• We're currently experiencing technical issues with our newsletter software, so our Dementia Talking Point monthly updates have been put on hold for now. We hope to restart the newsletter soon.

    Find out more >here<.

Waiting for registration of power of attorney 8 months now.

missmonica

Registered User
Jun 21, 2015
5
Hello , I am a new member .I have been full time carer for my Mother for almost three years now.Last August her specialist advised if a P.O.A was in place it should be registered. I am the only relative living in the country .I have two siblings , one is invalid and unable to help me the other has shown no interest in assisting me and declined any request made . Now the P.O.A is to be registered this sister has taken a sudden interest in her Mothers affairs and has objected to my being attorney. So I have been in a position of needing to have some repairs done to the house as the boiler broke down and a few other expenditures regarding the house.Now my Mothers lawyer tells me I am not allowed to make any repairs on the house . I am very upset as I am trying to do my best with no assistance .I cannot work full time and care for my Mother.I am told I am not allowed to hire in help either .I never asked to be placed in this positions and am worried that now I might fail to be made attorney due to these expenses outlaid on the house and Mum will be made a ward of court. Can anyone please advise me on where I can get information on what I can spend while waiting for registration ? Thank you
 

janma221

Registered User
Apr 23, 2013
284
Powys
Hi sorry to hear about your problems. It sounds as if you need your own legal specialist perhaps you could try the Citizens Advice Bureau. The Office of the Public Guardian oversee people with POA and I have always found them helpful as they have told me that all the money spent on builders for my Mother's house is legitimate because it is to pay for her care. As long as it is spent in your Mum's interest only then I can't see what objection they could have. Sure there are others on here more qualified than myself to help you but just wanted to let you know that people are here to listen to you.
Take care
Jan
 

sue38

Registered User
Mar 6, 2007
10,849
52
Wigan, Lancs
Hi, and welcome to Talking Point.

Do you know why the lawyer has told you you cannot spend the monies on repairs? It might be because the POA isn't yet registered and you don't have the necessary authority. Whether you can act under an unregistered POA will depend upon the type of POA. If it's a Lasting Power of Attorney you can't use it unless and until it is registered.
 

Quilty

Registered User
Aug 28, 2014
1,051
GLASGOW
I dont think your sister can stop you being POA unless you were deemed unfit eg previous judgements for fraud etc. Its your Mum choice and it sounds like it was for the best reasons.

The system in Scotland is different so I cant advise you but I am sure there will be a website and contact details. I would phone them directly and explain the problem. They can then advise you.

Best of luck.
Quilty
 

missmonica

Registered User
Jun 21, 2015
5
Thanks for reply

Hi sorry to hear about your problems. It sounds as if you need your own legal specialist perhaps you could try the Citizens Advice Bureau. The Office of the Public Guardian oversee people with POA and I have always found them helpful as they have told me that all the money spent on builders for my Mother's house is legitimate because it is to pay for her care. As long as it is spent in your Mum's interest only then I can't see what objection they could have. Sure there are others on here more qualified than myself to help you but just wanted to let you know that people are here to listen to you.
Take care
Jan
Trying to get a minute to respond , she calls !
 

missmonica

Registered User
Jun 21, 2015
5
Enduring P.O.A

Hi, and welcome to Talking Point.

Do you know why the lawyer has told you you cannot spend the monies on repairs? It might be because the POA isn't yet registered and you don't have the necessary authority. Whether you can act under an unregistered POA will depend upon the type of POA. If it's a Lasting Power of Attorney you can't use it unless and until it is registered.
Its an Enduring P.O.A ,my problem is it has taken so long to register I am annoyed at the lawyers.It has been very difficult for me to work especially in the last 12 months as Mum gets more forgetful also I had a a total colectomy last year . I continued to pay rent on my apartment for two years while living with my Mum because it had been my home for 13 years and my daughter did not want to live permanently with my Mum. This cost me 24,000 , now I cant put 20 of my Mums money in my gas tank to take her out now my funds are low. Caring has made me broke :(
 

missmonica

Registered User
Jun 21, 2015
5
Numerous objections and false allegations

I dont think your sister can stop you being POA unless you were deemed unfit eg previous judgements for fraud etc. Its your Mum choice and it sounds like it was for the best reasons.

The system in Scotland is different so I cant advise you but I am sure there will be a website and contact details. I would phone them directly and explain the problem. They can then advise you.

Best of luck.
Quilty
My sister has made numerous unfounded allegations to support objections .Thankfully I can disprove all , such as I never take her to church thereby neglecting her spiritual needs, I may have a problem with having spent money on petrol , paint for painting the house , and such like.I would have thought that these were legitimate expenses for her best interest but the lawyer says I cant spend a cent if not directly on her .:confused:
 

missmonica

Registered User
Jun 21, 2015
5
Who has involved this laywer? You, your Mum or someone else?
Its my Mums lawyer and tax advisor. She is the one registering the P.O.A .A different lawyer wrote up the P.O.A but we moved company as the new lawyer was also a tax expert in estate planning. In the P.O.A I am the only attorney , the lawyer said because one of my sisters is permanently in care and the other has fourth stage lung cancer with secondary tumors in brain , they would not be fit to act.
 
Last edited:

Pete R

Registered User
Jul 26, 2014
2,036
Staffs
I've deleted my last post after seeing your edit but do not forget that if your Mom wishes to she can dismiss the solicitor.

It is the responsibility of the "Attorney" of an EPA to register it so that is you and not the solicitor.

"Part C: Registering an Enduring Power
of Attorney
When should an Enduring Power of Attorney be registered
and by whom?
The Attorney is the person responsible for registering the EPA.
This is because the EPA is only registered when the Attorney
believes that the Donor is becoming or has become mentally
incapable of handling his or her own affairs."


The full procedure is included in this link.
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploa...287864/EPA101_Guidance_apply_register_EPA.pdf

You have to inform certain people (relatives) and they can then object if they so wish.
 
Last edited:

Bod

Registered User
Aug 30, 2013
1,312
Location?

Its my Mums lawyer and tax advisor. She is the one registering the P.O.A .A different lawyer wrote up the P.O.A but we moved company as the new lawyer was also a tax expert in estate planning. In the P.O.A I am the only attorney , the lawyer said because one of my sisters is permanently in care and the other has fourth stage lung cancer with secondary tumors in brain , they would not be fit to act.
Missmonica, you are in the UK aren't you?
Your replies sound as if you are in the USA.

Bod
 

Quilty

Registered User
Aug 28, 2014
1,051
GLASGOW
You mentioned you sister raising an objection based on not taking your Mum to church?! Are you outside the UK? I don't believe that is covered in POA here. Its about managing finances and possibly health decisions.

I have POA for my Mum. She is not able to go to church anymore due to stairs, too many people trying to talk to her making her anxious etc. I have POA for finances and welfare. I make sure we talk to hospital/care home staff when Mum having a clear day so she is getting to make the decisions with me.

Keep pushing on as its what is best for your Mum that matters.
 

Fred Flintstone

Registered User
Aug 28, 2014
133
S. E. England
Its an Enduring P.O.A ,my problem is it has taken so long to register I am annoyed at the lawyers.It has been very difficult for me to work especially in the last 12 months as Mum gets more forgetful also I had a a total colectomy last year . I continued to pay rent on my apartment for two years while living with my Mum because it had been my home for 13 years and my daughter did not want to live permanently with my Mum. This cost me 24,000 , now I cant put 20 of my Mums money in my gas tank to take her out now my funds are low. Caring has made me broke :(
If it's an ENDURING PoA, that's different to the LASTING PoAs granted under the Mental Capacity Act. My father was involved with one of these on behalf of his first cousin, the only surviving one on her father's side, although there were also a number of first cousins on her mother's. As her closest relatives were first cousins, all had to be approached.

I understood that whole classes of people have to be consulted, to a minimum of three. In the above case, all first cousins. They then had 28 days to object, and would have had to give grounds.

As you only have two sisters, I think your lawyer needed to go to the next class of relatives, either grandchildren, nephews and nieces, or on as far as first cousins. If there are four grandchildren, all would have had to been consulted. If there is only one, that would be enough. If there are no grandchildren, then all of the next class of relative would have had to be consulted.

ALL THE ABOVE MAY be total tosh, if you yourself as the attorney also count as one of the three relatives. However, there may possibly be the option of asking the next class of relatives, if you think their comments might be favourable to you.

My reasoning is, that if other relatives may be consulted, they might be willing to argue that your sister is being unreasonable.
 

Spamar

Registered User
Oct 5, 2013
7,478
Suffolk
One of my cousin was fathers E POA, he wasn't pleased to find he had to notify 20 people, me, then 19 other cousins!
 

Pickles53

Registered User
Feb 25, 2014
2,474
Radcliffe on Trent
As you only have two sisters, I think your lawyer needed to go to the next class of relatives, either grandchildren, nephews and nieces, or on as far as first cousins. If there are four grandchildren, all would have had to been consulted. If there is only one, that would be enough. If there are no grandchildren, then all of the next class of relative would have had to be consulted.
Not quite right I think. I had the EPOA for my mother. The minimum number of relatives to notify was three, but I counted as one of the three. So the only people who had to be notified when I applied to register the EPOA were my brother and sister. Didn't need to go to next group of relatives (4 grandchildren). Everything went through OPG with no queries raised.
 

Fred Flintstone

Registered User
Aug 28, 2014
133
S. E. England
Not quite right I think. I had the EPOA for my mother. The minimum number of relatives to notify was three, but I counted as one of the three. So the only people who had to be notified when I applied to register the EPOA were my brother and sister. Didn't need to go to next group of relatives (4 grandchildren). Everything went through OPG with no queries raised.
So even as attorney you counted as one of the three. I wondered about that and acknowledged the possibility in my reply above. So, had the three of you had joint power of attorney, then presumably no one else would have needed to be asked.

I did make the point to the OP that were the next group of relatives to be consulted on a voluntary basis, particularly given that one of the sisters is disabled, their input might just possibly be helpful. Without knowing them, and having no knowledge of the family tree, it's just a thought - might not be a good idea at all, whatever the legal position is.
 

Pickles53

Registered User
Feb 25, 2014
2,474
Radcliffe on Trent
So even as attorney you counted as one of the three. I wondered about that and acknowledged the possibility in my reply above. So, had the three of you had joint power of attorney, then presumably no one else would have needed to be asked.

I did make the point to the OP that were the next group of relatives to be consulted on a voluntary basis, particularly given that one of the sisters is disabled, their input might just possibly be helpful. Without knowing them, and having no knowledge of the family tree, it's just a thought - might not be a good idea at all, whatever the legal position is.
Hadn't thought about the situation if we had all been joint attorneys, although I would not have traded the hassle of notifying the other two for the much greater hassle of trying to get my 'invisible' brother to help sort out mum's finances.