keeping POA secret?

[Allypally52]

Hi everyone - just a quick query needing an answer/others opinions. Recently after a continual resounding 'not yet!' because he couldn't grasp how it worked, my very stubborn, proud of his financial prowess (which now means confusion with all his affairs) moderate dementia suffering dad suddenly asked about 'that thing to help with handling my money.' So to our amazement he co-operated with form filling and we applied for both POA's. Last week we received the email saying after 4 weeks it would be valid. I've just been staying with dad and in the post he'd received his 2 notifications where he has time to object.
I didn't give them to him but now feel unsure if I've done something dishonest, or that might come back later to bite me in the bum!!! My reasoning is that this is what dad needs (and more so as he deteriorates) to help him and safeguard him. But he is so unpredictable and his memory so bad that he may have forgotten all about agreeing and then we would have an unpleasant time with him agitated and stroppy, thinking we're trying to control him. My husband feels it's in dad's best interests to just quietly put these letters up in the drawer with all his papers as if he's seen them and filed them away up there. I feel torn as this seems dishonest and a bit sneaky. Also having POA will make our life so much easier eventually so we have mixed motives.
We probably won't use them much at the moment, certainly not the health one as Dad can still express what he wants etc, and the financial one would only be used with dad's agreement at the moment.
Just wondering what people's perspective might be. Dad might be completely happy about it all but on the other hand.........oh, and if he should ever find them our get-out clause would have to be that he's just forgotten they were there so more dishonesty. I do understand about 'love lies' - is this one or is it one step too far?

 

[Wolfsgirl]

I think you have to be honest and give him his post. If he is not fit to deal with it appropriately then you will have no need to live with a bad conscience. You don't need to make a big deal of it, just pass him his post and ask if he would like a cuppa.

Reassure him if he does get agitated then perhaps reassure him with 'it was your good idea just in case it is ever needed'.

I understand your dilemma by trying to do the best for him, but you have to live with yourself and are obviously already fretting about this issue.

Let us know how it goes. Sharon x

Hi everyone - just a quick query needing an answer/others opinions. Recently after a continual resounding 'not yet!' because he couldn't grasp how it worked, my very stubborn, proud of his financial prowess (which now means confusion with all his affairs) moderate dementia suffering dad suddenly asked about 'that thing to help with handling my money.' So to our amazement he co-operated with form filling and we applied for both POA's. Last week we received the email saying after 4 weeks it would be valid. I've just been staying with dad and in the post he'd received his 2 notifications where he has time to object.
I didn't give them to him but now feel unsure if I've done something dishonest, or that might come back later to bite me in the bum!!! My reasoning is that this is what dad needs (and more so as he deteriorates) to help him and safeguard him. But he is so unpredictable and his memory so bad that he may have forgotten all about agreeing and then we would have an unpleasant time with him agitated and stroppy, thinking we're trying to control him. My husband feels it's in dad's best interests to just quietly put these letters up in the drawer with all his papers as if he's seen them and filed them away up there. I feel torn as this seems dishonest and a bit sneaky. Also having POA will make our life so much easier eventually so we have mixed motives.
We probably won't use them much at the moment, certainly not the health one as Dad can still express what he wants etc, and the financial one would only be used with dad's agreement at the moment.
Just wondering what people's perspective might be. Dad might be completely happy about it all but on the other hand.........oh, and if he should ever find them our get-out clause would have to be that he's just forgotten they were there so more dishonesty. I do understand about 'love lies' - is this one or is it one step too far?

 

[Feline]

Hi everyone - just a quick query needing an answer/others opinions. Recently after a continual resounding 'not yet!' because he couldn't grasp how it worked, my very stubborn, proud of his financial prowess (which now means confusion with all his affairs) moderate dementia suffering dad suddenly asked about 'that thing to help with handling my money.' So to our amazement he co-operated with form filling and we applied for both POA's. Last week we received the email saying after 4 weeks it would be valid. I've just been staying with dad and in the post he'd received his 2 notifications where he has time to object.
I didn't give them to him but now feel unsure if I've done something dishonest, or that might come back later to bite me in the bum!!! My reasoning is that this is what dad needs (and more so as he deteriorates) to help him and safeguard him. But he is so unpredictable and his memory so bad that he may have forgotten all about agreeing and then we would have an unpleasant time with him agitated and stroppy, thinking we're trying to control him. My husband feels it's in dad's best interests to just quietly put these letters up in the drawer with all his papers as if he's seen them and filed them away up there. I feel torn as this seems dishonest and a bit sneaky. Also having POA will make our life so much easier eventually so we have mixed motives.
We probably won't use them much at the moment, certainly not the health one as Dad can still express what he wants etc, and the financial one would only be used with dad's agreement at the moment.
Just wondering what people's perspective might be. Dad might be completely happy about it all but on the other hand.........oh, and if he should ever find them our get-out clause would have to be that he's just forgotten they were there so more dishonesty. I do understand about 'love lies' - is this one or is it one step too far?

Difficult one, are you saying he sometimes lacks capacity or not? I think I would verbally ask if he remembers filling in the forms and is he still happy with that and depending on his reply , you could explain again how he came to that decision,which might just jog his memory, or maybe bring up POA about someone fictitious and see if he remembers filling in the forms. Your husband may be right, either way you sound as if you are trying to act for the best on his behalf and that's what it's all about anyway.

 

[1954]

We did not give my MIL the forms because it would serve no purpose and we all don't feel bad about it

 

[MrsTerryN]

My mother was happy for me to have the poa. However I don't ever bring up that I am acting on her behalf for example dad's pensions etc

 

[Noorza]

I told mum about applying for carers allowance after 20 years of caring without it, she has concluded it is a fraudulent claim, the police should be called, solicitors should be called in, then calls me saying will still be her carer as I am her right arm.

Consider if they can process the information, if it will cause harm or distress to them, or is hiding it a kindness. Then you will have your answer.

 

[Jess26]

He suggested it, he willingly signed the forms. The piece of paper is simply confirmation of the fact. It's not as if you tricked or coerced him into signing. My brother and I didn't feel the need to show the confirmation to mum.

 

[marionq]

I find that if I give my husband forms he studies them for hours and is no wiser at the end. This only confuses and worries him as he feels they must be important but can't figure out why. I would put the papers with other documents and forget about them until necessary.

 

[jeany123]

I never show my husband any post before I read it now, If I think he might worry about it I don't show him it at all, He used to shred them before I got a chance to read them so I had to put the shredder in the other room,
I can't see any benefit from showing your Dad but if you feel guilty about it you are going to have to decide what you feel comfortable with yourself x

 

[Sue J]

Hi AllyPally

I think your feelings are that you would be doing something that you are not happy with keeping it from your Dad. I would try and carefully pick your moment, which I know is very difficult to do, and get on the subject and if you think he is in the mood to cooperate show him the papers, obviously reminding him it is what he requested.

I have EO symptoms and adapting to not being in control of my own affairs I find very difficult to come to terms with. Past symptoms of extreme paranoia would not be helped in anyway by anyone hiding any information from me (but that is me, everyone is different). When you can't find things in your own environment, I live alone, and have no recollection of putting something in an odd place during my bad phases it is very disconcerting to say the least. However, I do know when I have received important papers and try my best to deal with them appropriately, I would know if someone else put them away (I have a HH) and it would make me feel more vulnerable if it had been done without my knowledge.

The fact that your Dad asked 'about the thing with handling money' is demonstrating his willingness/acknowledgement to hand over something which is very difficult for him.

Don't know if any of that helps but I hope you find away to keep your Dad Ok about it but get the control you need to look after him in the best way which you're obviously trying to do.
Best wishes
Sue

 

[Beate]

It's not dishonest. Your Dad willingly agreed to an LPA, that's all that counts. I never bother OH with his post, I see no point. Why would you go through the aggro of him potentially making a fuss now?

 

[Spamar]

Agree with Beate. I never show OH his post except birthday/ Father's Day cards and he doesn't understand the latter. Thought it was his birthday. He agreed to LPA, that's all I need to know.

 

[cragmaid]

If you think that Dad will understand what they are and carry on with process, let him see them, but, and this is my opinion, if you think that it will cause disruption or cause him to fret about losing control or even have him call the whole thing off then you need to file them and say no more. One think I would say, even if Dad does not need you to take control of his finances yet, I would try to get his bank account set with internet access so that you can keep an eye on things for him, without taking over completely.

I filled the forms in for Mum because she was also going blind and was unable to manage her affairs. I dealt with all her post for a long time, otherwise she would "file" everything often in the shredder!!!

 

[Raggedrobin]

I'm afraid I would hide them, too. I hate to be dishonest and it goes against the whole relationship of trust in a family, but I think the way it is worded it invites you to object and as we all know people with dementia might well pick up on this and worry at it. All that matters in my view is that you are doing whatever is in your Dad's best interests with the PoA

 

[SoyHJ]

Yes, I wouldn't mention them either. Your Dad actually brought the subject up in the first place, he was happy to sign so there was no dishonesty or going behind his back then. I seriously think that, if he is now shown the letter, he may well become fixated on it and become agitated and worried which will benefit nobody, least of all him. You are doing everything with the best of intentions and, in normal circumstances, of course you would show him any letters but these are no longer normal circumstances.

 

[KingB]

I think it would be best all round to just pop them in the drawer. If you show them to him & he goes into reverse on the issue then I think that would be very detrimental to him in the long run. So, for his sake, if it were me I would do that. I try to be honest and above board with my mum and dad - but where it would actually be against their best interests I take the pragmatic view. I think your husband is right - and from what you wrote I think your heart agrees.

 

[Norfolkgirl]

Hi everyone - just a quick query needing an answer/others opinions. Recently after a continual resounding 'not yet!' because he couldn't grasp how it worked, my very stubborn, proud of his financial prowess (which now means confusion with all his affairs) moderate dementia suffering dad suddenly asked about 'that thing to help with handling my money.' So to our amazement he co-operated with form filling and we applied for both POA's. Last week we received the email saying after 4 weeks it would be valid. I've just been staying with dad and in the post he'd received his 2 notifications where he has time to object.
I didn't give them to him but now feel unsure if I've done something dishonest, or that might come back later to bite me in the bum!!! My reasoning is that this is what dad needs (and more so as he deteriorates) to help him and safeguard him. But he is so unpredictable and his memory so bad that he may have forgotten all about agreeing and then we would have an unpleasant time with him agitated and stroppy, thinking we're trying to control him. My husband feels it's in dad's best interests to just quietly put these letters up in the drawer with all his papers as if he's seen them and filed them away up there. I feel torn as this seems dishonest and a bit sneaky. Also having POA will make our life so much easier eventually so we have mixed motives.
We probably won't use them much at the moment, certainly not the health one as Dad can still express what he wants etc, and the financial one would only be used with dad's agreement at the moment.
Just wondering what people's perspective might be. Dad might be completely happy about it all but on the other hand.........oh, and if he should ever find them our get-out clause would have to be that he's just forgotten they were there so more dishonesty. I do understand about 'love lies' - is this one or is it one step too far?

How about taking a photocopy and then use that one to check his reaction in case he tries to tear it up? If he's happy then file the original away. If not, then try again another day and see if same reaction and then you might be in a better position to decide?

 

[Allypally52]

Thank you so much to everyone who has replied (sorry I've been off the radar for a few days, down at dad's sorting out his sudden total deafness which we've discovered is because he's been using a battery operated plastic contraption ordered from Biotonic which claims to remove ear wax but is actually useless apart from pushing the wax further in and/or damaging his eardrum. I hate Biotonic!!!!)
Just to fill you in - we decided to compromise and my husband has shown Dad the financial POA and Dad smiled and gave him the thumbs up (although he has no idea exactly what power he is handing over to my husband, just thinks he now has a general dogsbody to send on errands to the bank etc. And for now that is probably all it will be. One step at a time.....) But we haven't mentioned the health POA as he has no memory of signing the forms and it's not useable until someone officially says dad has lost mental capacity to make his own decisions. So we decided best keep quiet until the time comes......probably sooner rather than later now.
So all's well that ends well. Today at least and in the words of Scarlett O'Hara 'tomorrow is another day'