Stashing money - and she knows it!!!!

Tender Face

Account Closed
Mar 14, 2006
5,379
NW England
Not so much a problem, but something I thought might be worth sharing for others .... not many problems we can be light-hearted about, I know and whilst this does have serious undertones ............

I've read so much of people 'stashing money'..... I've posted myself - a year or more back - on my concern about how much cash mum could seem to get through .... and how to account for it (or be unable to) under EPA rules ......

This week, mum (delightfully lucid and high-spirited of late) gave me another lecture on 'What I must do when she pops her clogs' (a phrase I can remember her using since childhood days!!!!!!) Latest - along with 'You do know what hymn I want at the funeral' etc - is that I must check absolutely EVERYTHING in the house before I give it away ... (Sure many of us here have all been through the 'Oh, stop talking like that' scenario at some point in our lives already) .....

Well, for a long time I have known of her cash stashes under certain rugs, amongst bedding, in the cover of a certain book in a certain drawer ....- just the ones she has told me about - in fact when I draw cash from the bank for her there are two specific places she insists I keep her little stashes 'topped up'. I find it remarkable that she can remember these specific places ..... and knows to 'draw off' the cash she needs - but I nearly collapsed laughing when she took off her slipper and showed me what she had hidden under the insole!!!!!!!!:eek::D

I had always assumed that 'stashing cash' was 'just' a security thing ...... but I rather feel mum is proving she is still capable of some creative thinking here??????:) Or is that just being naive?

Oh well, if the COP ever challenge me on my accounting ........ I can always produce mum's slippers as evidence, I guess?

Love, Karen, x
 

Lynne

Registered User
Jun 3, 2005
3,433
Suffolk,England
;) Just joining you in your Grin; as we often say here, "If you didn't laugh, you'd cry all the time"

At least if your Mum seems to be getting taller, you'll know what's causing it! :D

All the best
 

gigi

Registered User
Nov 16, 2007
7,788
67
East Midlands
At least if your Mum seems to be getting taller, you'll know what's causing it!
Lynne..I had to laugh at that...

Karen..your post brought back memories for me!!
My Gran..dad's mum..died well over 30 years ago in her early 70's.

Long before that I can remember visiting her..and she would insist on giving money to me and my brothers.:D .mum and dad weren't allowed to go with us.. she would take us upstairs in this "spooky" house... :eek:my older brother had to pull the wardrobe out..and there were old newspapers stacked behind the wardrobe..:confused: between the sheets of paper there was so much money.. she would give us a ten bob note each and we'd be so happy.:)

Apparently..she had money under the floorboards..in the garage..when she was finally admitted into hospital..(having been picked up by the police for walking down a motorway :eek:) ..she had a bag tied round her middle with several hundred pounds in it.

I now realise she was suffering from dementia..probably VAD as she eventually died from a stroke.
Back then..we just thought she was odd..and that was accepted.

What I'm trying to say..in a very long winded fashion..is that recognition of dementia..and understanding of it..has come a long way... Thanks Karen...:)



Love Gigi x
 

Grannie G

Volunteer Moderator
Apr 3, 2006
71,740
Kent
And my grandmother too, repeatedly told me not to throw anything away when she died, until I had looked inside it.
 

BeverleyY

Registered User
Jan 29, 2008
716
Ashford, Kent
Dad hides money - under the mattress, the sofa etc.. to be honest, I now limit him to £20 in his pocket and I know what he spends it on.. just odds and sods. As soon as it runs out, I give him £20 saying, oh.. here you go, I found it your trouser pockets when I put them in the wash. Oh, great he says.. I thought I'd lost some.

I haven't registered the EPA yet, and am still not 100% sure whether to be honest.

Something dawned on me the other day, SS can withdrawer help if they can prove that the person dwindled their capital to evade paying for care.... BUT....

how can someone with demential purposely dwindle their capital for care that they have no idea they will need :confused:

As far as my Dad is concerned, he has diabetes, and that's it. Mum never liked to fly so they haven't been away for years. The past few weeks he has been telling me he wants to go to Italy where he was stationed for 3 years in the Army, and to Gibraltar to visit my Mum's sister etc.

I wouldn't dream of telling him no because he'll need the money for nursing care!

Why does the system here try to make the end of these people's lives miserable by not letting them spend their money.

Also... let's say he did spend his money (which I won't let him do - well.. not all of it).. and SS deem he did it intentionally (which I would argue was ridiculous as he couldn't make a purposeful decision according to his MMSE score) - then, can they make me pay?? Can they make me sell my house to pay for it?

Beverley x
 

TinaT

Registered User
Sep 27, 2006
7,095
Bolton
Isn't it dreadful when we are frightened of spending our own money? To put your mind a little at ease, when I came back from Spain I had a very healthy bank account. However I had to buy a house, furniture, even pots and pans so the healthy account soon became a rather sick and sorry one. When Social Services assessed me they were very helpful and understanding and wanted only to see the latest bank account. I am perfectly sure that your dad's nostalgic wartime trip will not only do him a world of good but perhaps he could pay for you to accompany and look after him on the trip. I'm fairly sure none of this would be construed as 'deliberately siphoning off' assets. xxTinaT
 

BeverleyY

Registered User
Jan 29, 2008
716
Ashford, Kent
Isn't it dreadful when we are frightened of spending our own money? To put your mind a little at ease, when I came back from Spain I had a very healthy bank account. However I had to buy a house, furniture, even pots and pans so the healthy account soon became a rather sick and sorry one. When Social Services assessed me they were very helpful and understanding and wanted only to see the latest bank account. I am perfectly sure that your dad's nostalgic wartime trip will not only do him a world of good but perhaps he could pay for you to accompany and look after him on the trip. I'm fairly sure none of this would be construed as 'deliberately siphoning off' assets. xxTinaT
Of course he'd need me to do his insulin ;) and... to share the memories he won't be able to retain himself. I'd have to take him at least 2000 photos :D

Ah, I don't know, sitting here smiling, but not sure what for really. I mean, this whole money thing is a real joke when it comes to care.

Beverley x
 

Skye

Registered User
Aug 29, 2006
17,000
SW Scotland
Beverley, if your dad is up to the trip, then go for it. He's entitled to a holiday, and to pay for a carer to accompany him.

Only your dad's money will be taken into account if he has to go into care, you won't be expected to pay for him.

As for the house, if it's in your name, it's not considered at all. If it's in your dad's name, it still won't be counted as long as you continue to live in it.
 

BeverleyY

Registered User
Jan 29, 2008
716
Ashford, Kent
Beverley, if your dad is up to the trip, then go for it. He's entitled to a holiday, and to pay for a carer to accompany him.

Only your dad's money will be taken into account if he has to go into care, you won't be expected to pay for him.

As for the house, if it's in your name, it's not considered at all. If it's in your dad's name, it still won't be counted as long as you continue to live in it.
It's mine any my husbands. Mum & Dad sold their house 5 years ago before moving in with me. They did give me my inheritance then so that I could afford a home big enough for us all, but their names have never ever been on the deeds etc.

For now, Dad is in perfect physical health, and although he won't remember the trip when he comes home, I know he will love it at the time - and that, is as much as I can hope for - that he lives for the moment, and is happy enjoying himself.

I'll take him with my sister. My Mum will be looking down smiling on us I am sure telling us to take care of him.

Beverley x
 

Tender Face

Account Closed
Mar 14, 2006
5,379
NW England
Something dawned on me the other day, SS can withdrawer help if they can prove that the person dwindled their capital to evade paying for care.... BUT....
I am so with you there Beverley ....... if mum could only understand the meaning of capital!!!!!! (hasn't coped with a bank or utility statement for several years!!!) :eek: Hiding a 'few quid' in her slippers hardly amounts to benefit fraud!!!!! :)

Here's me, pondering whether to spend some of her modest savings on a new patio door for her ... if I don't soon it will fall out anyway .... :(but I am balancing mum's ability to cope with change (a Yale lock on her front foor caused so much grief for a while) ....... with spending money she can afford ....... is that 'investment' in her property? ... or reducing her savings????

If we invest in her property is that not investing towards NH fees we may have to pay in the future?

All b****dy ridiculous .... oh that she was well enough and my family was in a situation we could all escort her on a world cruise and give her the time of her life she and dad worked so hard for ......

Ho hum .....

Karen, x
 

jenniferpa

Registered User
Jun 27, 2006
39,448
Karen I realize that you realize that putting in a new door is a perfectly legitimate expense but for anyone who reads this later, I just want to emphasize that point. It is a perfectly reasonable thing to do - you're maintaining the fabric of her biggest asset: her house. Whether she could cope with a new door is another matter entirely because we all know how such things can be problematic.
 

BeverleyY

Registered User
Jan 29, 2008
716
Ashford, Kent
To be honest, somedays I panic thinking, that would be deemed wasting.. and then others I think.. no.. for god's sake, they can't expect these people - who through no fault of their own - find themselves will these illnesses. Why the hell should they not be able to treat themselves??

I'm pondering getting Dad a new TV. He does have one, but the freeview box is not inbuilt, and so to put it on takes the combination of 2 remote controls (which confuses me let alone him!). I'm thinking, big screen - loves football, inbuilt freeview one button - simple! Watching a match will keep him from sitting and falling into depression without my Mum.

Beverley x
 

Tender Face

Account Closed
Mar 14, 2006
5,379
NW England
you're maintaining the fabric of her biggest asset: her house.
:) I am sorry but I totally disagree - her biggest asset is herself ...... her confidence, her independence and her self esteem ...... so what her patio door looks a bit tatty? - as long as it functions and she is not distressed by a new 'mechanism'...... I feel I am better investing in her continued well-being by NOT using 'liquid assets' than investing them in her potential for NH fees ......

I am using this as a pure example (I warned you this thread had serious 'undertones!!!!! :))

The pressure of being EPA, to me, is balancing the correlation between 'playing accountant' and balancing the immediate welfare needs ...... which would be a far easier exercise if we were to have any inkling when 'the music might stop'.....

For now, I just want mum to be able to enjoy the music .....

If she decides she wants new doors, she will have them. It's her money. Her house needs them. She doesn't.

Does that make sense?

Karen, x
 

jenniferpa

Registered User
Jun 27, 2006
39,448
Well clearly yes - but the EPA is about money rather than anything else. Of course it makes perfect sense Karen - you spend her money in ways that makes her feel good: what could be more sensible than that? Still if it made her feel good to have something done to her biggest (material) asset, you could do it.
 

Tender Face

Account Closed
Mar 14, 2006
5,379
NW England
That's my point, Jennifer - it wouldn't make her feel good ..... it would distress her to have to cope with something new.... aesthetically it would be an improvement and small investment in terms of her house ..... but aesthethically pleasing and mum's dementia don't go .... When and if it becomes an essential I will somehow have to manage it ......

Karen, x
 

connie

Registered User
Mar 7, 2004
9,519
Frinton-on-Sea
Beverly, you made the point:
I'm pondering getting Dad a new TV.
I would say, if that is what you are thinking, do it sooner rather than later. Sounds as if dad could cope with something new 'right now'.

Would be a great pity to lose a good time slot, in terms of his ability. Remember when lionel decided to buy new TV, Video,DVD.



from the day it was installed he could not operate it himself
We left it 'too late'.
 

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