Protecting Husbands share of house

[Holdingittogether]

Hi All,

Mum has dementia and is in care. Dad is still living in the house he owns jointly with Mum. The children have financial and care LPAs in place for Mum.
I think the house is held jointly, rather than as ‘tenants in common’. (Need to check this). Are we right in thinking that if it’s held jointly, the house becomes part of Mum’s care cost calculations when Dad dies? Currently dad has a will leaving everything to Mum. He thought he’d set up a mirror will for Mum at the same time but the paperwork only shows a will for Dad and the solicitor has long since closed.
I’ve read on the forum that it’s probably too late to shelter Mums share of the house from care costs but we were thinking of the following for Dad:
1. Change the house deeds to tenants in common (this it seems can be done without requiring Mums involvement, else maybe the children could exercise this under the LPA?)
2. Set up a new will for Dad, leaving his share of the house to the children. I’m not clear if a new will could be set up for Mum, under LPA or personally.
In this way, I take it that Dads share of the house could not be taken into account for care costs?

 

[Cazzie63]

As your situation, my Mum is in a home and Dad lived in the house jointly owned with mum. Earlier this year, Dad decided he wanted to change his will and leave something to his children should he die before mum, we all thought this extremely unlikely. Joint tenancy was severed ( solicitor sent notification to mum, no agreement needed) and changed to tenants in common, Dad changed his will accordingly.
Unfortunately, Dad died unexpectedly a few months later (possible medical negligence). LA are now suggesting that the decision to sever the joint tenancy and change will is deprivation and are considering taking 100% value of the house into consideration for mums care costs. We have been told that Dad can do whatever he wants with his assets so cannot understand why the LA are considering deprivation. This is an ongoing issue so will update you on the outcome

 

[nitram]

I see @Cazzie63 has just posted.
Reading through their thread https://forum.alzheimers.org.uk/threads/deprivation-after-severing-a-joint-tenancy.119644/ will answer a lot of your questions.

I think the house is held jointly, rather than as ‘tenants in common’. (Need to check this).

You can check by going to https://www.gov.uk/search-property-information-land-registry and , assuming property is registered, pay £3 for a downloaded pdf of the title registration.
Look at 'section B proprietorship register'
If no restriction, it's joint tenancy
If tenants in common there will be a restriction
No disposition by a sole proprietor or the registered estate (except a trust corporation) under which capital money arises is to be registered unless authorised by an order of the court
to alert any conveyancing solicitor

Or you may get details by tracing closed solicitors files

the solicitor has long since closed.

Contact https://www.sra.org.uk/consumers/problems/solicitor-closed-down/ they should be able to trace relevant files including any lodged wills.

 

[Holdingittogether]

Thanks Cazzie and Nitram. That is helpful. I’ll take a look at the other thread as suggested and check the deeds. Do keep me updated Cazzie on your situation. Praying the outcome will be a just one for you and the family.

 

[nitram]

I’ll take a look at the other thread as suggested and check the deeds. Do keep me updated Cazzie on your situation.

If you go to the top of the other thread and click on 'watch thread' you should get a flag alert when anybody adds a post.

 

[Holdingittogether]

If you go to the top of the other thread and click on 'watch thread' you should get a flag alert when anybody adds a post.

Thanks nitram.
I’m assuming setting up a will for Mum, under LPA or otherwise, leaving the house etc to the children would definately fall under deprivation of assets?

 

[nitram]

An LPA normally cannot make a will on behalf of donor, there is an exception https://www.gov.uk/apply-statutory-will where the court decides the existing will is incorrect eg life time carer not rewarded and belief that the donor would expect them to be.

To make a will your Mum would have to be assessed as having testamentary capacity

Any deprivation of assets would relate to the current beneficiary's assets, presumable your Dad's.

 

[Am59]

Hi All,

Mum has dementia and is in care. Dad is still living in the house he owns jointly with Mum. The children have financial and care LPAs in place for Mum.
I think the house is held jointly, rather than as ‘tenants in common’. (Need to check this). Are we right in thinking that if it’s held jointly, the house becomes part of Mum’s care cost calculations when Dad dies? Currently dad has a will leaving everything to Mum. He thought he’d set up a mirror will for Mum at the same time but the paperwork only shows a will for Dad and the solicitor has long since closed.
I’ve read on the forum that it’s probably too late to shelter Mums share of the house from care costs but we were thinking of the following for Dad:
1. Change the house deeds to tenants in common (this it seems can be done without requiring Mums involvement, else maybe the children could exercise this under the LPA?)
2. Set up a new will for Dad, leaving his share of the house to the children. I’m not clear if a new will could be set up for Mum, under LPA or personally.
In this way, I take it that Dads share of the house could not be taken into account for care costs?

Hi, i've spoken to a Solicitor about setting up a tenants in common agreement as my husband has Parkinson's dementia, to at least protect my half of the house in case something happened to me first and he was still alive and needing care. It's too late to leave my husband's share to the children (all grown up) as this would be seen as deprivation of assets I think. A lot of solicitor's offer free advice to help you decide what to do.

 

[Holdingittogether]

Hi, i've spoken to a Solicitor about setting up a tenants in common agreement as my husband has Parkinson's dementia, to at least protect my half of the house in case something happened to me first and he was still alive and needing care. It's too late to leave my husband's share to the children (all grown up) as this would be seen as deprivation of assets I think. A lot of solicitor's offer free advice to help you decide what to do.

Thanks Am59,
I raised this recently with a friend who is a solicitor and have just heard back. They consulted a colleague with experience of this and agreed that it was sensible to change the house deeds to tenants in common (this can be done without a solicitor but requires a fee for the change. All the information is on the Land Registry website. The process is known as adding a “Form A Restriction”. It doesn’t require the other owners agreement which may avoid any argument that the dementia sufferer didn’t know what they were agreeing too.
Dad will then draw up a will leaving his share of the house to the children. I’ve used a Lawpack diy Will before, downloadable for a modest fee from the internet.