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Why do I argue still?

Denise.w

Registered User
Aug 23, 2014
39
Am I really the only person who has had a logical argument with the person you are caring for, knowing full well it is pointless but you still have to let your feelings made clear ? Well I have tonight. Not feeling especially good about myself but struggling to find a way forward for both of us. My dad and me.
 

sunray

Registered User
Sep 21, 2008
1,446
East Coast of Australia
I think we all did that from time to time. Talk it out was always my theory but dementia changes that. You can't be logical with an illogical partner and in a way it is more frustrating than just keeping quiet and keeping your own counsel. So, how to cope eh? Well, find someone to bounce your ideas off, there are always phone counselling lines, old friends, sometimes family members if they are particularly sensitive and understanding.

I found going for a walk instead of blowing my top helped, distracting him helped, making promises like "we'll have a hot chocolate after we do some shopping" helped. It is a cruel disease when logic is out the door and there is no reasoning with them but once you accept that is so it feels better.

(((hugs)))
 

janey106

Registered User
Dec 10, 2013
139
Denise

Am I really the only person who has had a logical argument with the person you are caring for, knowing full well it is pointless but you still have to let your feelings made clear ? Well I have tonight. Not feeling especially good about myself but struggling to find a way forward for both of us. My dad and me.

Just had the same situation last night with my Mum. Normally keep it calm, supportive but at the end of my tether last night so just had to let her know how I felt, for her, my long-suffering Dad, our family etc. She twisted everything I have said and done, dismissed the decades I have supported her mental health problems and told me I disgusted her. Yes, I know it is the disease but I find myself seeing her less as my Mum and more of a 'problem' to be managed. I know this sounds heartless and cold and I'm not proud of it but I don't think I could manage this situation and everything else going on in my life if I didn't. Be kind to yourself, forgive yourself: I am trying to reconcile that it is a very long road ahead so the odd stumble is inevitable. You certainly aren't alone.
 

Denise.w

Registered User
Aug 23, 2014
39
Thank you so much for your responses. I felt hard and cold until I read them, then I crumbled and felt sad, but ok again. My dad no longer knows I am his daughter. Talks about me to me !
What is the obsession with money all about please ?
 

Soobee

Registered User
Aug 22, 2009
2,734
South
I think perhaps obsession with money has something to do with feeling out of control.

When I can't find something at work my automatic first thought is that someone has moved or taken it; then I will find it and feel stupid and bad that I blamed someone else.

I wonder if the automatic thought is that someone has taken money because the person cannot remember spending it or remembers a time when they had more in their account/purse/wallet?
 

Denise.w

Registered User
Aug 23, 2014
39
Thank you so much for your responses. I felt hard and cold until I read them, then I crumbled and felt sad, but ok again. My dad no longer knows I am his daughter. Talks about me to me !
What is the obsession with money all about please ?
 

sleepless

Registered User
Feb 19, 2010
3,223
The Sweet North
Denise, I know just how you feel. When my husband moves something that I need, I find myself asking him 'Where did you put so-and-so?' or 'You have moved it, so will you please find it!' Completely illogical of me to expect him to remember, but when I am tired all my 'compassionate communication' goes out the window!

Then I feel bad.

We are only human, and can only try our best.

sleepless.
 

MrsTerryN

Registered User
Dec 17, 2012
769
Before mum went into the nursing home and my dad was still alive she often was quite mean and nasty.
I have to say one day I just let it rip. I screamed at her about she forgot everything and was mean.
My excuse I was so tired from umpteen unexpected visits over to their place one reason or another.
Mum's reason she has dementia.
Sad to say it wasn't the only time.
One of the advantages of the nursing home is I can walk out and now she is still safe and secure.
For the most part mum is relatively civil now. I am hoping it lasts
 

Denise.w

Registered User
Aug 23, 2014
39
I think perhaps obsession with money has something to do with feeling out of control.

When I can't find something at work my automatic first thought is that someone has moved or taken it; then I will find it and feel stupid and bad that I blamed someone else.

I wonder if the automatic thought is that someone has taken money because the person cannot remember spending it or remembers a time when they had more in their account/purse/wallet?
My dad has always been such a generous man so it is difficult to take on. He put me on his bank account last year so I could sort his finances. He cannot believe he has money, when I show him a bank statement he thinks it is not rights then he thinks he has to move out from me because he cannot afford to be here. I am his only child. He cannot believe he has left everything in his will to me, because he thinks I am some woman he lives with. I do not have POA. I did not feel comfortable as I realised he mostly does not know who I am. I have a solicitor appt regarding this today, but am sick of it.
I guess he is as distressed as well though, so uncertain of everything. Going to a solicitor will not help him feel better.
 

Denise.w

Registered User
Aug 23, 2014
39
Before mum went into the nursing home and my dad was still alive she often was quite mean and nasty.
I have to say one day I just let it rip. I screamed at her about she forgot everything and was mean.
My excuse I was so tired from umpteen unexpected visits over to their place one reason or another.
Mum's reason she has dementia.
Sad to say it wasn't the only time.
One of the advantages of the nursing home is I can walk out and now she is still safe and secure.
For the most part mum is relatively civil now. I am hoping it lasts
thankyou Mrs Terry. My dad is not ready for a nursing home yet, but not able to cope alone. He has a rose tinted memory of being in his own home. When he was there all he did was moan about being alone, not seeing anybody etc etc it wasn't true. Now he is mostly happy with me, but insists he would be alright at home. His gp did not agree but he refused care, and care link, cannot use a phone, so he is with me. I did tell him yesterday I was taking him home, to see what it feels like all day, if he can manage as well as he thinks. I cannot be arguing all the time. If he decides he wants to stay I will bring him back contact social services and let them see what they can offer. I want him to be happy with me, but if he isn't and thinks I am keeping him against his wishes, then what is the point. At least I know he is well fed, and wanting for nothing, but that is all really. Feeling alone.
 

Trace2012

Registered User
Jun 24, 2013
162
I do exactly the same thing, i cant help my self, i do for a while but mam just keeps on and on till i start to argue thats not how it is or what it is, i really do try to keep out the way most of the time which isnt nice but at least it stops it, we live in the same house so its even harder x


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Denise.w

Registered User
Aug 23, 2014
39
Denise, I know just how you feel. When my husband moves something that I need, I find myself asking him 'Where did you put so-and-so?' or 'You have moved it, so will you please find it!' Completely illogical of me to expect him to remember, but when I am tired all my 'compassionate communication' goes out the window!

Then I feel bad.

We are only human, and can only try our best.

sleepless.
yes, it is so hard. Then the blank expression when you try to reason, and wonder where that person is?
They are still there but so hard to reach at times. What a tormenting illness for sufferers and careers alike.m
 

Denise.w

Registered User
Aug 23, 2014
39
I do exactly the same thing, i cant help my self, i do for a while but mam just keeps on and on till i start to argue thats not how it is or what it is, i really do try to keep out the way most of the time which isnt nice but at least it stops it, we live in the same house so its even harder x


Sent from my iPhone using Talking Point
I spend a long time some days avoiding eye contact as well, and therefore discussion as well.
 

Weary

Registered User
Aug 1, 2014
86
You are only human and the situation is so frustrating you are bound to snap once in a while. Just get it off your chest and dont beat yourself up over it.

MIL was obsessed with money. She was used to handling all the finances for her and FIL and always kept a large amount in the house. She has alzheimers and FIL had vas. Dementia. She kept hiding it and forgetting where she had put and we would spend hours searching the house while she accused everyone under the sun of stealing it, so eventually we took it and put it in her bank as she didnt need any because she didnt go out on her own, and although we did not have poa my husband managed all the bills etc for them. Of course she obsessed over it saying she had nothing and no amount of talking or showing her statements could persuade her otherwise. She accused everyone of stealing it and insisted she needed money in her purse so we would draw £50 out for her but it would mysteriously disappear. God knows what she did with it but i remember the shock of the first time she accused me! We had just put £50 in £10 notes into her purse and showed her. 5 minutes later she got it out and looked at it and asked where the rest had gone No no amount of talking or counting would convince her otherwise. She turned to me and said we both known youve taken it !. I know she was ill but that cut me to the bone. So the end we solved the problem by printing out a wad of £20 notes on the computer as she didnt known the difference and if they vanished we just printed more!;)

Its a horrible disease and a horrible life for those living it and everyone connected to them. Even a saint would lose their patience and i dont know why we expect to be superhuman and not get frustrated or cross from time to time.
 
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Tufty

Registered User
Jul 18, 2014
27
Bristol
Me too!

Yes, I too, slip back into arguing logically with my Mum! Doesn't go anywhere, particularly as I am arguing against a life time's illogical (IMO) beliefs that have become fossilised, exaggerated and ever more rigid and which now make life difficult for my Dad as well as for her.

So, you're certainly not the only one who a) argues and then b) feels bad afterwards.

Take a deep breath, go for a walk, and remember you're not alone!

Tufty
 

Delphie

Registered User
Dec 14, 2011
1,269
That lack of logic and an obsession about money is such a toxic combination. Sooooo hard not to argue back and reason when someone is accusing you of something bizarre, something you definitely wouldn't do, couldn't have done.

My preferred tactic was to walk away but I still tried arguing back when my mum started accusing my sons. I just had to defend them, as pointless as it was. No mum, they didn't travel back with their friends from their holiday in France last night to break into your house and steal your things...
 

Quilty

Registered User
Aug 28, 2014
1,051
GLASGOW
Me too!

Just had the same situation last night with my Mum. Normally keep it calm, supportive but at the end of my tether last night so just had to let her know how I felt, for her, my long-suffering Dad, our family etc. She twisted everything I have said and done, dismissed the decades I have supported her mental health problems and told me I disgusted her. Yes, I know it is the disease but I find myself seeing her less as my Mum and more of a 'problem' to be managed. I know this sounds heartless and cold and I'm not proud of it but I don't think I could manage this situation and everything else going on in my life if I didn't. Be kind to yourself, forgive yourself: I am trying to reconcile that it is a very long road ahead so the odd stumble is inevitable.

You certainly aren't alone.


You are not alone with this. My Mum has had mental illness my whole life and I have been called all sorts of names despite being the only one here and still helping her. She has driven everyone else in her life away. I now also see her as a problem to deal with. You are shielding yourself from pain. Not everyone had a lovely sweet Mum before the dementia kicked in. You, like me are also carting around a lot of "old life" baggage. Its heavy and tiring! You are doing what you can. Its what all the people on this forum are doing - the rest of the people in our lives are doing little or nothing to help. You have understanding friend here who will never judge you.
 

Rageddy Anne

Registered User
Feb 21, 2013
5,984
Cotswolds
It's so horribly painful isn't it? I didn't know my father had Dementia, and took it all for real. My heart goes out to you, even worse somehow when it involves your children.
 

Witzend

Registered User
Aug 29, 2007
4,291
SW London
I had one spectacular argument with my mother after she went into the CH. She could not in the least understand why she needed to be there and was angry and resentful, accusing us all of just being after her money, she was cutting us all out of her will, etc.

I knew it would do no good, she would not believe any of it, nor would she ever remember any of it, but I had that one major rant at her - she could no longer even make herself a cup of tea! She had Alzheimer's! She couldn't remember anything for more than ten seconds! If we hadn't found this nice place for her, social services would have taken over and put her in some ghastly place smelling of wee! As for being after her money, had she any idea of how much this place cost? If we'd all been after her money we'd just have left her in squalor at home! Etc.

I suppose I would not have done it, and it WAS just the once, if I had not known that she would not remember any of it and be even more upset than she already was. It was such a difficult time, and it was so hard and upsetting to be accused of all sorts of awful things when we had done our damnedest to keep her at home and had put the decision off too long anyway. In some small way I suppose it did relieve my feelings at a very stressful time.
 
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malomm

Registered User
Mar 23, 2014
237
Campania Region, Italy
No Denise, you are not the only one, and I can understand and emphasise with how you feel. I have very low tolerance level, and sometimes feel I should hold my tongue more, but it just gets the better of me. Like you Delphie, my wife has obsessions with money, hides it, and then accuses me or son no.3 of stealing it. Hugs to all of you on this thread, and if you can
keep smiling,
malomm

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