1. Expert Q&A: Protecting a person with dementia from financial abuse - Weds 26 June, 3:30-4:30 pm

    Financial abuse can have serious consequences for a person with dementia. Find out how to protect a person with dementia from financial abuse.

    Sam, our Knowledge Officer (Legal and Welfare Rights) is our expert on this topic. She will be here to answer your questions on Wednesday 26 June between 3:30 - 4:30 pm.

    You can either post questions >here< or email them to us at talkingpoint@alzheimers.org.uk and we'll answer as many as we can on the day.

  1. alfjess

    alfjess Registered User

    Jul 10, 2006
    1,213
    south lanarkshire
    Hi All

    Can someone tell me the difference between an EMI unit and a dementia unit.

    I think the time is rapidly approaching when I will have to be looking at other care for Mum and that means Dad also, because no way could I separate them.

    Mum has not responded well to risperidone, so that med, has now ceased, but she is soo anxious now, that she is gasping for breath and it is so upsetting to observe and I think so very cruel for her to suffer such anxiety.

    The care home where they are now, have a dementia unit within the complex, but it is on the second floor and Mum is frightened in lifts, so I have been looking online at other alternatives, but some say EMI and some dementia.

    What should I be looking at?

    Thanks
    Alfjess
     
  2. jenniferpa

    jenniferpa Volunteer Moderator

    Jun 27, 2006
    39,419
    I'm not sure there really is a difference. Between EMI nursing and EMI units (aka residential) yes, but EMI seems to be simply a name. I know the csci site just distinguishes between dementia and non-dementia. From a practical point of view, I suppose EMI will have restricted access, while simply being registered for dementia may not necessarily mean that, but I don't know if there is an "official" definition.
     
  3. Margarita

    Margarita Registered User

    Feb 17, 2006
    10,824
    london
    #3 Margarita, Sep 28, 2007
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2007
    Far as I know a EMI unit and a dementia unit are both the same thing .


    In my area they do not use the word EMI unit unless in a hospital , as most people know it by the Old name EMI unit , so it a dementia unit within the hospital . assessment are done they or as a high level of nursing care is needed as they may be difficulty with they behavior to place in a nursing home for people with dementia out side the hospital

    EMI - elderly mentally infirm

    PS
    seeing that dementia does not only happen to the elderly , I can understand why they are trying to move away from using the word EMI unit
     
  4. Margaret W

    Margaret W Registered User

    Apr 28, 2007
    3,725
    North Derbyshire
    My AHA has never used the term EMI. I'd never heard of it till I came onto this site a few weeks ago.

    Are you really just looking at somewhere without a lift? You'll be hard pushed to find one - most homes have a lift from bedrooms to sitting/dining rooms. My mum isn't good in lifts, but okay if she has a friend with her as well as "the nurse". But not if it is crowded. I used to be petrified of trains till I got a job necessitating regular train journeys and got used to them. Lots of people are petrified of flying, like me, but I do it twice a year and the fear is diminishing.

    Maybe your parents' current care home could try out the lift for her and see if she improves over time.

    Margaret
     
  5. Skye

    Skye Registered User

    Aug 29, 2006
    17,000
    SW Scotland
    Hi alfjess, the NH John is going to has an EMI section, a separate wing of the main building, and on the ground floor. There is a separate keypad entry to the EMI section, it has its own sitting room and dining room.

    Other NHs here are registered for dementia patients, but they are not in a separate unit. The EMI unit has a higher staff/patient ratio, and of course extra security. I like that.

    Are you wanting your parents to share a room? That might be difficult if one is EMI and the other isn't. Our case had to go before the funding panel to get authorisation for EMI.

    If your mum was in the EMI unit and your dad in the residential section, You'd have to ask about them spending time together during the day -- it should be possible, but would depend on the NH.

    You might find it easier in a NH registered for dementia, where they could still be together, but you should still go back to your SW and ask about EMI funding for your mum. Every little helps! (We're self-funding, but will get the EMI allowance).

    Good luck,
     
  6. Margaret W

    Margaret W Registered User

    Apr 28, 2007
    3,725
    North Derbyshire
    I don't know what an EMI allowance is, can someone please explain? Who qualifies for it? Should I be applying for it for my mum?

    Margaret
     
  7. jenniferpa

    jenniferpa Volunteer Moderator

    Jun 27, 2006
    39,419
    #7 jenniferpa, Sep 29, 2007
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2007
    Margaret I think this might be a Scottish thing: both Hazel and Alfjess are north of the border.

    Edited to add:

    If it's not a specifically Scottish thing, it relates to the care a person needs: if someone needs to be in an EMI unit then the LA, for example, can't turn around and say "well we only pay for regular nursing care". Also, of course, it is possible that anyone who was sufficiently ill to need an EMI unit would also be eligible for at least some level of NHS registered nursing care. The difficulty is, obviously an EMI unit with increased staffing etc may well cost more than a regular nursing home (not necessarily), so if there is any element of public funding that comes into play (be it health or LA) someone will have to justify that placement.
     
  8. alfjess

    alfjess Registered User

    Jul 10, 2006
    1,213
    south lanarkshire
    Hi

    What am I doing wrong?

    After using Skye's message for a lengthy reply, using the "quote"
    A box appears telling me the message is too short.

    I will try again tomorrow, because to-day has been traumatic.

    There was talk of moving Mum to hospital, but when I asked why? The CPN, said to try to get her medication stabilised, but fortunately there were no beds in Wishaw General Hospital.

    I then questioned what meds needed stabilised because, other than Trazadone and things she has taken for years for her heart, all other anti pyshcotics had been stopped, so what good would it do, as Mum is already in a very anxious state?

    The outcome is that Quietiapine is to be restarted and if she gets worse over the weekend the care home has to call the GP

    Worried
    Alfjess
     
  9. alfjess

    alfjess Registered User

    Jul 10, 2006
    1,213
    south lanarkshire
    Hi

    Lost the thread of my post.

    Do you mean that EMI and dementia unit are one and the same thing?

    When I have been looking at reports on the care commission site, I have only been looking at dementia care homes.

    I guess it is now back to the drawing board.

    Alfjess
     
  10. Margarita

    Margarita Registered User

    Feb 17, 2006
    10,824
    london
  11. Skye

    Skye Registered User

    Aug 29, 2006
    17,000
    SW Scotland
    Yes, I think the terms EMI unit and dementia unit are the same thing, i.e. people with severe dementia-related problems are housed in a separate, secure unit, with a higher staff ratio.

    Nursing homes can also be registered for dementia patients, but they wouldn't usually be in a separate unit.

    Rooms in a specialist dementia/EMI unit usually cost more, but here in Scotland the LA picks up the extra cost, even if you are self-funding.

    I must stress that I'm only talking about Scotland here, there may be different systems elsewhere.

    Sorry you had such a bad day yesterday. I hope your mum settles without having to be admitted, it's so disturbing for the patient. Let us know.

    Love,
     
  12. Grannie G

    Grannie G Volunteer Moderator

    Apr 3, 2006
    68,731
    Kent
    I`m so sorry Alfjess, you sound as if you don`t know whether you`re coming or going.

    I hope your mother doesn`t have to be admitted, it will only add to her anxiety. Is there no possibility she can be observed in the home, where she`d be at her least anxious, or would this be asking too much.

    I hope she`ll be OK, and you too.

    Love xx
     
  13. alfjess

    alfjess Registered User

    Jul 10, 2006
    1,213
    south lanarkshire
    Hi All

    Thanks for your replies.

    Mum appears to be hyperventilating most of the time and it is very worrying to watch, but we are hoping that the quietiapine kicks in and calms her down, otherwise, I really can't believe that someone could survive very long enduring the amount of stress and anxiety, Mum is showing.

    Thanks Skye for the info that the LA picks up the extra money for the dementia unit and thanks to everyone else for their help.

    The complex where my parents are, have a dementia unit, attached to the nursing home, with coded entry and more ratio of staff to patient, with own lounge and dining room, but as always my problem is, I have two to consider.

    Dad appears to be quite happy in the care home at the moment, but if I have to move Mum to the dementia unit (seeing her at the moment, I can't believe she can endure much more of this torture of anxiety) How can I seperate them? They still look out for each other, although Mum now calls, Alex (Dad) Daddy.

    How riight you are Sylvia, I don't know where to turn or what to do for the best, as the saying goes my brain is mince at the moment.

    Thanks again
    Alfjess
     
  14. jenniferpa

    jenniferpa Volunteer Moderator

    Jun 27, 2006
    39,419
    Alfjess: I recognise that the dementia unit has more staff etc, but I'm not clear how a move to it could be expected to help with your Mother's hyperventilation. I mean I understand that her dementia is worsening and for that reason the dementia unit might be a good idea, but it sounds as if the hyperventilation would occur wherever she was.

    Love
     
  15. Skye

    Skye Registered User

    Aug 29, 2006
    17,000
    SW Scotland
    Hi Alfjess, I suspect that a move away from your dad would make the anxiety worse. I'd wait a while to see if they can get the quetiapine dosage right before doing anything about a move. That's assuming that the staff are happy to keep her where she is.

    It would be better for both your parents to keep them together for as long as possible, I would think.

    Love,
     
  16. Margarita

    Margarita Registered User

    Feb 17, 2006
    10,824
    london
    Silly question to ask , but I am wondering what is causing so much anxiety .

    is it the side effect of coming of the medication risperidone ? So her care needs are more demanding then the home she in how can cope with . So they ask you to move your mother to a different unit in they care home

    if care home has not ask you to move her I would agree with jenniferpa


     
  17. alfjess

    alfjess Registered User

    Jul 10, 2006
    1,213
    south lanarkshire
    Yes jennifer, I was only hoping that with more staff to patient ratio and possibly more dementia training, they might be able to keep her calm, clutching at straws, maybe?

    Mum is so very agitated, that I don't know what to do for the best, only hope that the quietiapine works, but I visited to-day and there was no improvement. The quietiapine started last Friday.

    thanks Alfjess
     
  18. connie

    connie Registered User

    Mar 7, 2004
    9,519
    Frinton-on-Sea
    Dear Alfjess, no easy answers, but can understand your thinkng.

    Medication can be such an asset, when it is the right one, and it works. Until then, trial ans error I am afraid.

    I used to be so anti as to what I saw as the chemical cosh. I was still trying to care at home, and was determined that we would not go down that road. Some years on, and you realise that the right meds can work wonders.

    Please don't give up. At least your mum is having her meds. in a secure environment. So much harder when you are trying to cope with these things at home. Stay on top of the situation, ask questions, and if this treatment does not help you mum, maybe something else will.

    Rooting for you. Fingers crossed, love
     
  19. Grannie G

    Grannie G Volunteer Moderator

    Apr 3, 2006
    68,731
    Kent
    Dear Alfjess,
    What have the medics said about your mother? How long do they expect the quietiapine to take to work, or is it a case of `wait and see.`
    I`m sorry it`s so upsetting for you.
    Love xx
     
  20. alfjess

    alfjess Registered User

    Jul 10, 2006
    1,213
    south lanarkshire
    Hi Skye
    It has always been my aim to keep Mum and Dad together, no matter what, but sometimes, like now, I have to question that, because Mum is suffering soo much. Would she be better in a dementia unit?
    The staff are wonderful and doing their best, with the limited time they have.
    Dad is not really aware, although they are always holding hands, but I think this is just Mum needing security.
    When I take them to the dining room, Dad always tries to sit at table, with all men.

    What to do???

    Thanks Alfjess
     

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