The very very Early Signs which are very hard to detect

justwilliam

Registered User
Jan 24, 2011
76
0
First signS for my mum: four years ago I was in hospital but within a day or two of coming out she showed little interest in my health. Then a few weeks later she temporarily misnamed a friend. little things like that rang the alarm bells. After that it was easy to spot the signs of a previously excellent short term memory being lost.
 

HayleyMH

Registered User
Dec 29, 2011
5
0
My thoughts and experience of AD within my family and work show the range of biopsychosocial factors involved in real people often mean early signs of memory changes are lost or the lessor issue as with my Father. This at times is very true but many families I speak with on reflection were aware of the "changes" but feel how would highlighting this early help?

I feel it's fully dependant on the individual, if they r able willing and supported to get early diagnosis do so, but as with my dad the depression drinking vulnerability is what we have to deal with first, and sadly this is detaching with love and at times being selfish and re charging until the next wander at night or fall x
 

Delphie

Registered User
Dec 14, 2011
1,268
0
I wonder if anyone can make sense of this.

Mum started being a little odd about 20 years ago (she would've been about 55 at the time). It was more than a little odd actually. It became very difficult to make an arrangement with her because 50% of the time or more she'd forget, and then there'd be lots of times when she'd be expecting something when nothing had been arranged. She could never be prompted to remember what really happened and always got very cross when we insisted. In the end we got her a wall callendar and wrote arrangements on that, but even that wasn't enough because when she forgot she'd say that we wrote on it after the event. We then got her to write arrangements on it herself and that helped because her writing is very distinctive but it was clear that when there was this kind of a problem and we took her to the calendar to check, she was very confused to see her own handwriting confirming something she had no memory of arranging. 20 years on, she says that someone broke into her house and wrote it down in her writing, but back then she was simply puzzled and would back off from being furious with us.

There were also a few accusations of theft. They were very specific and odd, such as that my husband had stolen a clock from the attic, when he had no opportunity at all to get into the attic without anyone noticing and none of us knew that such and such a clock was there, or that I'd stolen a diamond and ruby ring that she'd hidden inside a soap which was in a shoebox in the garden shed, when I never ever knew she'd had a ring like that or that bars of soap in shoeboxes in sheds were are good place to hide things! It was all very weird, but there was no changing her mind about any of the details (I most definitely hadn't stolen the clock for example, and my husband hadn't stolen the ring).

All the above started happening at roughly the same time and was worrying enough for me to see her GP. He was lovely and listened to me crying my eyes out and said that it sounded like it might be early onset dementia but that she'd have to come to the surgery for him to be more certain. There was no question of that happening.

And then things stayed the same for about 20 years, until about 2 or 3 years ago when it became clear to us that she really was quite ill. We now finally have a diagnosis of Alzheimer's.

Were all those things 20 years ago the start of it? I know it's a very individual disease but I've never heard or read anything close to that.
 

witchpig

Registered User
Dec 31, 2011
270
0
Maidstone Kent
Thank you

Thank you for letting me know im not alone with having to deal with this "problem". My mum is the problem, she has been going what the granchildren have called funny for a couple of years. She would be talking to you nicely one minute then totally change the next even becoming violent. The memory lose is the hardest to deal with, only the other day she said that she had to get my dads tea ready for when he gets home from work. Hes been dead nearly 12 years but nothing i said could convince her he wasnt coming home that night.
2 yrs ago i managed to get her to see the gp as alot of other things where happening. The long and short of it is she been diagnosed depressed and borderline dementia. Antidpressants have been given to her but she wont take them any more as she thinks that she is better.
I have just spent a very uncomfortable week after being accussed of stealing a christening gown that has been in the family for years. Mum has even got the police involved as she swears that i stole the gown while she was away at christmas. I have grown used to be being blamed for stealing things but this time it is worse. Hopefully now the police are involved we might actually get some help for her, as it will be a "third" party reporting what has happened.
Thank you for being there when i need to rant and rave. It was the police that suggested your website. Thank you for i now know im not alone.
 

Jancis

Registered User
Jun 30, 2010
2,567
0
70
Hampshire
Thank you for being there when i need to rant and rave. It was the police that suggested your website. Thank you for i now know im not alone.

Hello and welcome witchpig. I am sorry you have had to find this forum for support but hope you will find lots of it here as I have - you'll never be alone if you log in whenever you feel the need. I just wanted to say I am very impressed that the police in your area are so well informed and understood your anxieties and were able to direct you here. It gives me great hope for the future.

Don't hesitate to start your own thread by the way.

Best wishes Jancis x
 

witchpig

Registered User
Dec 31, 2011
270
0
Maidstone Kent
I have come to the conclusion that when mum blames me for things it isnt her talking its her illness. I know that things will get worse but now i know im not alone, which is something that can be worse than getting that final diagnosis.
 

Redver

Registered User
Jan 1, 2012
16
0
First Signs

Your story sounds so much like mine, I did begin to notice the signs but when I took my mum along to the GP she responded well to the questions. My mum also refused to go along to the Memory Clinic. That was 8 months ago She has just been admitted to hospital after being found wandering in the early hours. The consultant tells us she may have had it for at least 2 years. We also think she may have been giving her money away.
Other signs
Not being able to use the remote
Not throwing away rubbish
Putting waste food down the toilet
Unexplained grazes or bruises
Losing money/purse
Saying I'm going on a message ( think she was meeting up with someone to give money to)
Repeating same story
Forgetting to eat
Food going to waste
Buying duplicate foods/household good eg shampoo
Wearing stained clothing
Not cleaning house

There people on her ward at present appear to be in a much more advanced stage of dementia than my mum. She can give the appearance of being ok, she is still good on her feet and she can carry a on a conversation for most of the time. My mum is unhappy in the hospital and feels she shouldn't be there. We are awaiting a care plan, but not sure how long this can take. I am worried my mum will deteriorate quickly if she stays there much longer.
 

witchpig

Registered User
Dec 31, 2011
270
0
Maidstone Kent
Reading your replies had brought me abit of comfort. I spent last night tossing and turning in bed with hardly any sleep trying to think why mum has done this to me. The first thing im going to do on Tuesday is contact her dr to let him know what has happened over the last couple of weeks and today im going to contact social services to do a vunerable adult assesment. I dont care what trouble i cause if it gets the help mum needs so what.
 

Purplegranny

Registered User
Dec 28, 2011
3
0
Apologies not needed

SINCERE APOLOGIES oh my word....having just posted the above reply, I've seen the flipping length of it...I am SO sorry....I did not realise I had gone on and on and on....I am so embarrassed.........

Please don't be sorry, I did much the same, it's almost a relief to write it down knowing other people will read it and understand!
 

witchpig

Registered User
Dec 31, 2011
270
0
Maidstone Kent
Dont worry about the length of your post. I could have written about the same length but didnt have the courage to, so that means you are braver than me. I am getting braver at putting my feelings down on paper, so soon i might write a piece as long if not longer than yours.
I have learnt in the last few days that we all need to rant and rave at times but we will always have support on tp. It will be support from "real" people who have been through what we are going through and not medical people who learn it through books.
 

kelly50

Registered User
Jul 4, 2009
40
0
East Northants
Hi there,
Just wanted to add a few things to the early signs list. My father had vascular dementia.
A long time before he was diagnosed he signed himself off the heart specialist(a few weeks after a heart attack)saying he was absolutely fine and well. Any subsequent letters to him from the health authority were hidden or destroyed. His family didn't discover he had done this for a long time.
A large amount of cash was withdrawn from the bank and hidden in the house. Once again this was not discovered by his wife for at least a year.
Important documents were lost or destroyed.
Even though he had always loved sport, he lost interest in it, wouldn't watch it on tv or read about it in the papers. (we think this may have been because he couldn't understand the rules and was afraid to admit this).
We called to see him on the way to a party. My husband was wearing a bow tie. My dad asked if husband was on his way to work.
He started to drive very slowly and carefully, and did things like not put on headlights at night time.
He made an odd speech at my parents golden wedding.
There are many more examples that I could add(jumpers on back to front) but it would go on and on.
It is such a difficult disease and the general public need more information. We are all at risk of getting it and we all need to be aware of the signs.
My dad has now died much earlier than he needed to because he refused treatment and suffered from heart and kidney failure.
kelly.
 

Redwitch

Registered User
Mar 24, 2011
566
0
Horsham, West Sussex
My Mum was diagnosed with AD in the summer of 2011, although we had suspected this for about 18 months previously. Apart from the repitition (I lived 50 miles away and phoned twice a week and I would get told the same story about 6 times during each phone call), when we went to visit, Mum had always enjoyed cooking, but seemed to loose interest and in fact gave up cooking totally about 2 years ago.

She also changed from being a smart, well dresssed, colour coordinated woman with immaculate clothes to a a scruffy "bag-lady" :eek: in stained, holey and mis-matched clothes that are not always totally suited to the weather :eek:.

I am not sure if this helps but hindsight is a wonderful thing :p.

Jan
 

Margaret W

Registered User
Apr 28, 2007
3,720
0
North Derbyshire
I Just thought of another sign that mum was losing track of time. I used to take her to the supermarket every Sunday, and suddenly she started buying batteries. At first it was once a month or so, and I didn't think anything of it. She seemed to know which size of battery to buy and I knew she had a few battery-operated appliances. Then it became that she was buying batteries every week. I asked what they were for. She said her clocks weren't working - living room, bedroom, kitchen. I suggested she was buying only cheap batteries and made her buy better ones. But the following week she was looking for batteries again. So next time I went to her house and checked out the clocks. They were all working perfectly well - but in a tin in the kitchen were HUNDREDS of batteries.

I now realise she thought the clocks were wrong cos when they said 3 a.m. she thought they should say 9 a.m. - time to get off to the shops!

It's a sad illness, ain't it?

Love

Margaret
 

Jancis

Registered User
Jun 30, 2010
2,567
0
70
Hampshire
She said her clocks weren't working - living room, bedroom, kitchen. I suggested she was buying only cheap batteries and made her buy better ones. But the following week she was looking for batteries again. So next time I went to her house and checked out the clocks. They were all working perfectly well - but in a tin in the kitchen were HUNDREDS of batteries.

I now realise she thought the clocks were wrong cos when they said 3 a.m. she thought they should say 9 a.m.

Clocks became an obsession with my uncle. He had always liked clocks but they became his enemy when he thought none of them were working correctly. He used to say "I have absolutely no idea what the time is as none of my clocks are working". I bought him new clocks but we soon realised he had lost the ability to read their faces. He always thought he knew the time (in his head) but it never coincided with reality.
 

Jancis

Registered User
Jun 30, 2010
2,567
0
70
Hampshire
Signs of ageing and signs of dementia - impossible to detect except with hindsight?

Just wanted to remind myself that not everyone who is showing signs of ageing are showing signs of dementia. I have started to worry about members of my family who are getting older and are slowing down. It's so very difficult to diagnose dementia in the early stages and I have to keep reminding myself that we must make allowances for the ageing process which is different for everyone. I'll never regret joining TP as I have learned so much here but I do wonder if I now know too much.

I was so worried at xmas about my brother as I thought he'd had had a mini stroke but thank goodness he's much better now and has had brain and body scans and has been told that there are no signs of vascular or cardiac problems but he is seeing a neurologist as he's lost feeling in three fingers and hopefully this is due to compressed nerves and will not be permanent.

My husband appears even more angry with the world and I find myself wondering if this is abnormal - or is the world responsible?

My mum's repeating herself more and more and confusing me about appointments she thinks she's booked. So we now have a blackboard in the kitchen to remind her - and me.

Even the dog seems to be showing signs of memory loss (keeps asking for food even though he's just been fed!)

Sorry, don't mean to belittle this thread which I have found extremely interesting.

My dad by the way, suffered from dementia but looking back we lost quite a lot of our best cutlery. One day I discovered a fork in the waste bin after dad had been doing some washing up. His condition was never diagnosed but with hindsight I can see that he must have had lots of mini strokes which combined with his arthritis brought on years of suffering for him. Not sure how we would have reacted or what we could have done if we'd known what was to going to befall him.
 

Canadian Joanne

Registered User
Apr 8, 2005
17,710
0
70
Toronto, Canada
I find that most of the signs people have been discussing here are more to the moderate stage of AD, not the very early.

I only recognized the very earliest signs in my mother after she had been diagnosed. An 'aha' moment, if you will. Irritation, mood swings and quickness to anger were the first signs we saw. These can be so easily attributed to stress and many other causes that they are very easy to brush off. There was also forgetfulness but Mum would say it was caused by her fatigue. I once joked with her, saying she should go see her doctor before she forgot who her doctor was.

My mother was formally diagnosed when she had just turned 64 but when she was in her late 50s, she told me that one of her work colleagues would tease her by saying she had a great memory but it was short. So she was working for probably three or four years with AD, as she retired at the age of 60.

It's an insidious disease and sneaks up on us.
 

Ladywriter1968

Registered User
Oct 2, 2009
438
0
London UK
you have just describe my Dad exactly as your Mum went

My Mum was diagnosed with AD in the summer of 2011, although we had suspected this for about 18 months previously. Apart from the repitition (I lived 50 miles away and phoned twice a week and I would get told the same story about 6 times during each phone call), when we went to visit, Mum had always enjoyed cooking, but seemed to loose interest and in fact gave up cooking totally about 2 years ago.

She also changed from being a smart, well dresssed, colour coordinated woman with immaculate to a a scruffy "bag-lady" :eek: in stained, holey and mis-matched clothes that are not always totally suited to the weather :eek:.

I am not sure if this helps but hindsight is a wonderful thing :p.

Jan
My Dad and your Mum same.

he was very fussy even used to iron his socks, always washing his own shirts and all. cleaning his shoes. He even had shoe polish, who bothers these days even with that. he would iron hankerchiefs and his pants. But same as your Mum, he turned into a scruffy person with holes in his shirt and stained and wore same clothes all the time. Started to chuck ash in the fire place instead of ashtray. Then got ear infection and put vasceline in it, instead of going to the doctors and made it worse
 

Ladywriter1968

Registered User
Oct 2, 2009
438
0
London UK
I understand all

Just wanted to remind myself that not everyone who is showing signs of ageing are showing signs of dementia. I have started to worry about members of my family who are getting older and are slowing down. It's so very difficult to diagnose dementia in the early stages and I have to keep reminding myself that we must make allowances for the ageing process which is different for everyone. I'll never regret joining TP as I have learned so much here but I do wonder if I now know too much.

I was so worried at xmas about my brother as I thought he'd had had a mini stroke but thank goodness he's much better now and has had brain and body scans and has been told that there are no signs of vascular or cardiac problems but he is seeing a neurologist as he's lost feeling in three fingers and hopefully this is due to compressed nerves and will not be permanent.

My husband appears even more angry with the world and I find myself wondering if this is abnormal - or is the world responsible?

My mum's repeating herself more and more and confusing me about appointments she thinks she's booked. So we now have a blackboard in the kitchen to remind her - and me.

Even the dog seems to be showing signs of memory loss (keeps asking for food even though he's just been fed!)

Sorry, don't mean to belittle this thread which I have found extremely interesting.

My dad by the way, suffered from dementia but looking back we lost quite a lot of our best cutlery. One day I discovered a fork in the waste bin after dad had been doing some washing up. His condition was never diagnosed but with hindsight I can see that he must have had lots of mini strokes which combined with his arthritis brought on years of suffering for him. Not sure how we would have reacted or what we could have done if we'd known what was to going to befall him.
Dont worry I do understand, plus animal lover. so probably animals can get dementia as well as people. Maybe the dog is confused because his owners are.
 

Ladywriter1968

Registered User
Oct 2, 2009
438
0
London UK
Another thing I remembered

Years ago, once Dad was cooking our dogs dinner, she had cooked chicken, and my husband said, then we wasnt married, that chicken really stinks he cant give her that, it will make her very ill. And it stunk the place out, my Dad could not smell it at all. We had just got in on time, before he gave it to our dog. But saying that, she was very intelligent and probably would not have eaten it. Once I dropped my dinner on the floor, the plate when upside down had meat and all, was a roast and my dog did not touch any of it, she got up and looked at me, as if to say, you silly fool, and she walked off. She didnt even try to take the meat after it had been on the carpet. Then my Dad did a strange thing. He took the dinner off the floor put back on his plate and he sat there and ate it. I told him he could not do that, yuk, even our dog looked at him in dismay. But he ate it.
 

Ladywriter1968

Registered User
Oct 2, 2009
438
0
London UK
the man visiting knew

Reading all the replies to this thread, I would like to, if I may,. share our families experience so far., and ask for anyone to please give me their honest point of view. I see many familiar things written here.

Despite having regular visits from a mental health nurse and on occasions a psychiatrist, Dad's and anxiety seemed to get worse. Over a period of 18months, medications were prescribed, then increased, then changed, finally he was given lithium. Still with no improvements.

Everyone was baffled.

He'd months previously taken to his bed, saying he was tired, but on checking him frequently, he would be laid staring at the ceiling ~ thinking ~ he would rarely get up, but when he did he'd just lay on the sofa staring at the tv.

Conversation was almost impossible as he'd become vacant looking, disinterested, and often just get up and walk off leaving whoever, talking to themselves.:eek:

He gave up driving saying he couldn't concentrate (mum reckoned he was just saying that as he couldn't be bothered to go to the supermarket. She doesn't drive.)

I noticed he wasn't bathing on a regular basis, or changing his clothing, underwear etc his nails were dirty, his clothes bobbled and creased. Dad had been the kind of man to be up early wash, shave and dress, always a shirt, tie and jumper, (quite vain if I'm to be honest) ~ he now looked bedraggled. Mum was so upset, for any suggestions she would make regarding his appearance would be met with an angry reply.

The love of his life has always been his garden. Owning the bungalow from new it had taken a lifetime of hardwork to get it looking as he wanted it. It's a very large area and needed attention in small doses, daily. He refused to go into his garden ~ shrubs grew, roses died, grass (usually mowed with stripes :rolleyes:) became overgrown and yellow, he had no interest at all in it.
It has taken me 2 years of back breaking work to get it back to how it was, thinking this would ease the worry over maintaining it himself...has it? errr noooo:(

He began obsessing over things, eg; the new central heating boiler, convinced it wasn't worth the money he'd paid, that the engineer was a 'cowboy' (so hurtful to the young man as he returned 3 or more times to explain the workings to dad who literally couldn't comprehend any of what was being said, but argued the toss anyway!!) and strangely enough it was the engineer's reaction to Dad that brought it home to me that there was something very 'wrong'....he spoke 'over' dad, to me, as if he was aware that dad had a problem understanding. That sounds a stupid way of putting it, but I hope you know what I'm trying to say. ..the way he looked at dad, the way he spoke to him, slowly,carefully, as if dad's illness was so obvious, it shocked me if I'm honest.

He constantly faffed about with the thermostat and drove everyone to distraction with his never ending obsession.

He became confused with the tv remote, no longer being able to 'work it out'.

He moved on from the central heating to his financial affairs, and to this day is obsessed with the subject. 100% convinced we are all in dire straits and we'll lose the house and end up on the street. There is no reasoning with him.

He has always had an unhealthy interest/obsession with death for as long as I can recall (I'm 51) but he began to lay down with his arms crossed over his chest,stating he was dying, would say goodbye in a tone that would suggest a sincere 'goodbye', then ignore us totally for hours on end...it was at this stage I called in an ambulance, dad was admitted to a mental health hospital~that was 4 weeks ago~ he has refused certain meds, his appetite is virtually non existant, he's lost a further 10lbs since being admitted, the staff have a battle with him daily to get him out of bed,washed,and dressed.
He became paranoid~ he said staff members were going to kill him,his room was bugged,his food was poisened, they were medicating him behind his back to sedate him,everyone there was 'in' on the 'plot', He fought sleep at night so he could keep a vigil on the 'goings on' in the hospital......

He has become 'impatient', frustrated, withdrawn~choosing not to socialize with the other patients as he feels he 'frightens' them by his appearance. He's lost quite a lot of weight and is convinced he has also lost height and is shrinking nightly due to his 'nerves'~ he's been on risperidone~ is now on Olanzapine.

we were advised to stop reassuring him that all was ok because all that did was infuriate him, set him off in an agitated state (he's even raised his hand to both mum and I) and he wouldn't believe anything we said anyway...so that's what we've done, stopped the reassurance...so now he won't talk to us :confused:

I could go on and on and on with examples of changes in his behaviour......we haven't been given a diagnosis proper. severe depression with paranoia AND early stage dementia have been mentioned. Ct head scan showed 'minimal' changes in the size of the brain.......

The medical staff are fabulous. The hospital is small, cosy and very friendly. It's spotlessly clean and we couldn't wish for dad to be in better hands~but crikey it is such a massive learning curve for mum and I, especially as we haven't been actually 'told' he has dementia, we do what we can (which often turns out to be the exact opposite of what we should be doing and saying lol), I read many of the threads on this wonderful site and I'm sure you'll agree that dad does display signs of dementia, it is so difficult to know what step to take next. I've read on here that a diagnosis can often be a long time in coming, how on earth does anyone 'manage' in the meantime,ie; do you think I'm wrong in 'presuming' dad has dementia? am I barking up the wrong tree? I feel like I'm going round in circles and repeating myself in every thread I write or reply too, I am so sorry if I'm out of order in this way, but I guess in looking for help,I'm actually looking for answers and I'm aware these can only really come from the hospital, but I so appreciate any kind of advice you give.
Heartfelt thanks in advance xxxxxx
The man that spoke over your dad who came, sounds to me as if he had experienced this with people before or maybe even with his own parents so he knew your Dad was sick and thats why he spoke to you more then your Dad. But he obviously is not going to come out and say to you, do you know your Dad has dementia etc. But to me from what you said, the visitor knew the signs already. This disease takes someone of knowledge and experience to know. When my Dad first started with it, I didnt have a clue, I only found out later when Dads mate and couple of others Dad knew warned me of it, You dad keeps going over same thing every 5mins, He is giving his money away etc. Even then it did not click with me at first. But they had been around this kind of thing before so knew and tried to tell me in a gentle way, I think your Dad should see a doctor etc. When Dad put vasceline in his sick ear and made it worse instead of going to doctor which was just around corner from his house, I thought, this is not normal. Dad would walk past doctors place every day to get his paper. I know some people dont like doctors but in the past it never bothered Dad, if he had a problem he would go. Like time when he was bitten on the eye by some insect he went straight round doctors, so all of a sudden for him not to go, it was obvious he had an ear infection. Then found out later he hadnt been taking his blood pressure tablets, no wonder why he was in and out of hospital with heart failure. They were all out of date, when I changed his docs and he went round there 2yr later she didnt know who he was.
 

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