Mother with AD being taken advantage of?

[Vicky C]

My mother is in the moderate phase of AD. She has always been quite trusting in nature (she's kind of all for you, or all against you!) and she has always been bad with money.

Anyway, she's giving money hand over fist to an adult family member. She doesn't have any savings, so the damage at least is limited to her weekly pension. I've tried to address it with her countless times and she either looks at me defiantly, or denies it. When she denies it, I do think she has genuinely forgotten, but I can't be certain. I've also tried to address it with him but he just explodes and it goes nowhere.

I buy all the groceries and pay most of the bills (when she doesn't hide them), so I do my best to see to it that she isn't left without. However, it's a HUGE injustice to her, and if I'm honest, I'm sick of footing the bill almost as though she has no income.

She agreed to give up her ATM card. She thinks this is because she kept forgetting the PIN, but is really because she had handed card and PIN over and the account was emptied more than once. However, she withdraws the lot and seems to hand most of it over.

I'm looking for practical solutions/ideas please! I used to give her cash to pay her bills, then changed that to lodging to her account to meet direct debits and I know have most of them coming from my account or I engage in this mad last-minute dash to her bank to lodge the evening before the direct debit is due.

She has signed a PoA appointing me, but (a) I don't think she's as entirely incapable of managing her affairs as would be required to register it in Ireland, and (b) I don't want to take all control from her. I know I'm asking people to give me impossible solutions!

Sorry for length of post, hope it wasn't too off-putting. However, I typed every word of it without crying, which I didn't expect Probably 'cos I'm angry right now, the tears will surely return!

 

[carastro]

This is a difficult one. However if you have been appointed POA then you should be able to get some control.

If she's given up her ATM card then how is money currently being withrawn?

Once the bank has a copy of the POA you should be able to operate her bank account (and she can too while she has capability), so you should be able to withdraw money on her behalf and just give her a small amount of money at a time leaving the remainder to pay for the bills.

Not sure about Irish registration so can't comment on that.
I only know about the old style EPA where mum and I could use it until she got to the point of not being capable of managing her affairs herself and so we were obliged at that stage to register it. At this point the bank will not recognise mum's signature and now only recognise mine and my brother's (who is the 2nd POA), I pay mum's bills for her and draw money out when she needs it by transferring it to my own account as we are not allowed a till card any more and this is what the bank told me I would have to do. I keep accounts and records of all transactions.

Not sure if any of this helps.

Carastro

 

[Vicky C]

Hi Carastro,

Thanks very much for replying. Sorry, my post was a bit unclear. She is going into the branch and withdrawing cash over the counter.

It's all a bit of a mess.

Thank you.

 

[cathy baldwin]

Hi Vicky

This is a very difficult situation for you to cope with. Can I suggest you give our helpline a call as there are possibly wider issues that need to be considered here to safeguard your mum?

0300 222 11 22

 

[angelface]

In England you can be an appointee to receive your mums pension from the DWP. Does it work in Ireland ?

 

[Vicky C]

Angelface,

Thanks a million, progress

She has a state pension, paid through the post office, and a small work pension paid into the bank. I have phoned the pensions section in social welfare and they're sending me out a form which will deal with the one to the post office.

She actually had a bit of a "turn" yesterday when she was at the bank (she's been having TIAs). I'll suggest that I be nominee to save her the bother of going to the post office and see what she thinks.

Thanks.

 

[Carabosse]

At the two banks up here we use we are on first name basis or at least they know us, if that is the case with yourself and your mum you could have a quiet word with the bank about whats been going on and maybe ask them to limit what she can take out or tell her she hasn't got enough funds to take anything out.
I know you don't really want to stop your mum having control of things but under the circumstances where money is concerned I think you need to take control at least until this other family member gets the message that they are getting no more money, have you considered having a word with the Police then dropping it into a conversation with this family member, as its not fair on you having to sort things out when no money is available.

 

[Lowlander]

Vicky C,
If your Mum was previously not giving money to the family member, if she cannot pay her own bills on time, if you are having to subsidise her, etc, it sounds to me as if she does not have capacity to manage her own finances.
As someone with her P of A you have a very real duty to do this for her.
You can have all her monies from the 2 sources paid into a new attorney account from which you would pay all her outgoings.
You could then transfer some ie small amount, into her account if you really feel she can cope with that, or perhaps, just needs that bit of independence. You would have to arrange that, under no circumstances, would her bank let her overdraw.

I was very loath to operate an attorney account for my husband. It was for me an emotional thing. I hadn't wanted to admit things had got to that stage.
I hope you can sort this out.
Best wishes
L

 

[zeeeb]

Can you set up another account that she's unaware of account numbers etc, that she won't have a card to. Then set the pension to go into that one, you can put in some pocket money in "her account" which she has the card to, and all the bills, you can pay from the other account, which you only will have the card and account details to. That way, if she goes into the bank, there will be only a small amount of pocket money available, and if she uses her card, it will decline if it's anything more than what is available.

If you have POA, you have every right to take over her bank account so she doesn't spend all her money on things she can't afford (like giving money away). That money she has is there to pay her bills, and care needs. As long as you keep the receipts for everything so that you can't be accused of spending money on things that aren't for her needs, there wouldn't be a problem.

When she asks why her account has no money, tell her that she always goes to the bank and takes the money out, and then forgets. Speak to the bank, so they have a note on file, saying that she has dementia and that she is not to be given more than is available in that bank account because she has been giving money away and losing money.

I have recently put the lions share of my step grandfathers money into a term deposit to keep it safe, as it is half his wife's money. That way he can't go spending money that she may need for her care needs (they are in different nursing homes, she has dementia, he doesn't, but likes to spend alot of money publishing books and buying computers etc.)