LPA - OH's son and daughter being awkward

[nae sporran]

We had almost completed the LPA forms, just a couple of ticks to be replaced with crosses and a spelling mistake to be corrected as far I could see. We had agreed I would be sole attorney, with her daughter as replacement. I have slowly taken over banking and suchlike by having my name on a card for her account and DWP authorising me to act for her on any correspondence. Signatures have been witnessed and OH chiropodist with nursing experience has acted to certify the process.

So, her son and daughter were both happy with that arrangement, so long as I consult them both before making any final decisions on the medical or care side.

Then it got complicated. Daughter does not want her brother anywhere near the proceeding, but told hi what was happening. She is happy to be a replacement attorney herself. Son happy for me to be sole attorney, but wants to be a replacement attorney as he doesn't trust his sister.

OH does not want them to argue, not quite sure she fully understands what is involved even though she does understand that it involves trusting me fully with her affairs and trusting her daughter to take over if anything happens to me.

Changing everything by reprinting some of the pages and initialising other changes has got us this far.

Can I, or should I, put OH son on as a second replacement attorney without telling his sister and hope it all works out?

Any feedback or advice is welcome while we wait for AgeUK to phone back for a chat and a check over the paper work. Thanks, R

 

[cragmaid]

If it was down to me I'd fill the forms in with you as sole attorney and with son and daughter as replacements acting jointly only.
I would tell them that THIS is your wife's choice and if they cannot act together as grown ups there will be no replacement nominated at all and the OPG will appoint a Deputy ( at cost) in due course.

No argument - no discussion - fait accompli!

 

[Pete R]

Can I, or should I, put OH son on as a second replacement attorney without telling his sister and hope it all works out?

You could but they are going to see the number of replacement Attorneys there are when they sign the forms.

If your OH is happy with you as Attorney and Daughter as replacement then that is the way it should be. Is there a reason the son was not considered before and do you trust the Daughter to be sole Attorney should you not be able to carry on?

Also are you doing both LPA's?

 

[Batsue]

My brother was named as replacement attorney on mum's LPA, he did not have to sign the form and as far as I know has never seen it.

 

[Pete R]

My brother was named as replacement attorney on mum's LPA, he did not have to sign the form and as far as I know has never seen it.

I doubt it could have been registered without it being signed by all Attorneys & Replacements and witnessed.

 

[nae sporran]

You could but they are going to see the number of replacement Attorneys there are when they sign the forms.

If your OH is happy with you as Attorney and Daughter as replacement then that is the way it should be. Is there a reason the son was not considered before and do you trust the Daughter to be sole Attorney should you not be able to carry on?

Also are you doing both LPA's?

We're doing both, Pete.
Initially OH was happy to have both her son and daughter as replacement attorneys, then daughter said she would not do it if her brother was on it too. Daughter had POA about 12 years ago, but only for financial and never registered. I persuaded her to have a new arrangement for both as I have now been sole carer for 6 years.
So, daughter happy to replace if son is not on it, but son does not trust daughter. Daughter has persuaded OH that her brother is too caught up in his own family, that seemed acceptable and then she got upset her son was taking her for granted.
It's all getting complicated, so I think I might just speak to OH again and tell her children to sign up and shut up to stop LA appointing deputies, as Maureen suggests. Would that not mean daughter blocking the whole thing and insisting on the old version, or can I just put son on without telling her and when it is all registered she is too late to say anything.

 

[Pete R]

Would that not mean daughter blocking the whole thing and insisting on the old version, or can I just put son on without telling her and when it is all registered she is too late to say anything.

The Daughters was not registered so I doubt would get anywhere in trying to block your attempt as your OH still has capacity to decide who she wants.

It is probably best to get all to agree now as if you did add Son without Daughters knowledge then if they did need to take over it cause even more problems.

Families eh!

 

[Pete R]

My brother was named as replacement attorney on mum's LPA, he did not have to sign the form and as far as I know has never seen it.

Just looked it up and things are different in Scotland where it appears no signature is required only be nominated. However if Replacement is needed they have to write to the OPG to be added to the register.

 

[nae sporran]

The Daughters was not registered so I doubt would get anywhere in trying to block your attempt as your OH still has capacity to decide who she wants.

It is probably best to get all to agree now as if you did add Son without Daughters knowledge then if they did need to take over it cause even more problems.

Families eh!

Fair point, thanks Pete.

 

[Chemmy]

It might be a salutary lesson if a deputy was appointed, rather than a pair of squabbling siblings.

It would ensure the provision of care for your OH, as the deputy would be obliged to act in her best interests....but it might have a significant impact on any future inheritance

 

[nae sporran]

Well, I posted it without waiting for OH's son to finally make good on his promise to visit or invite us for her birthday a month ago.
AgeUK advisor unfortunately crossed out all the pages she thought we might not need, so going back to add his name would have been difficult without reprinted the other side of the sheet with OH signature and our chiropodist friend's witness. That's one to note for anyone who may have similar problems. OH was losing patience with her son too, so unless she changes her mind it will be the official position.

Chemmy, you mention court appointed deputies and I will say that to OH's son. AgeUK advisor says doctors can still overrule any decisions I want to make on OH health or welfare if it's not in her interests. That's different, but does anyone know the legal position should that come up in future.

 

[jenniferpa]

Chemmy, you mention court appointed deputies and I will say that to OH's son. AgeUK advisor says doctors can still overrule any decisions I want to make on OH health or welfare if it's not in her interests. That's different, but does anyone know the legal position should that come up in future.

As a general rule this is true everywhere but I really wouldn't worry about it. Basically it means that the unscrupulous can't decide, for example, that a person shouldn't receive appropriate medical care simply because they want to get to their inheritance more quickly. The primary issue might be that families tend to be overwhelmingly in favour of more treatment rather than less, whereas doctors tend to be more conservative because they know that such treatment often extends the process of dying rather than extending someone's life, if I can put it like that. Having said that though, generally even if the medics think a course of action is pointless assuming it's medically defensible they will go along with the family.

 

[nae sporran]

Thanks Jennifer. OH's daughter made me swear to never switch off life support without asking her and my own instincts are towards giving her every chance without in C's words turning her into a zombie. If this really just means there has to be a discussion first then there shouldn't be a problem.