Living without a man

[Wolfie]

Hi, I'm not sure if this is a commonly raised issue but here goes. I am 61 and my husband, also 61, has Alzheimers and has been in a care home for the past 18 months. I am a lively woman with plenty of interests but I really do miss the company of a man. I'm not just talking about sex, though I miss that too. It's all the lovely moments, smile, cuddles, being surprised and treated to a bar of chocolate or a cup of tea I haven't made myself.
I love my husband and still have warm contact with him but he doesn't have much language left and he can't engage with me except to smile and occasionally say something that is in the moment. Most of what he says isn't even in sentence form. he's physically quite well, though an indwelling catheter causes him regular problems, but without it he isn't able to urinate at all. He's likely to live for many years yet and my life as a woman is on hold.
Do other women, and men, wonder how to live with this ongoing heartbreak and be fulfilled as a fully adult human being. I'm certainly not interested in casual relationships.

 

[stanleypj]

I think you have done something very helpful by posting on such a potentially sensitive issue Wolfie. Many people must be in a similar situation. I haven't really got any answers for you. I'm not quite at this stage yet but my wife did go through a stage when she didn't like being touched, was totally preoccupied with her agitated 'conversations' and I got quite depressed at the idea that any kind of relationship might have come to an end. I am very fortunate in that things have improved somewhat since then and I try to appreciate all those moments when we feel close, physically and emotionally. That's not much use to you, I know, but I hope people will come up with helpful advice.

 

[malc]

wolfie,the big question is,when is the right time to carry on with your life and what will people think,also will this be the same as having an affair or not,you probably gather from my comments that i've thought about this myself loads of trimes,my wife is 42 with alzheimers and i do look to the future,another thought i've had is when does it seize to be making love and become not acceptable to have a physical relationship.

 

[sheens]

Brave

What a very brave comment - i'm sure you're voicing what many others feel.

My husband had a serious head injury when we were both in our early thirties. This resulted in his personality changing and his short term memory becoming very impaired. It was a lot like what i am dealing with now with my parents.

I totally understand your frustrations. I eventually had to accept that the dynamics of our relationship has changed, in fact gone. And i realised that i was pretty much not a wife any more but a carer. It's a hard realisation.

However, do not lose sight of your own life and identity. Maybe you could join an evening class or a fitness class? It may sound mad but i joined an exercise class and oh boy it was a great way to let off steam! Try to think of what makes you happy - what have your hobbies been? What would you like to do? Learn a new language? Motor mechanics? Flower arranging? Write short stories? You may be laughing at this, but keeping your own interests alive is vital and by trying new ventures you meet new people on a social level.

 

[big-mama]

This is such a hard question that you've asked Wolfie, I really wish I had the answer. It doesn't seem to matter what your opinion on the matter is, someone will think that you're wrong, but then why should you be lonely just so they can sleep at night. Malc hit the nail on the head when he mentioned is it the same as having an affair. Again, I don't have the answer - I'm useless, I know... Yet again it's dementia having the ripple effect, once the stone's thrown into the water - it always seems to get the last laugh. I sit on a double edged sword (of my own making) thinking, "Christ if he dies tomorrow I'll be a widow at 36" and then swing onto the "Christ if has this illness for the next 40 years I'll be 76". Either way I feel guilty for thinking either one! I know I've made no sense and that I haven't answered your question, I just hope you find the answer that makes you happy. xx

 

[nicoise]

Dear Wolfie,

Someone here on TP once coined the term "midow" - where you're mid-way between a wife and a widow, but neither one nor the other.

I've written of this before, but I have a friend whose husband had a catastrophic stroke which left him alive, but badly brain damaged. She was about 42 at the time. Her husband had to go into a nursing home as he needed so much care.

She did have a relationship after this, and indeed since her husband's death has now married this "new" man There was never any secret made of this new relationship; some people were happy for her, and didn't judge, others found it more difficult to accept. But she very much felt that she wasn't ready to give up on all of her life as it had been, and very much wanted a relationship from all aspects.

There was no question of dumping her husband - she saw him regularly, and took him out of the home frequently. But he was no longer the man she had married, and she was virtually a single person but not legally.

So each to their own, I think - I guess what is right for one person is not for another; it all depends how you feel.

No magic answers unfortunately, and no easy ones either....

 

[Chemmy]

An interesting question. What do you think you would want if the roles were reversed?

If it were me, I'd be happy for my OH to have a lady friend, as long as I wasn't completely sidelined. I'd still expect visits to make sure I was being treated OK, I'd still expect to stay married and I'd still expect to be financially supported.

I'd also expect him to be sensitive to my children's views and not flaunt her in front of them before they were ready to accept it.

As for anyone else's view - it's absolutely none of their business.

 

[jimbo 111]

Dear Wolfie,



There was no question of dumping her husband - she saw him regularly, and took him out of the home frequently. But he was no longer the man she had married, and she was virtually a single person but not legally.

So each to their own, I think - I guess what is right for one person is not for another; it all depends how you feel.

No magic answers unfortunately, and no easy ones either....

nicoise is right I believe you should rely on your own instincts and not rely on other people to salve your conscience
Many people on TP have had to or may well have to face this dilemma
Many having done so in following their own instincts without seeking
other peoples views
I don’t know if they have lived to regret their decision , one way or the other
I know many have stuck by their wedding vows ( many of them around your age ) and have spent man years of anguish seeing their loved one growing further and further away
But it is testimony to these peoples devotion that they have the grace to know they were true to the end
Almost every week we see posts (mainly from the lady members ) of their sad loss
It is a matter of opinion , but I am sure that their decision to abide by
their marriage vows ,’ In sickness or in health ’ will be of enormous comfort at the time when their partners do pass on

I don’t think my views will be very popular , but you are seeking points of view

What ever you decide I hope you will be able to live in peace with your decision
jimbo

 

[Chemmy]

Jimbo's right in that his view, my view and anyone else's view doesn't matter one iota. At the end of the day, it'll be your decision and if you can find peace with yourself about that decision, then so be it.

Love is unlimited. Every parent has no problem finding extra love for another child they bring into the world; it doesn't diminish the love they feel for their earlier children.

So why should it not be possible to love more than one partner, given the two relationships would be different. That's why I don't see it in the same light as adultery - you haven't fallen out of love with your husband; you would simply expand your capacity to love someone else as well.

Maybe religious beliefs come into it for some. I don't believe in the hereafter - as far as I'm concerned we get one shot at life and we should make the most of it as long as no-one else gets hurt in the process.

 

[CollegeGirl]

In my humble opinion, I think that loneliness is a terrible thing to feel, at any age, and I wouldn't ever want my husband to suffer it. I want him to have a happy life, and if I develop dementia and have to go into a care home, I sincerely hope that he will be able to find someone else to share his life with as well as me. I know he'd always put our children's feelings first, and I know he'll always love me so it wouldn't be a case of him abandoning me.

I don't think this is the same as having an affair, you obviously love and will continue to care for your husband, but I also think you should not give up on the prospect of future happiness with someone else, if this arises.

 

[jimbo 111]

I can understand why my views are not very popular
I was probably bought up in a different generation to many who have different views
My time is over . My wife died in my care
I was never a perfect husband
Although we were together over 60 years My heart is full of guilt for some of the things I did
A guilt that will never leave me

I understand some of the arguments put forward by many , about the ‘ need to have a life’

But if we are Christians we should never forget the vows we exchanged on our wedding
My wife never forgot and for all of my failings I celebrate that she for all of her illnesses never once wavered from that vow

----“Do you, in the presence of God and these witnesses, solemnly pledge your faith Do you promise to live with her according to God's ordinance in the holy estate of matrimony; do you promise to love her, comfort her, honor, and keep her, in sickness and in health, and forsaking all others, keep yourself only unto her, and through God's grace to promise to be to her a faithful and devoted husband as long as you both shall live? -----

jimbo 111-

 

[zeeeb]

I often think about this in relation to my parents. I wonder if mum goes into a home and dad is still relatively young, if she lives for decades, will he ever give himself permission to find a piece of happiness again?

I hope he does, I feel sad that he's had to go straight from working like a dog his whole life, then plunged into the world of Alzheimer's and Parkinson's carer without even one year to enjoy a relaxing retirement.

I hope one day he can give himself permission to find another companion and find some joy. I'd hate for this to be the end for him at 61. He still works, is due to retire early now in the next couple of years, only to have the biggest job of his life on his hands.

I will certainly make it clear to him that I don't expect him to be alone forever. And that I'd do everything in my power to be OK with it if he was to find another companion. Neither of my parents were religious. And the marriage has been fraught with problems that neither bothered to address in the past. Now, they are still together because of obligation and because nobody wanted to make the big hard moves a decade or two ago, so laziness I guess. Pretty sad really.

 

[Chemmy]

I will certainly make it clear to him that I don't expect him to be alone forever. And that I'd do everything in my power to be OK with it if he was to find another companion.

That would be a very generous thing to do. Not all children would be so understanding.

 

[LYN T]

Hi Wolfe

This is very difficult isn't it? I'm 54 my husband is 66. He is gradually slipping away from me personality wise and also our emotional connection is lost.He's only recently been diagnosed as moderate AD (also bi-polar) He is still at home so my circumstances are vastly different from yours.I think you should search deep inside of you and do what you think is right. I know people mention marriage vows (in sickness and in health etc) but lets face it when the majority of us make these vows we cannot envisage the horror of AD.I still love my husband but in a different way from when we met 20 years ago.After 6 years of undiagnosed mental health issues I've changed from a wife to a full time carer so the dynamics have also changed.Our companionship has been lost as well as our intimate relationship.

Thank you for being so honest.And in the spirit of being honest does anyone hope that their loved one dies a quick and relatively painless death? I sometimes do -but that's just to let myself off the hook.I think I am grieving for what I once had.

 

[alex]

Hi

It’s my view to do whatever makes you happy.

No one has a right to judge you or the path you choose through life and no one has a right to ask you to be unhappy or lonely for the rest of your life.

By that I don’t mean that anyone else’s comments here are wrong, they are not because they are right for them, it doesn’t mean they are right for you, you are the only person who can decide that.

I’ve no doubt you love your husband and love can be forever.........but life isn’t, so make the most of it

Regards Alex

 

[rjm]

Hi Wolfie,
A very thought provoking thread you have started. I kept coming back to it all day, not sure what I was wanting to say but appreciating everyone's contributions and grateful to realise that everyone's comments were the right ones for them and that, thankfully, no one felt compelled to feel that their solution was right for everyone.

My situation is similar to your's. I am 60 and Sharon is 57 and for the past couple of years she has had no meaningful language and except for brief and infrequent moments does not engage. She is still at home and I suspect this is a large difference. I obviously can't speak from experience but I would think that having your spouse move into a care home must create a major discontinuity in the relationship. Sharon and I had discussed this soon after her diagnosis and she was insistent that when the time was right I find someone else and move on. I'm not certain that I will. While this is not the way I had envisioned my life I have no regret about how it has turned out, except for the distress it has caused Sharon although the dementia has now removed that distress. I am very sorry for the loss of Sharon's companionship but I have no urge to replace it.

... my life as a woman is on hold... be fulfilled as a fully adult human being

Wolfie, I take from these comments that being an active part of a relationship is very important to you, when the time is right I hope you are able to find yourself a companion who can offer this.

another thought i've had is when does it seize to be making love and become not acceptable to have a physical relationship.

Malc, you will know when that time comes. If it feels wrong it probably is.

That's why I don't see it in the same light as adultery - you haven't fallen out of love with your husband; you would simply expand your capacity to love someone else as well.

I don't think this is the same as having an affair, you obviously love and will continue to care for your husband,

Chemmy and CollegeGirl, I understand where you are coming from but in my experience there are people who have affairs without falling out of love with their spouse. I think the bigger question is the one of deceit, yet you can't deceive someone with advanced dementia who no longer recognises the marriage they were part of. This should make it easier to begin a new relationship - but I don't think it does.

And in the spirit of being honest does anyone hope that their loved one dies a quick and relatively painless death? I sometimes do -but that's just to let myself off the hook.I think I am grieving for what I once had.

Lyn, you are not alone with that thought. I can see no benefit in wishing for Sharon's condition to drag out any longer than nature decrees. And I don't think it is to let yourself off the hook, I think it is one of the most generous and heartfelt wishes you could have for your loved one.

No one has a right to judge you or the path you choose through life and no one has a right to ask you to be unhappy or lonely for the rest of your life.

Alex, well said!

 

[zeeeb]

I wish for myself that when I die, I die a quick and painless death, as well wishing that for everyone I care about. Not right now of course, but when the time comes, it would be cruel to want to drag the process out longer than necessary.

Heart attack, over and done with, within a matter of moments, in the comfort of my own bed, thank you very much!

It's interesting that for us dealing with long drawn out illnesses, we wish for a heart attack, or something similar. but millions of dollars is spent each year on heart and cholesterol medications and treatments, heart by passes and the heart foundation is massive with mammoth efforts to get us to cut down on salt, sugar, fat and to increase exercise.

Grass is always greener I guess.

 

[Chemmy]

Hello again Wolfie.

Thank you for starting this thread. You have obviously given people much food for thought.

I wonder if, deep down, you have already decided in your own mind and that you are simply testing the reactions of an anonymous audience before you embark on such a journey.

If so, you will see that the reactions are likely to be mixed but largely supportive, but I thought rjm's comment was particularly poignant

Sharon and I had discussed this soon after her diagnosis and she was insistent that when the time was right I find someone else and move on. I'm not certain that I will.

.

How wonderful that Sharon had the wisdom and insight to say that - a totally loving and unselfish act. If the time is ever right, rjm, don't let the guilt monster strike.

 

[winda]

Hi Wolfie, I am the same age as you and my husband is also in a CH.

It is a difficult one. I feel very lonely and miss the relationship I once had with my husband. He is incapable of having a meaningful conversation any more and doesn't like being touched. Our relationship has changed but we do still have a relationship of sorts.
But I have felt a need to join some groups so that I can have some kind of life other than my husband and the CH. I have joined the U3A where I am joining some of the walks, aerobics and a history group. The people there are very friendly and it has helped me to feel more like a person again rather than just a carer.
I am also going to join a choir. I can't sing particularly but find it uplifting and so I thought I'd give it a go.

As far as another relationship goes, I think that if it 'happened' I woudn't be averse to it but it isn't something I'm looking for. I just need to have human contact and I think these groups will provide that.

I don't actually think i would care what other people thought were I have to have another relationship. The people I would be most concerned about would be my step-children as I wouldn't want to hurt them. I would have to be careful how I dealt with it.

Take care xx

 

[SisterAct]

I can understand why my views are not very popular
I was probably bought up in a different generation to many who have different views

----“Do you, in the presence of God and these witnesses, solemnly pledge your faith Do you promise to live with her according to God's ordinance in the holy estate of matrimony; do you promise to love her, comfort her, honor, and keep her, in sickness and in health, and forsaking all others, keep yourself only unto her, and through God's grace to promise to be to her a faithful and devoted husband as long as you both shall live? -----

jimbo 111-

Jimbo, I don't think your views are not popular, they are from a person who stands by what he says no matter what and sometimes other people wish they could do that but find they can't. We are all different and this excellent post has proved that in the responses given.
If (god forbid) I had an illness like dementia I have already made a living will asking to be placed in a care home. I also have been a person to stick to what they have said, at a cost to my own happiness, but I do realise that sometimes rules/vows are made to be broken.
So as long as all those vows were still observed and the forsaking was discreet for the sake of my children I would be content.
After reading these postings I will now amend my living will so that my OH and my children are aware of this........and anyone else can talk about it as much as they like its none of their business is it?