1. Expert Q&A: Protecting a person with dementia from financial abuse - Weds 26 June, 3:30-4:30 pm

    Financial abuse can have serious consequences for a person with dementia. Find out how to protect a person with dementia from financial abuse.

    Sam, our Knowledge Officer (Legal and Welfare Rights) is our expert on this topic. She will be here to answer your questions on Wednesday 26 June between 3:30 - 4:30 pm.

    You can either post questions >here< or email them to us at talkingpoint@alzheimers.org.uk and we'll answer as many as we can on the day.

Old Age Pension + EPA

Discussion in 'Legal and financial issues' started by Conrad, Mar 27, 2007.

  1. Conrad

    Conrad Registered User

    Jan 15, 2007
    16
    Hi there

    Just hoping someone may have some recent experience of this - I'm searching the forum too for older messages

    We have a registered EPA for my Aunt but this is the first time we've come to use it. She has her pension payed into a post office card account which she used to access with a card but she can no longer remember when to go, (used to go every day but has stopped going at all now), can't remember her pin number and displays cash in public and so on. Also her social services carer doesn't feel comfortable going to the post office and dealing with my aunt's money - which I totally understand - up 'til now she's been doing this as we live an hour's drive away

    Our aim is to get her pension payed directly into her bank account and then use that one account for all her finances

    I phoned the Post Office pensions people and they said the best thing to do was appoint my self as her 'trusted friend' getting my aunt to sign the form -regardless of the EPA) and then they will issue a card and pin for me to use on her post office account. Then I could withdraw cash and pay it into her bank account.

    I went into the local post office branch and they said get her to sign a form closing her card account and sign another one to get her pension sent to the new account

    All this advice seeems to just ignore the point of the EPA - I'm beginning to wonder whether it was worth bothering - what have others done - she doesn't have the mental faculties to discuss this

    Do we 'fake' her signature or sign it writing 'attorney' beside it?

    Any advice would be great
     
  2. Conrad

    Conrad Registered User

    Jan 15, 2007
    16
    I have now discovered the answer to this!!!

    The Pension Service will send a 'DP Gen' letter to the attorney asking for details of the account into which the pension is to be paid in future and the original EPA.

    You need the personal details of the 'client' in order to have the 'DP Gen' letter sent.
     
  3. Margarita

    Margarita Registered User

    Feb 17, 2006
    10,824
    london
    #3 Margarita, Mar 27, 2007
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2007

    What I did I sent my EPOA to the pension credit people, so like that every thing come to my address and I can talk to the pension people about my mother and about her attendances allowance , as my mother also gets AA pension cridit payed altogether in one bank , that could if I wanted be paid in to my bank .



    If you don’t do this and in the future you have problem with any of her benefits you can not talk to anyone on your mother behalf, because of the data protection act

    I would not do that fake the signature, because if like me you forget the number of the card or lose the card , you can not order another one , only your mother can talk to them .

    As I have that with my brother who has a mental illness , I keep his post office card and pin number , now I have forgotten his number and he has to phone them as they won’t talk to me as I have not sorted out the the 'attorney' part yet

    Have you told your Aunt bank that you have EPA ?
     
  4. Nebiroth

    Nebiroth Registered User

    Aug 20, 2006
    3,518
    Ah, I was about to launch into a lengthy post about this, but as you have discovered, an attorney can "manage" the donor's benefits (including pension) payments that come from the DWP. This means you can arrange for the method of payment to be changed, or to have it paid into a different account, and so on.

    You should also know that you can apply for benefits in your Aunt's name, the forms all have a special section that says that an EPA holder is completing and signing the form.

    I believe it is possible to do these things even without an EPA, but they send a social worker to make sure you are acting in the persons best interests in that case.

    Some of the forms (like Attendance Allowance) even have a section you can fill in that tell the DWP you are applying without the person knowing (you have to say why).

    So your situation is more common than you think.

    As you say, if the Post Office insist on getting your aunts signature, what is the point of EPA? You should be able to sign all documents on her behalf - even one that sets you up as her "trusted friend".

    Sounds as though your plan is the better one; get the pension directly paid to bank account, then with your EPA you should be able to sign cheques etc - that's how EPA's should work!
     
  5. Clive

    Clive Registered User

    Nov 7, 2004
    716
    Make sure you keep the original EPA locked up and only send a certified copy through the post. If you lose the original you have a problem.
     
  6. Lucille

    Lucille Registered User

    Sep 10, 2005
    542
    I'd also like to add that I didn't have a problem changing my mum's pension arrangements from the Post Office to the bank.

    I have an unregistered EPA but was nominated as mum's appointed agent or some such title. The transition from the PO to bank was smooth. When I've had to deal with the pensions people or the Attendance Allowance folk, it has been straightforward. They have also been helpful and professional on the phone.

    In fact a welcome voice of someone knowing what's going on, amidst the mire of cr*p we often have to deal with when it comes to dealing with the affairs of friends/family.

    L.

    PS: I work for the DWP ... only joking! :)
     
  7. Tender Face

    Tender Face Account Closed

    Mar 14, 2006
    5,379
    NW England
    Hi Conrad

    If you have registered EPA (you mean registered with the COP?) - my advice to anyone would not be to 'hold on' until you might need to use it ..... not sure if it's actually a legal obligation or not but the sooner you advise anyone and everyone you may have to deal with the better - utilities, insurance etc etc ...... (takes some people some time!!!!!)

    Agree with Lucille, DWP have been absolutely 'on the ball' - but then they are probably more used to dealing with POAs/EPAs than any 'corporates' by the very nature of their 'business'.

    Love, Karen, x
     
  8. Conrad

    Conrad Registered User

    Jan 15, 2007
    16
    Thanks all - yes, EPA is registered now. The pensions people see to be good - they said we could take the original EPA into a jobcentre and they will copy it and send it on internally - excellent!!

    Will be sorting her bank today - I hope!

    She does get attendance allowance - but I hadn't thought about this one. Social services set it all up and I think it comes with her pension but I'm not too sure - will have to investigate - is that what usually happens?
     
  9. Tender Face

    Tender Face Account Closed

    Mar 14, 2006
    5,379
    NW England
    Hello again, Conrad ....

    In my mum's case, Attendance allowance is paid as part of her pension direct from DWP into her bank account ..... but not certain this is always the case - I had one colleague who claimed SHE got paid AA direct to her - as a carer????? The correspondence I have from DWP gives a breakdown of what is paid and how the amount is calculated ......

    Not trying to be alarmist but if EPA is registered and you are now 'responsible' - have you got all the paperwork and information you need to manage?

    When I started to look after mum's affairs her filing system was 'errratic' (that's the nicest way I can put it :rolleyes: ) ... and I had to ferret out a lot of information about what she was paying to whom etc from what I could glean from bank statements .....

    Good luck with it .... last thing we need to be bothered with is all the paperwork, I know - but it can be such an essential part of 'caring' for someone .....

    Love, Karen, x
     
  10. Conrad

    Conrad Registered User

    Jan 15, 2007
    16
    Thanks Karen

    We're getting on top of 'most' of her papers now - although the other day we thought she had lots of new post only to find she was going through her father's MOTs from 20+ years ago

    Don't know why, nor does she

    I'll speak to her carer about the AA - cheers
     
  11. Nebiroth

    Nebiroth Registered User

    Aug 20, 2006
    3,518
    There's an option on the application for Attendance Allowance. You can say whether you want it paid in the same way as the state pension is currently paid, which just means ticking a box, but you can have it paid to a different account, etc. Probably most people have it paid alongside their state pension.

    I guess it could even be paid to an account held by someone else.

    That would make sense, as there's a section where you can say that you're filling in the form on someone's behalf without them knowing about it.

    I suppose it covers situations like ours where you have to write down how someone has declined without their having to see what you've written, or if you're worried they will be "careless" with the extra money!

    Although, if the person is signing it themselves, I was told, they must know what has been put in the form.
     
  12. Conrad

    Conrad Registered User

    Jan 15, 2007
    16
    Thanks Nebiroth

    It was set up when she was still 'signing' for herself - so hopefully it's going in with her pension - I'm going to go through her post office statements later
     
  13. Nebiroth

    Nebiroth Registered User

    Aug 20, 2006
    3,518
    You should find that it is still made as a separate payment rather than just being added on top of the pension. So you should be able to locate it on the statements.

    As I recall, on my Dad's bank statements, it is listed as "AA" with a code, so it was easy to find.
     
  14. jenniferpa

    jenniferpa Volunteer Moderator

    Jun 27, 2006
    39,417
    It must vary: my mother gets AA plus her state pension paid monthly into her bank account as one lump sum.
     

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.