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Why do we have siblings who won't help?

Violet Jane

Registered User
Aug 23, 2021
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0
That's an interesting point about the bystander effect. Don't all shout me down but there's an old rhyme about men joining another family when they marry which perhaps implies that they can't be looked to to provide care and support to elderly parents.

The rhyme goes something like:
A son's a son til he finds a wife
A daughter's a daughter all of her life
 

Duggies-girl

Registered User
Sep 6, 2017
3,357
0
That's an interesting point about the bystander effect. Don't all shout me down but there's an old rhyme about men joining another family when they marry which perhaps implies that they can't be looked to to provide care and support to elderly parents.

The rhyme goes something like:
A son's a son til he finds a wife
A daughter's a daughter all of her life
That is definitely true of my family, there is only the two of us and I cared while my brother didn't but my MIL had 3 sons and they were all very good to her, She ended up in a care home but they all still visited her so not so in that case. She was a demanding old bat as far as I was concerned but I always respected her as my husbands mother.
 

try again

Registered User
Jun 21, 2018
513
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My sister lives 60 miles away and thinks her day visit each month is enough. It might be enough to visit my mother but isn't enough to help provide me with a rest.vi have told her that if she stayed for a week, it would provide me with respite but she wrinkles her nose and says she would not stay in mum's house.

She is also insensitive enough to pop in when coming through from holiday or to send photos of a Christmas party she's at when I am spending prolonged periods with mum after a cataract op.
She has said to me when mum dies we probably aren't close enough to want to see each other. True but tactfully diverted by myself at the time
 

jennifer1967

Registered User
Mar 15, 2020
12,775
0
Southampton
my oldest son is better than my daughter in helping. he is also a carer for his partner who has bi-polar along with his son whose autistic. hes the one that understands my husband and knows what to say. he was the most challenging with his behaviour and alcoholism but hes turned it around will do anything for me. my grandson is the same and helps cutting grass and painting. carrying my shopping. so i dont go along with the rhyme. his partner is very good as well.
 

Frank24

Registered User
Feb 13, 2018
352
0
Not quite the same but similar. When it comes to his mum now in care our son doesn’t really want to know and he has said that I should know he’s not like his sister who is much more cooperative and wants to see Bridget ( her mum) when the school holidays come round.

I think being “oh he’s a boy” is an easy get out and I think emotionally he’s lacking. No responsibility no emotional involvement. It’s that simple. Why get involved when you can duck out of it and not expend the energy. As far as he’s concerned I’m dealing with it and that one less thing he has to think about and care about.
Harsh but true
I’m so sorry that must be hard. If there is someone else dealing with it maybe some people think ok they don’t need to do anything. Heartbreaking for you x
 

Frank24

Registered User
Feb 13, 2018
352
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My sister lives 60 miles away and thinks her day visit each month is enough. It might be enough to visit my mother but isn't enough to help provide me with a rest.vi have told her that if she stayed for a week, it would provide me with respite but she wrinkles her nose and says she would not stay in mum's house.

She is also insensitive enough to pop in when coming through from holiday or to send photos of a Christmas party she's at when I am spending prolonged periods with mum after a cataract op.
She has said to me when mum dies we probably aren't close enough to want to see each other. True but tactfully diverted by myself at the time
Oh god. Horrid.
 

Frank24

Registered User
Feb 13, 2018
352
0
my oldest son is better than my daughter in helping. he is also a carer for his partner who has bi-polar along with his son whose autistic. hes the one that understands my husband and knows what to say. he was the most challenging with his behaviour and alcoholism but hes turned it around will do anything for me. my grandson is the same and helps cutting grass and painting. carrying my shopping. so i dont go along with the rhyme. his partner is very good as well.
I’m glad they are helping xx
 

Frank24

Registered User
Feb 13, 2018
352
0
Wow what an interesting thread -we too have had issues with an invisible who felt entitled to certain things, made our life harder when looking after my MIL and the invisible has now seen his mum twice since she went into a home 2 years ago. I took the brunt of the care with my OH helping but something that came to mind was the Bystander Effect - probably does not cover all the bases on this whereby its usually just one or two people that take the load when it comes to care but an interesting idea regardless.

What Is the Bystander Effect?​

The term bystander effect refers to the phenomenon in which the greater the number of people present, the less likely people are to help a person in distress. When an emergency situation occurs, observers are more likely to take action if there are few or no other witnesses. Being part of a large crowd makes it so no single person has to take responsibility for an action (or inaction).
Bystander effect doesn’t explain my brothers inaction I alone have been sorted out my mum with the support of x 1 amazing aunt xx
 

SERENA50

Registered User
Jan 17, 2018
157
0
Not quite the same but similar. When it comes to his mum now in care our son doesn’t really want to know and he has said that I should know he’s not like his sister who is much more cooperative and wants to see Bridget ( her mum) when the school holidays come round.

I think being “oh he’s a boy” is an easy get out and I think emotionally he’s lacking. No responsibility no emotional involvement. It’s that simple. Why get involved when you can duck out of it and not expend the energy. As far as he’s concerned I’m dealing with it and that one less thing he has to think about and care about.
Harsh but true
Hi

I actually think this wld be our son. Two young adult children with very different personalities/ emotional maturity. I am already prepared in my own mind that this could more than likely be the case in any event that happened to us although I don't expect our children to care for us in the same way I have and do with my own parent(s). I don't want that for either of them son or daughter On that basis spent the weekend de cluttering our house, just installed a downstairs shower. Dad has raged against growing old before this point, mum was the same never thinking they needed to make plans or were getting older but then by doing so after mum passed away failed to make plans before he got in to the situation we find ourselves in to some extent anyway, a large totally unsuitable house with us his adult children supporting him financially at times and feeling obliged to keep the house in some sort of repair and cleanliness. Gosh I have been very honest there. I don't want our children feeling the same way I do sometimes. I can't pre empt alot of things but I can prepare for some.
 

Muttimuggle

Registered User
Dec 28, 2021
336
0
Hi

I actually think this wld be our son. Two young adult children with very different personalities/ emotional maturity. I am already prepared in my own mind that this could more than likely be the case in any event that happened to us although I don't expect our children to care for us in the same way I have and do with my own parent(s). I don't want that for either of them son or daughter On that basis spent the weekend de cluttering our house, just installed a downstairs shower. Dad has raged against growing old before this point, mum was the same never thinking they needed to make plans or were getting older but then by doing so after mum passed away failed to make plans before he got in to the situation we find ourselves in to some extent anyway, a large totally unsuitable house with us his adult children supporting him financially at times and feeling obliged to keep the house in some sort of repair and cleanliness. Gosh I have been very honest there. I don't want our children feeling the same way I do sometimes. I can't pre empt alot of things but I can prepare for some.
Yes, I have long been thinking the same thing. But we are a different generation with shifts in our values and a different outlook. For my mother her home of 55 years is her "castle" - her values were built after war years when looking after, improving and hanging on to what you had was a priority as well as a common stoicism amongst people of that era. (Unless I refer only to my mother's background here?) But people died younger than they do today. My mother never had to experience the looking after parents as they spent many years in long decline and anything like dementia had no proper name nor understanding about it.
Yes, I am intent on the de-cluttering too and have made small starts. We had been intent on moving to a smaller and more manageable house but the chronic pain I have now been suffering for 7 years has slowed this down. I am able to learn from the mistake my mother has made in staying put.I don't want to be rattling around in a too big house like my mother - which no longer gets properly maintained and I don't want our only son to have to deal with some of these same problems I am faced with mostly alone(with the help of my husband but with only "negative help" from my frequently absent brother). I/we will get there with the down sizing even if I have to do this in small bite size chunks. But all this de-cluttering and preparations for downsizing must be presently done on top of the emotional drain feel and the practical assistance I must do in trying to care for my mother. It feels too much.
OK - off now to meet the Memory Clinic nurse in my mother's house to make a decision around increasing her care to 1 more "slot". She doesn't really think she needs it. I am deciding or trying to convince her of how to spend her money - which doesn't feel nice. I am looking at the bigger picture(alone) which she isn't really able to do. I hate this sort of thing but it must be done.
 

MaNaAk

Registered User
Jun 19, 2016
8,034
0
Essex
Yes, I have long been thinking the same thing. But we are a different generation with shifts in our values and a different outlook. For my mother her home of 55 years is her "castle" - her values were built after war years when looking after, improving and hanging on to what you had was a priority as well as a common stoicism amongst people of that era. (Unless I refer only to my mother's background here?) But people died younger than they do today. My mother never had to experience the looking after parents as they spent many years in long decline and anything like dementia had no proper name nor understanding about it.
Yes, I am intent on the de-cluttering too and have made small starts. We had been intent on moving to a smaller and more manageable house but the chronic pain I have now been suffering for 7 years has slowed this down. I am able to learn from the mistake my mother has made in staying put.I don't want to be rattling around in a too big house like my mother - which no longer gets properly maintained and I don't want our only son to have to deal with some of these same problems I am faced with mostly alone(with the help of my husband but with only "negative help" from my frequently absent brother). I/we will get there with the down sizing even if I have to do this in small bite size chunks. But all this de-cluttering and preparations for downsizing must be presently done on top of the emotional drain feel and the practical assistance I must do in trying to care for my mother. It feels too much.
OK - off now to meet the Memory Clinic nurse in my mother's house to make a decision around increasing her care to 1 more "slot". She doesn't really think she needs it. I am deciding or trying to convince her of how to spend her money - which doesn't feel nice. I am looking at the bigger picture(alone) which she isn't really able to do. I hate this sort of thing but it must be done.
Good luck @Mottimuggle.

MaNaAk
 

jugglingmum

Registered User
Jan 5, 2014
6,344
0
Chester
My children are 16 and 21 - too young to tell how supportive they will be. And I don't want to burden them - but they might decide to take on the burden.

They are very close but then I was very close with my invisible brother until we were in our 30s - we fell out before dementia visited our lives.

My mum was a life long hoarder so I have always tried to keep on top of things eg if I buy new clothes try to throw out items as I put new in wardrobe. But don't always succeed and hate throwing out party dresses I've only worn once.
 

jennifer1967

Registered User
Mar 15, 2020
12,775
0
Southampton
My children are 16 and 21 - too young to tell how supportive they will be. And I don't want to burden them - but they might decide to take on the burden.

They are very close but then I was very close with my invisible brother until we were in our 30s - we fell out before dementia visited our lives.

My mum was a life long hoarder so I have always tried to keep on top of things eg if I buy new clothes try to throw out items as I put new in wardrobe. But don't always succeed and hate throwing out party dresses I've only worn once.
ive have the same problem with clothes. i find it hard to even take the labels off let alone hang them up or wear them. this year i promised myself to do more and its slow progress but im getting there one step at a time
 

SERENA50

Registered User
Jan 17, 2018
157
0
Yes, I have long been thinking the same thing. But we are a different generation with shifts in our values and a different outlook. For my mother her home of 55 years is her "castle" - her values were built after war years when looking after, improving and hanging on to what you had was a priority as well as a common stoicism amongst people of that era. (Unless I refer only to my mother's background here?) But people died younger than they do today. My mother never had to experience the looking after parents as they spent many years in long decline and anything like dementia had no proper name nor understanding about it.
Yes, I am intent on the de-cluttering too and have made small starts. We had been intent on moving to a smaller and more manageable house but the chronic pain I have now been suffering for 7 years has slowed this down. I am able to learn from the mistake my mother has made in staying put.I don't want to be rattling around in a too big house like my mother - which no longer gets properly maintained and I don't want our only son to have to deal with some of these same problems I am faced with mostly alone(with the help of my husband but with only "negative help" from my frequently absent brother). I/we will get there with the down sizing even if I have to do this in small bite size chunks. But all this de-cluttering and preparations for downsizing must be presently done on top of the emotional drain feel and the practical assistance I must do in trying to care for my mother. It feels too much.
OK - off now to meet the Memory Clinic nurse in my mother's house to make a decision around increasing her care to 1 more "slot". She doesn't really think she needs it. I am deciding or trying to convince her of how to spend her money - which doesn't feel nice. I am looking at the bigger picture(alone) which she isn't really able to do. I hate this sort of thing but it must be done.
Hi

My mum was the same , she passed away 12 years ago but her house was her 'castle' too, she did work but had periods where she also cared and didn't work- cared for her aunties , her mum's sisters and also for her own parents as well. I marvel that she didn't moan about it lol unlike me who admits to moaning sometimes. She was , prior to her illness, intent on down sizing, even looking at bungalows with my sister. When we have mentioned this to dad he says it isn't true but it really was, the house was getting to big for her to keep and she was a sensible, practical person.

When we cleared mum's clothes out I thought how few she actually had, compared to Dad who has so many shirts and stuff so I think it must be dad who is the hoarder sort of person. Everything you touch either falls apart or doesn't work. We still have adult children living with us but I have in my mind that I will not be maintaining a huge house into older age if I can prevent it. Might not be possible but at least I have that thought stored lol.

I guess all these things , we think we are alone but actually it is pretty clear there are lots of us in very similar positions. Dad has an OT person coming today which will not go well lol

Take Care x
 

SERENA50

Registered User
Jan 17, 2018
157
0
My children are 16 and 21 - too young to tell how supportive they will be. And I don't want to burden them - but they might decide to take on the burden.

They are very close but then I was very close with my invisible brother until we were in our 30s - we fell out before dementia visited our lives.

My mum was a life long hoarder so I have always tried to keep on top of things eg if I buy new clothes try to throw out items as I put new in wardrobe. But don't always succeed and hate throwing out party dresses I've only worn once.
Hi

Our children are early twenties but I would not want to burden them if I had a choice, of course I might not but yesterday when I was grappling with Dad's garden and he's asking me when his cleaner is coming and I look round and think well here she is but she can't do everything and I do have to work as well lol..I did think it would be so much better for yourself not just us as a family, if you had moved to apartment but now it is too late sadly.
 

canary

Registered User
Feb 25, 2014
18,901
0
South coast
yesterday when I was grappling with Dad's garden and he's asking me when his cleaner is coming and I look round and think well here she is but she can't do everything and I do have to work as well lol.
If he thinks he has a cleaner coming and is happy with this, perhaps you could get an actual cleaner to come, which would help you a bit.
 

Violet Jane

Registered User
Aug 23, 2021
900
0
I am 60 and my husband will turn 60 next month. I don't know whether we'll downsize at some point but what I definitely do want to do is get rid of a lot of 'stuff' as I feel that it's really unfair to leave this to our children. We both have hoarding tendencies (for reasons of sentimentality) but, on top of that, we have been very lazy over the years about throwing things away. I also brought back a lot of stuff from my parents' house including what appears to be every card, postcard and letter that I ever received! I can't bring myself to just dump it all without looking at it. I have to read everything, which has been quite enjoyable and interesting, although I am disappointed to read the many complaints about what a dreadful correspondent I was! I marvel at how much people wrote letters, sometimes quite long letters, right into the 1980s. My husband and I have been discussing this. We think that as students and young adults we didn't have phones or easy access to phones and that telephone calls were expensive - or resisted by our parents, hence all the letters and cards making arrangements, thanking me for visits and hospitality and generally letting me know what was going on in their lives.
 

SERENA50

Registered User
Jan 17, 2018
157
0
If he thinks he has a cleaner coming and is happy with this, perhaps you could get an actual cleaner to come, which would help you a bit.
We would like to change the cleaner to be fair, she is someone dad recruited from another neighbour but unlike company when she is ill or away then we have no replacement. She isn't back until next week from holiday as it turns out and Dad hadn't remembered. It's a work in progress lol
 

SERENA50

Registered User
Jan 17, 2018
157
0
I am 60 and my husband will turn 60 next month. I don't know whether we'll downsize at some point but what I definitely do want to do is get rid of a lot of 'stuff' as I feel that it's really unfair to leave this to our children. We both have hoarding tendencies (for reasons of sentimentality) but, on top of that, we have been very lazy over the years about throwing things away. I also brought back a lot of stuff from my parents' house including what appears to be every card, postcard and letter that I ever received! I can't bring myself to just dump it all without looking at it. I have to read everything, which has been quite enjoyable and interesting, although I am disappointed to read the many complaints about what a dreadful correspondent I was! I marvel at how much people wrote letters, sometimes quite long letters, right into the 1980s. My husband and I have been discussing this. We think that as students and young adults we didn't have phones or easy access to phones and that telephone calls were expensive - or resisted by our parents, hence all the letters and cards making arrangements, thanking me for visits and hospitality and generally letting me know what was going on in their lives.
It is nice to read letters. I am yet to venture into our loft although there will be letters and post cards in there pretty sure of it . I remember writing to my friends at university, in fact I have one friend now who I might write to rather than email or phone but mainly it is WhatsApp and texting or FaceTime now. We always used to send post cards as well not sure they are still in fashion now either.