen it’s only you that would have a clue.

You either make a fuss and confront him or don’t waste your time

It's all finished with now. Dad died February 2020 and I am glad that I looked after him.

As for the 'minute man' I don't waste my time there, haven't seen him for a long time now.

 

[mojogirl]

@mojogirl . What you are talking about is almost the same as my story only in this case they were my husbands daughters and both lived a 15 minute drive away.
It was sad because I had a good relationship with them up until then.
I wasn’t the wicked stepmother.
They came to see him 3 times in his last 6 months.
My closest family, sister and BIL live 300 miles away but still came to stay and help for a week in every month.

My condolences on the loss of your husband.

cal y: thankyou...yes its so so hard to understand...we are really alone in all this...i also had a good relationship with my girls....they just couldn't handle it...so decided to check out...an awful lot had to do with so many lockdowns...my husband never made it to a nursing home...so was in the hospital from Nov 21 til he passed Aug. 18/22..then he got the Covid...and that finally took him out...in a way it was more merciful as i see it...because if he lived...he wouldn't be able to eat because he could no longer swallow...he was confined to a wheel chair as his mobility was basically gone...i am one for dementia patients being allowed to die in the late stages...instead of doing everything to delay the inevitable...i know thats a hard concept for many...but personally i think its more inhumane to have them physically alive when they are in such pain...absolutely no quality of life...and also the emotional devestation to the family...just my 2 cents...i am happy that you did get some support...