If I attempt to enter the CH the police will be called

[Mr_Angry]

Following my complaints to the CH yesterday over my fathers mail being intercepted and their claims that he is happy there when he is not I have now been informed that if I attempt to contact my father the police will be called as I dispalyed aggressive behaviour to the staff.

When care staff call my father 'mental', 'brain-washed' and accuse him of being a liar then I will raise my voice. My father accompanied me to the door and I told the staff to explain to him why he could not leave with me this they claim was me being aggressive and trying to take my father away. Given the management culture of threats, lies and lack of care I have requested that SS have him removed. I would be happy for the CH to call the police as their is a lot I could tell them but from my experience of the police they are likely to side with SS.

This is a sick country.

 

[Bob S]

Mr Angry,

How have they informed you not to visit your father, have they done it in writing?

 

[diablo]

Best to be polite to them and move him somewhere else I reckon.

 

[Bristolbelle]

Beat then at thier own game....

Ring the local police station tell them of your concerns and tell them they are more than welcome to attend the CH with you as you could actually do witness on your side as you and your father are the victims of institutionalised bullying. Unless of course there are any restraining orders in place iwhich case you will have to take a different approach (not accusing you of anything I know how they can be used though).
Alternatively tell them you will be visiting and when and tell them you will have a dictaphone running throughout the visit for both your protection and thiers and invite them to do the same. Of course you will need one. Also ring the the emergency social services number and explain your concerns so there is a record being mantained away form the CH too.

 

[Mr_Angry]

Beat them at their own game

Interesting point raised.

Yes I would be happy for the police to attend I may just do as you suggest. Must admit I doubt the police would come.

If you read back through my posts you will find I did use a dictaphone when talking with my father. The CH threatened me with police action on that instance as well.

Contacted the SW and copied CH and my lawyer.

 

[grobertson62]

wow I know I haven't been dealing with dementia long & am fortunate that in the 6 weeks dad has been in a nursing home I have not encountered any of this

So I have to say I am gobsmacked by how different some of these homes are

is there not some legislation on how these homes are run?
it seems the louder people complain the more they are in the wrong & not the home

Surely this cannot be right! I just don't get it. we place loved ones in their care & trust

There must surely be someone out there who you can go to when that trust has been smashed

I wish I could offer words of advice or comfort but I am lost for words.

This is the 21st century & yet some homes are run as if they are in the 19th century

Is it they are scared to lose a fee paying client/reputation?

If the SS isn't prepared to act & police can't help, what about MPs? after all you are a constituent.

GILL

 

[Bob S]

The attitudes of some care home managersleave much to be desired. The matron of my father's care home has ignored two letters from my mother instructing her to regard my sister and I as next of kin, in addition to my mother, for the purposes of passing on information about my father and his care. Twice the matron has button holed a vulnerable and frail lady of 88 and told bullied her into rescinding the written instructions (according to the matron my mother has told her not to pass information to me, something my mother denies vehemently).

So yes, there are some out there who think they can do what they like, and the system doesn't seem to do much to rein them in.

 

[jenniferpa]

I've been thinking about this a lot Mr Angry.

Even if you are absolutely right in everything you say, the reality is that the person who is now suffering is your father, as he is no longer allowed to have visits from his son.

If it was my parent, I'd swallow my vocal anger and eat humble pie. Note I'm not saying I wouldn't pursue the whole "why is in in here when he doesn't want to be" angle everywhere else, but I think would do my level best to ensure that I could visit, even if that meant biting my tongue until it was bleeding, even in a less than perfect home.

When you "raise your voice" in a situation like this, no matter the provocation, it can be very difficult to regain the lost moral high ground. I hope you can, but I fear that bridge may have been burnt, at least in the short term.

I really do understand how frustration can override a person's best intentions, but you need to recognise that anger has got you into this specific situation but it won't get you out.

Just my opinion.

 

[cmnotz]

Anger ...

I too have been thinking about this and have posted similar in another thread:

I am not a SW but do work within the sector and see a great deal of anger resulting in misunderstandings and more anger. I have mediated in meetings where there was so much aggression that no outcome was achievable ... which I think is where you are now!

SW are people too and they individually have a right to be treated politely; in fact they are trained to warn during phone calls and meetings that they will end the call/meeting if the aggression continues. If a caller ignore that warning and continues to be abusive it suggests the caller is not listening.

As Jenniferpa says the person who is now suffering as a consequence is a man in a care home without contact from his loving and supportive son.

I am quite sure that you are not as you portray yourself in this forum,becasue if you are you would possibly be in hospital with all manner of stress related illnesses, BUT unfortunately your manner may actually be causing concerns for Social Services because you anger appears to be uncontrollable, and you show signs of following illogical courses of action in your determination to have your own way; so how does that make you a safe and reliable person to have your father's best interests at heart?

SS, CH, PCT ... none of these are your enemy ... your anger is the enemy and unless you get it under control you will continue in this wasteful expending of energy without achieving the goal of your Dad living where he needs to live in a safe and caring environment.

I do hope you can find a calm place inside your heart where you can find the courage to do the right thing now.

Cathy

 

[Mr_Angry]

Anger

So requesting a meeting for the last six months with SS is an illogical course of action? Asking for a copy of the mental capacity test they claim to have carried out is an illogical course of action? Is it logical to keep my father in a care home in which after 3 days of care he sustained an injury requiring hospital treatment for 8 weeks?

I would welcome suggestions as to what approach I should take as I am seeking facts and to date all the care agencies have refused to provide them.

 

[JPG1]

Mr Angry, I've been thinking about your situation, and that of your father too.

But I'm not quite sure what to say after reading cmnotz's post. I'm sure she didn't wish to seem so judgemental, because misunderstandings can sometimes be created by social workers too, and if they refuse to amend their stance, it's hardly surprising that you have become angry.

It's only your posts that I comment on, Mr Angry, because I know only what you have written about your situation. I know nothing of the SW's point of view.

Re. your latest post: I see as totally logical, the course of action that you have pondered, and that you have posted about recently.

I think Bristolbelle may have come to the same conclusion as me. Your motivation in all of this is your father's well-being, and if the SS or the CH would only answer your questions, your anger would have been calmed long before it surfaced. The IMCA involvement was guaranteed to stir your passion - and it has had the same effect with a friend of mine who is also being severely challenged by the systems in place at present. (He made a formal complaint to the LA and that has resulted in a very different position being taken by the SS. A meeting was arranged before you could blink almost; documentation was produced - and further challenges ensued, because the documentation was completely false; an assessment of capacity had not been carried out .... and so it goes on.)

A final thought: if you are told you cannot visit your father without the police being called, that is something I would put in writing to the CH and SS and whoever else you can think of - and ask for a reply within 7 days. Send a copy to your MP too, and invite him/her to climb on board to help you.

 

[Mr_Angry]

meeting

I suggested to SS that when they next visit my father that I also attend that the meeting is recorded and that all parties receive a copy which they can sign if they are in agreeement. Also informed them I welcomed the police involvement as I still haven't got a clue about the events that caused my father to end up in hospital other than SS say my father told care staff not to inform me. I noticed that comment on other posts here perhaps its part of the handbook. Perhaps someone with contacts in SS can confirm that?

 

[cmnotz]

Perceptions

I am not being judgemental ... I am offering a viewpoint that how anyone is perceived in any situation is based on the information available - and that is especially true in an online environment.

In this forum, in most of his threads, Mr Angry comes across as just that ... and if that is how he also comes across to SS they are reacting to that. It may well be that Mr Angry's anger is a reaction to SS or the CH. I am not saying that SS are right and that Mr Angry is wrong but that the anger is getting in the way of finding a resolution.

Mr Angry ... no it is perfectly logical to ask for such information - but have you asked for it or have you demanded it? When it has not been provided have you asked for reasons or have you just come to the forum to express your anger.

There appears to be disagreement as to whether your Dad wants you informed of things or not and whilstever that situation is not resolved SS have to follow their codes of practice, they have to uphold his stated wishes if they believe he has capacity. I see that you disagree that it is his stated wish they are upholding and that is what you need to address first.

You asked elsewhere how to complain - If you do an internet search for Community Care and your local authority you will find out more information about how they work, their codes of practice and how to complain - being angry on this or any other forum will not resolve the situation and actually may make the situation far worse. Similarly they will provide you with information about how to make a complaint against the CH to its regulatory body, which has a duty to investigate your complaint.

I am suggesting channelling the anger into a proactive approach that gets what you want and what your Dad needs more quickly. Then channel it into addressing the shortcomings in the system that have caused you both so much distress.

 

[Jancis]

Analyse the tactics

In my own situation, my husband expressed extreme anger. I on the other hand being very undemonstrative by nature, sought any means of alternative strategy. Between us we managed to beat the system. Maybe you need another angle as the SS are simply adhering to their handbook and reacting to you as a stereotype i.e. "Mr Angry"?

 

[Mr_Angry]

Perceptions

I believe my father has capacity as for SS, when it is in there interest to say he lacks capacity they do so and when it is in there interest to say he does not lack capacity they say so. As for CH they just treat him like a child and threaten me each time I ask a question.

As you work in the field what would your answer be if I asked what is the ratio of care staff to residents at different points in the day? According to CH I have no right to ask that as I do not have POA over my father. Asked SS they have not responded. Seems a simple question what have they got to hide?

I have asked for the results of the mental capacity test as without that I can not plan my fathers future SS have not responded. My solicitor has asked for it again no response.

If you review my posts you will see I have gone through the formal complaints procedure with SS and have been ignored.

It is my fathers stated wish that he wishes to return to his home. He only went into the CH for respite. I don't see SS upholding his right on the contary they have wanted him in the CH from day one. Read the posts on top up fees and self funding and you may discover why both SS and CH are keen to keep him in a home despite his wishes.

 

[Mr_Angry]

The other angle

the other angle is simple - I hold the purse strings money talks when it comes to CH

 

[Jancis]

Hope that works!

 

[jenniferpa]

Hope that works!

So do I, but the problem is, refusing to pay for something that is presented as vital by professionals could be another mark against you.

Unfortunately, when it is decided you are in the wrong, even if unjustly, it's inevitable that everything you do will be seen in that light.

 

[Mr_Angry]

Payment

Did I say anything about refusing to pay? Money buys choices.

 

[jenniferpa]

Did I say anything about refusing to pay? Money buys choices.

True. I have always said that. It's the one advantage of being self-funded (normally) - you can have real choice (as I said, normally).