1. Alex54

    Alex54 Registered User

    Oct 15, 2018
    97
    Recently changed care company and we are encountering a completely new issue.

    Basically, the care company has a very well defined set of policy and procedures designed to protect both the carer and client. This may work well with most situations but with my wife she will always refuse to cooperate and verbally object in the strongest terms. The end result is her personal hygiene needs are not being met and I have to step in as best I can.

    It reminds me of the industrial action in the past when employees would perform their duties strictly to the letter of their contract.

    I don't think the care company is in the wrong but with dementia and Alzheimer's situations what do you do?
     
  2. Bunpoots

    Bunpoots Registered User

    Apr 1, 2016
    2,441
    Nottinghamshire
    #2 Bunpoots, May 12, 2019
    Last edited: May 12, 2019
    My dad’s refusal to accept personal care after he had a stroke was one of the arguments I used to keep him in residential care @Alex54.

    Had he been sent home he would have refused personal care, and to take his medications. The care home managed by going back every 15 minutes or so until he was in a better mood. It could take all morning!! With a 1/2hr care visit and his lack of co-operation he simply wouldn’t have been clean.

    I don’t know what the solution is unless you’re lucky enough to get a carer who your wife will co-operate with.


    As an afterthought - would playing your wife’s favourite music help her to relax at all and allow the carers to their job?
     
  3. Alex54

    Alex54 Registered User

    Oct 15, 2018
    97
    Afraid not, the problem is that the carer will refuse to carry out the task i,e, washing or toileting because my wife says no when asked.
     
  4. Bunpoots

    Bunpoots Registered User

    Apr 1, 2016
    2,441
    Nottinghamshire
    That sounds very unhelpful. Do they try cajoling her @Alex54 ? On the mornings when I was there when the carer arrived she was always very upbeat and mostly managed to persuade dad. He wasn't aggressive though - but could get a bit stroppy.

    Dad's company was obviously used to dealing with PWD and they didn't ask - just told him everything was ready for him. If they'd asked he'd have said no!
     
  5. Alex54

    Alex54 Registered User

    Oct 15, 2018
    97
    That's the main problem, their staff has been trained to always seek permission and to stop when told to. I just don't think they have worked with someone who has advanced dementia before.
     
  6. Bunpoots

    Bunpoots Registered User

    Apr 1, 2016
    2,441
    Nottinghamshire
    That's what I was wondering. Can you choose a different agency? I'm assuming SS have swapped agencies for you. If it's not working out they need to know.
     
  7. Sirena

    Sirena Registered User

    Feb 27, 2018
    1,078
    Female
    Have you discussed this with the manager of the care agency? As you say, when someone has dementia you have to use different tactics rather than asking permission. If they can't be more flexible and accomplish the tasks you need them to do, you may need to change agencies again (if that's possible).
     
  8. Ohso

    Ohso Registered User

    Jan 4, 2018
    84
    I can hardly believe it happened but the ward mum was on recently in our local hospital, they asked mum, if she said no they didnt try again till next time....this not only included showers or daily wash but also food and drinks.....crazy that someone with dementia and diabetes who has been deemed not to have capacity is judged capable of deciding if and when she wants/needs to eat....all in the name of patient's rights...seems your care home is taking the same route.
     
  9. Quenelise

    Quenelise Registered User

    Oct 7, 2017
    150
    I have the (mis) fortune of experiencing this from both points of view.
    People require care, but if they refuse, then the carer can be putting themselves in a tenuous legal situation if they try and force them.
    How far do these carers go? Do they try different strategies to convince her? Or do they just accept the initial "no"?
    I agree with @Sirena; discuss it with the manager. These basic care requirements are not being fulfilled and that is part of their role.
    Also, if you are experiencing this, then that means others are as well.
     
  10. Alex54

    Alex54 Registered User

    Oct 15, 2018
    97
    Thanks for all the replies: There is no easy solution and the manager said she would come and see for herself what can be done. Unfortunately, it has been ingrained into the staff to always seek permission and to stop when told to. The most likely solution is to change agencies but it is difficult to find replacements.
     
  11. Banjomansmate

    Banjomansmate Registered User

    Jan 13, 2019
    655
    Female
    Dorset
    The third and last Care firm who came out to The Banjoman at home went back to Social Services to say that they were no longer able to look after him properly because he was getting too stroppy with their staff when they offered personal care. SS were just starting to do more assessments when he went down with another infection and spent time in hospital. While there it was finally agreed that it was no longer safe for him to live at home and he went into residential care. So far, after three months, he seems to have got used to events but still refuses personal care some days, so they go back to him a little while later and try again or a different member of staff will go in to him.
     
  12. Grannie G

    Grannie G Volunteer Moderator

    Apr 3, 2006
    68,430
    Kent
    When my husband was in residential care he began to refuse a bath for no apparent reason.
    I was told he couldn`t be forced to have a bath and persuasion didn`t work.

    A while later , when I was visiting, one of the carers said " Time for a bath now Mr G" and he accepted it like a lamb.

    The staff told me even though initially he refused, they continued to presume every time that he would accept and bath. One day he did accept it and they had no problems after then.

    I`m afraid we are victims of the litigation society which has developed over the years. All people in the caring professions are continually looking over their shoulders in case they are sued for neglect, invasion of privacy or anything else which has been suggested as a candidate for legal action.

    I understand this is no help for you @Alex54. I just hope the carers don't give up on your mother but continue to offer the care she needs in a positive manner and a matter of fact way.
     

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