Bank Account and EPA

[HannahHare]

Please can anyone help? We are debating whether the time has come to register mother's enduring power of attorney.

I have a third party mandate on mother's bank account. If (and I KNOW it is going to be When!) we register, what happens to her bank account? Is it still run in her name using the card and cheque books I have been issued with and if so can the other attorney be added to the account.

Mother by that time will, we think be unable to write cheques herself. I am sorry to be so dim, this is a new and unexpected path we are treading and I know some of you are much further along


Thank you in anticipation

 

[nitram]

You will be able to run the account on behalf of your mother but theaccount name will be changed to something like 'HannaHare , POA HannaHares Mum' The exact wording varies with banks.

The account number will most likely stay the same, but you will be issued with new cards and chequebook.

 

[HannahHare]

You will be able to run the account on behalf of your mother but theaccount name will be changed to something like 'HannaHare , POA HannaHares Mum' The exact wording varies with banks.

The account number will most likely stay the same, but you will be issued with new cards and chequebook.

Thank you so much, it is only a small thing but it had been worrying me. That's one more thing I can cross off my 3 o'clock panic list.

 

[elizabet]

When I took over running my Mum's financial affairs at the start I found it useful to have more than one copy of the LPA document as her main bank needed to see the LPA document, another took a photocopy of it .I also carried my passport with me as I was asked to identify myself.
This may be of use to you .
I was issued with a bank card, cheque book etc which had my Mother's name on it but then said my name and then POA for Mrs Brown. I was thus able to sign cheques on her behalf-however, as soon as your relative dies the POA stops.

 

[HannahHare]

When I took over running my Mum's financial affairs at the start I found it useful to have more than one copy of the LPA document as her main bank needed to see the LPA document, another took a photocopy of it .I also carried my passport with me as I was asked to identify myself.
This may be of use to you .
I was issued with a bank card, cheque book etc which had my Mother's name on it but then said my name and then POA for Mrs Brown. I was thus able to sign cheques on her behalf-however, as soon as your relative dies the POA stops.

Thank you Elizabet,I keep thinking of more and more things we will have to do/people to notify and will take on board your suggestion of carrying my passport for id. I am so glad to have found this forum and it is lovely that people will take the time to help a complete stranger when you all have your own problems and worries.

 

[scared daughter]

Oh yes, I carry ID with me, my card states I am a deputy I have Cour ot Protection, mum didn't complete her POA = kept putting it off then fell and was so poorly and lost capacity.

I'm finding most places are very good, your drivers licence is a good one too, it has a photos and your address on it x

 

[Lily2789]

My husband and His sister have just been to NatWest with registered EPA, for MIL and they do not issued new cards or cheque books with the POA names on them, although we're offered debit cards.They were told they carry on using the originals but are able to sign cheques etc.

 

[HannahHare]

Oh yes, I carry ID with me, my card states I am a deputy I have Cour ot Protection, mum didn't complete her POA = kept putting it off then fell and was so poorly and lost capacity.

I'm finding most places are very good, your drivers licence is a good one too, it has a photos and your address on it x

That must be a nightmare - when mother was OK she was always so pragmatic and had the PofA drawn up eight years ago. Now we are starting to need it and she is frantically trying to hold on to what control she has. Think I will have to renew my passport (can't see me going anywhere in the foreseeable future but can see how useful it will be)

 

[HannahHare]

My husband and His sister have just been to NatWest with registered EPA, for MIL and they do not issued new cards or cheque books with the POA names on them, although we're offered debit cards.They were told they carry on using the originals but are able to sign cheques etc.

That's interesting Lily as mother is with NatWest and they helpfully got me a third party mandate with debit card (and a cheque book!) so I suppose we could carry on using those and when PofA is registered just add the other attorney to allow them to have a proper card.

 

[carastro]

I registered my mum's EPA a year ago and some of the answers above have not been my experience.

My mum's bank (First Direct) told me that once the EPA is registered that they will no longer recognise mum's signature only the attorneys (though this has not been an issue). They would no longer let me have a card (as that can only be used by the donor) and I cannot use internet banking (again for the donor). The account name has not changed.

Otherwise I can operate mum's bank account as if it was my own, pay cheques, make standing orders send internet payments. I have to telephone to ask them to organise payments unless they are regular.

Regarding her spending money (i.e. the amount she is legally allocated £23.90 per week - she is in a Nursing Home) I chose to have this transferred weekly into a separate account in my own name so it is easier for me to administer and also to keep it separate from her capital (i.e. SS assessments). Then if she needs anything it is easier for me to get at.

Whatever you do though make sure you keep accurate records and receipts of spending in case the PGO want to see them.

Just to say though, even if you have things sorted at the moment that you have a legal duty as an Attorney to register the EPA once your MIL has lost mental capacity.

HTH

Carastro

 

[Saffie]

Oh yes, I carry ID with me, my card states I am a deputy

Are you meaning a Debit card?
If not, is this necessary?
I've been a Deputy for nearly 3 years and have never had an occasion when an ID card would have been needed.
Actually, I don't carry the Deputyship Debit card around with me either unless I'm going to the Building Society to pay a cheque into my husband's account. I'm too afraid of losing it!(If you knew me you would know that there is every possibility of that!) Anything I buy for my husband pay for and write a cheque for it later from his account.
I'm interested in when an ID card would be necessary and how you obtained it - if you wouldn't mind saying.

 

[HannahHare]

I registered my mum's EPA a year ago and some of the answers above have not been my experience.

My mum's bank (First Direct) told me that once the EPA is registered that they will no longer recognise mum's signature only the attorneys (though this has not been an issue). They would no longer let me have a card (as that can only be used by the donor) and I cannot use internet banking (again for the donor). The account name has not changed.

Otherwise I can operate mum's bank account as if it was my own, pay cheques, make standing orders send internet payments. I have to telephone to ask them to organise payments unless they are regular.

Regarding her spending money (i.e. the amount she is legally allocated £23.90 per week - she is in a Nursing Home) I chose to have this transferred weekly into a separate account in my own name so it is easier for me to administer and also to keep it separate from her capital (i.e. SS assessments). Then if she needs anything it is easier for me to get at.

Whatever you do though make sure you keep accurate records and receipts of spending in case the PGO want to see them.

Just to say though, even if you have things sorted at the moment that you have a legal duty as an Attorney to register the EPA once your MIL has lost mental capacity.

HTH

Carastro

Oh dear! I was kind of counting on being able to use internet banking. From what I have read it seems to vary from one organisation and in some cases comes down to the individual you deal with. Do you mind me asking, did you register it yourself or use a solicitor?

 

[Saffie]

Regarding her spending money (i.e. the amount she is legally allocated £23.90 per week - she is in a Nursing Home) I chose to have this transferred weekly into a separate account in my own name so it is easier for me to administer and also to keep it separate from her capital (i.e. SS assessments). Then if she needs anything it is easier for me to get at.

I do this too but - into an account in my husband's own name in a Building society. It does make it separate from what capital he has remaining for the NH fees etc. I have a debit card with my name on it and Deputy for .... added.

I also have internet banking with this BS as I arranged for an internet ISA, so no problem at all.

 

[Lily2789]

Hi again,
I had LPA for my late dear Dad, and third party mandate with Nat West, although I never did receive a Debit Card. When I went to register the POA with the bank, their advice was just to carry on with the mandate, which I did, my Dad didn't have dementia so that worked fine, really only needed POA for dealing with DWP and the like. Regarding Internet Banking, Nat West did offer this to my husband and his sister. I think it sometimes depends who you deal with and which bank. Also one thing Nat West did say MIL could sign cheques if she wished this puzzles me !!!!!
Good Luck with it all x

 

[HannahHare]

Thank you all for your replies, I was hoping I would be able to carry on with the third party mandate. Bank set me up with internet banking so I can keep an eye on everything. Doesn't help that I live several hours away.

I have a feeling this will not be my last thread - so many things to think about, trying to do the right thing and keep one jump ahead.

 

[carastro]

Do you mind me asking, did you register it yourself or use a solicitor?

I am so sorry I haven't been back on the forum for a few months as mum is settled in her Nursing home and I have had other problems to deal with like my daughter's marriage breaking up and much acrimony from her husband and her having to move.

It's probably too late to answer the question above, but YES I did register it myself. I downloaded the forms and instructions from the internet. So all it cost was the registration fee.

Carastro

 

[Pickles53]

My husband and His sister have just been to NatWest with registered EPA, for MIL and they do not issued new cards or cheque books with the POA names on them, although we're offered debit cards.They were told they carry on using the originals but are able to sign cheques etc.

Hi my mum is also with NatWest and they accepted an unregistered EPOA as sufficient to issue a debit card in my name plus cheque book with 'my name' POA for 'mum's name' on it. Also I have been able to set up online banking in my name which is a huge help as she doesn't live near me.

 

[DazeInOurLives]

Oh dear! I was kind of counting on being able to use internet banking. From what I have read it seems to vary from one organisation and in some cases comes down to the individual you deal with. Do you mind me asking, did you register it yourself or use a solicitor?

I have also used bank accounts with both my parents' LPAs with Santander (nightmare), Barclays and HSBC (First Direct) over the past 7 years. There is considerable inconsistency between (and even within) banks about how they do this.

At the time of setting up both Mum and I needed to be able to use direct debit cards, cheque books, telephone and Internet Banking. First Direct explained that this was not possible with an LPA only account and recommended that Mum and I opened the account as a joint account. This has worked well. Mum no longer uses her card and I have full authority to access internet banking.

Maybe that won't fit your circumstances, but I'd recommend not hesitating to switch banks to find the service that you need. You don't need a solicitor, but you will need to speak with someone senior at the bank, because general knowledge amongst staff about these matters is shamefully poor in my experience.

Good luck.