Little concept of money & cost

[Linbrusco]

I know this is a common thing, but my Dad has always had little concept.
Mum managed all the finances, as my Dad gambles given the chance if he has money in his pocket. Raffle tickets, lottery tickets, poker machines. He is obsessed.
Dad has never ever had an ATM card or credit card. Only Mum. Mum moved all their savings to a separate joint bank account that Dad knows nothing of, so he couldnt touch it. In short she kept him in the dark and for good reason.

Now that Mum is in care ( 76 with AD) , Dad (80 with MCI, possibly now FTD) is becoming worse when it comes to money.
I have managed everything for past few years, as I have authority on Mum & Dads bank accounts, as well as all their bills & insurances.
Dad gets a weekly sum of cash, which considering now he is on a single pension, is pretty generous and more than what Mum gave him, but yet he complains and feels hard done by.
If he spends all his money, he makes up some elaborate story about how he lost money out of his wallet or pocket. Honestly... I have heard these exact same stories before, even when we were kids. Its just a ploy to get more money.
When I tell him, or show him a bank statement of his pension and where his money goes, and on what bills, he says he doesnt have bills..... " Dad tell me how you can live for free!!!??"
All Dads bills are emailed to me. I dont know about other countries, but here in New Zealand if you get a bill mailed.... phone, power, water etc they charge you a fee.

I suppose I can print a bill off, but then mail it to Dad

But lately Dad is purposely skimping on food and groceries, so he can have more money in his weeky shopping budget to buy extra cigarettes. If his shopping budget goes over, I constantly have to dip into their savings to cover. It all adds up. As Dad lives next door to me, the other week he came to ask me for bread and milk as he had run out.
If I mention to Dad that he only has enough money for 2 packets of cigarettes than 3 ( GBP13 a pkt!) it causes a huge row.
He asked me where Mums pension goes. Mum gets a very small weekly allowance, which is used for personal,toiletries and expenses.
In short, he is now asking to get Mums pension, or just for me to use Mums pension as she is in care and doesnt spend it!

So any ideas here. Its starting to cause me a huge headache.
I've got a good mind to hand Dad all his bank statements ( not the account hidden by Mum) and bills, get him a basic ATM card linked to his pension a/c only, and tell him hes on his own.

 

[MaNaAk]

I know this is a common thing, but my Dad has always had little concept.
Mum managed all the finances, as my Dad gambles given the chance if he has money in his pocket. Raffle tickets, lottery tickets, poker machines. He is obsessed.
Dad has never ever had an ATM card or credit card. Only Mum. Mum moved all their savings to a separate joint bank account that Dad knows nothing of, so he couldnt touch it. In short she kept him in the dark and for good reason.

Now that Mum is in care ( 76 with AD) , Dad (80 with MCI, possibly now FTD) is becoming worse when it comes to money.
I have managed everything for past few years, as I have authority on Mum & Dads bank accounts, as well as all their bills & insurances.
Dad gets a weekly sum of cash, which considering now he is on a single pension, is pretty generous and more than what Mum gave him, but yet he complains and feels hard done by.
If he spends all his money, he makes up some elaborate story about how he lost money out of his wallet or pocket. Honestly... I have heard these exact same stories before, even when we were kids. Its just a ploy to get more money.
When I tell him, or show him a bank statement of his pension and where his money goes, and on what bills, he says he doesnt have bills..... " Dad tell me how you can live for free!!!??"
All Dads bills are emailed to me. I dont know about other countries, but here in New Zealand if you get a bill mailed.... phone, power, water etc they charge you a fee.

I suppose I can print a bill off, but then mail it to Dad

But lately Dad is purposely skimping on food and groceries, so he can have more money in his weeky shopping budget to buy extra cigarettes. If his shopping budget goes over, I constantly have to dip into their savings to cover. It all adds up. As Dad lives next door to me, the other week he came to ask me for bread and milk as he had run out.
If I mention to Dad that he only has enough money for 2 packets of cigarettes than 3 ( GBP13 a pkt!) it causes a huge row.
He asked me where Mums pension goes. Mum gets a very small weekly allowance, which is used for personal,toiletries and expenses.
In short, he is now asking to get Mums pension, or just for me to use Mums pension as she is in care and doesnt spend it!

So any ideas here. Its starting to cause me a huge headache.
I've got a good mind to hand Dad all his bank statements ( not the account hidden by Mum) and bills, get him a basic ATM card linked to his pension a/c only, and tell him hes on his own.

Dear Lin,

Here in the UK a lot of people pay their bills by direct debit from their bank accounts so all I have to do is make sure that dad has enough money in his current account for this. He no longer worries about bills because he knows I am looking after his accounts. I used tell him he was in credit but when he started to say that he was going to draw money out of one of his accounts to go back to Malaysia I stopped doing this and I have now taken one of his cards from him. One account is managed by just me and another is managed by him when we go into the bank together.

I know you are probably already doing this but you need to reassure him that you are looking after his accounts and that he doesn't need to worry. I am sorry if I am not too much help but dealing with this disease takes a lot of patience.

Good luck

MaNaAk

 

[LadyA]

Gosh. My husband, although he neither smoked nor gambled, was just as bad with money, all his life! I handled all our finances. His salary, when he was working, and then his pension, had to be paid electronically into a joint account, and was immediately transferred to an account in my sole name. This was after he had twice gone into the bank and cleaned out the account. He never had an ATM card either.

The only suggestion I can make is to, as you say, print off the bills so he can see where the money is going - although tbh, it sounds as though financial understanding is pretty much gone. The other thing you could try is splitting his allowance and giving him half at the beginning of the week and half midweek.

 

[Rosettastone57]

I know this is a common thing, but my Dad has always had little concept.
Mum managed all the finances, as my Dad gambles given the chance if he has money in his pocket. Raffle tickets, lottery tickets, poker machines. He is obsessed.
Dad has never ever had an ATM card or credit card. Only Mum. Mum moved all their savings to a separate joint bank account that Dad knows nothing of, so he couldnt touch it. In short she kept him in the dark and for good reason.

Now that Mum is in care ( 76 with AD) , Dad (80 with MCI, possibly now FTD) is becoming worse when it comes to money.
I have managed everything for past few years, as I have authority on Mum & Dads bank accounts, as well as all their bills & insurances.
Dad gets a weekly sum of cash, which considering now he is on a single pension, is pretty generous and more than what Mum gave him, but yet he complains and feels hard done by.
If he spends all his money, he makes up some elaborate story about how he lost money out of his wallet or pocket. Honestly... I have heard these exact same stories before, even when we were kids. Its just a ploy to get more money.
When I tell him, or show him a bank statement of his pension and where his money goes, and on what bills, he says he doesnt have bills..... " Dad tell me how you can live for free!!!??"
All Dads bills are emailed to me. I dont know about other countries, but here in New Zealand if you get a bill mailed.... phone, power, water etc they charge you a fee.

I suppose I can print a bill off, but then mail it to Dad

But lately Dad is purposely skimping on food and groceries, so he can have more money in his weeky shopping budget to buy extra cigarettes. If his shopping budget goes over, I constantly have to dip into their savings to cover. It all adds up. As Dad lives next door to me, the other week he came to ask me for bread and milk as he had run out.
If I mention to Dad that he only has enough money for 2 packets of cigarettes than 3 ( GBP13 a pkt!) it causes a huge row.
He asked me where Mums pension goes. Mum gets a very small weekly allowance, which is used for personal,toiletries and expenses.
In short, he is now asking to get Mums pension, or just for me to use Mums pension as she is in care and doesnt spend it!

So any ideas here. Its starting to cause me a huge headache.
I've got a good mind to hand Dad all his bank statements ( not the account hidden by Mum) and bills, get him a basic ATM card linked to his pension a/c only, and tell him hes on his own.

With my mother-in-law we went paperless with the bank statements and in fact now if any other financial letters or bills come through they come direct to us as her post is redirected. She was convinced that we still had stolen £12,000 from her she would never understand that this has been reinvested for her care fees , so what we do we print off a statement from the online banking system scanned it and then simply alter the date to show the original £12000 that she thought was missing before it was transferred to a savings account. This obviously convinced her because she hasn't mentioned it since

 

[Amy in the US]

Lin it's so hard when you're trying to care for a person with some understanding, but flawed, and also the ability to get to the shops and buy things.

I wish I had an answer for you, but I don't. I do have a lot of sympathy as before the diagnosis and care home, my mother was similarly confused about money and spent an awful lot of it on cigarettes, clothes, shoes, and all manner of things she didn't need or use, plus some dubious "charitable" donations and at least one outright scam. She could use that money now, for her care. I had to wait for the crisis to take over the finances and sort it out.

All I can think of is for you to buy his food and needed items, out of his money, and give him the rest and try to let go about what he does with it. Or give him his allowance daily, rather than weekly? I assume he is getting to the shops, or a shop, on his own?

What a headache for you. I'm sorry.

 

[100 miles]

Lin,

I am wondering whether your Dad doesn't have the planning skills to buy food. He goes to the shops because he wants cigarettes and buys them. He isn't buying food because he isn't hungry at that moment.

I realise this doesn't actually help you with explaining that he can't have any more cash. I doubt giving his bank statements of bills would help.

Maybe you could consider delivering daily food parcels (paid out of his money) and cash. Not something anyone else could do unless they also had a parent living at the bottom of their garden. And even for you it would be a bit of a pain.

100 miles

 

[Linbrusco]

Lin,

I am wondering whether your Dad doesn't have the planning skills to buy food. He goes to the shops because he wants cigarettes and buys them. He isn't buying food because he isn't hungry at that moment.

I realise this doesn't actually help you with explaining that he can't have any more cash. I doubt giving his bank statements of bills would help.

Maybe you could consider delivering daily food parcels (paid out of his money) and cash. Not something anyone else could do unless they also had a parent living at the bottom of their garden. And even for you it would be a bit of a pain.

100 miles

Dad does live at the bottom of my garden . he has my brother living with him at the moment, but as hes a shift worker barely there or asleep.
Dad gets his weekly cash, as this is what Mum used to do. He buys 1 pkt of cigarettes out if it. The rest he blows at his club on gambling.
All the bills are paid automatically every pension day.
I take him grocery shopping, and he knows the sum he has to shop with, but as said lately buying less food, so he buys cigarettes with the difference, sometimes going over his budget slightly.
Between smoking and drinking, smoking is the lesser of the two when it comes to dementia, but its more expensive
When shopping if I suggest things, or if hes run out of things, he denies it.
Although he has lost weight since Mum went into care 16mnths ago, its not drastic. GP recently gave him more or less a clean bill of health. Dads diet is appalling, despite my brother being a chef. Dad will only eat his own food..... but thats another story

 

[canary]

Oh the frontal lobe problems! The gambling, the drinking and smoking, the inability to plan and the flawed logic..........
One of the problems with frontal lobe defects is the compulsion for instant gratification and things like drinking, gambling and buying are all done to give those pleasure receptors a jolt in the moment.

It doesnt sound like he understands about finances anymore (doesnt understand about paying bills, cant plan for food etc). I can understand the feeling that you would like to wash your hands of the lot, but actually I think the time has come to manage all of his finances yourself. Pay his bills (by direct debit if you can), use his money to buy a weekly shop and give him daily "pocket money" to reduce the amount that he can squander away, otherwise he will just blow the whole lot.