What Do You Think?

[Brucie]

Blimey, I felt me ole hackles rising when I saw your first para, Lynne!

But probably because I came from a broken home and was raised by Mum, I have always felt a very close affinity to women, with great regard for [most of] them. So I'll rest me pulse a bit.

In the days when I used to employ people to work in my team, doing analytical work on huge volumes of data, I would generally find that it was the women I would choose, they were simply better than the blokes I saw. Also, when I'd work on through lunchtime to finish something, it was the women who also stayed, and we waited for the blokes to come back from the pub.....

Perhaps I've been unfortunate in Jan's family to have a bunch of women who have just been unable, for whatever reason, to empathise with Jan's condition, except to spout meaningless words, and never visit her.

I've had some great male friends though, who have visited and helped her and me. But in truth, there have also been a number of close female friends who have done so.

When it comes down to it, I have too small a knowledge of either men or women in caring situations. The old analytical background comes to the fore again - I need sufficient validated data to go on. In Jan's home, there are as many men visiting as women; how they were when the relative was at home, I can't know.

So I take people as they come.


It's good to discuss these things!

 

[rummy]

I've seen it go both ways, the son that is the great care taker and the daughter that is the great care taker. And in reverse ! I know that my husband in my position would do as good a job or better than I do with my Mom. My step sisters that live within visiting distance could at least call their Dad on a regular basis,( he is ill but doesn't have AD) I asked them to call him every week because it gives him something else to think about and some adult conversation other than caring for my Mom 24/7. And they might call once a month. Guess you can tell I have a very low opinion of them. I'm the step daughter and take more interest. All they can say is" gee sure glad you live close to them Debbie" Never mind that they are able to work full time jobs and have a life not consumed with AD and other elder issues. I take on caretaking gladly, it just ruffles my feathers that they can't at least call. My step brother however that lives across the nation, calls them regularly and takes care of his own Mom there. Sorry, I don't think it is a gender issue, it is a good human issue.
Debbie

 

[Norman]

Lynne
I was about to get annoyed when I started to read your posting,then I read the rest and it was ok.
I remember on a management course being given a printed page and follow instructions.
All down the page were notes,copy this line,check this line and various instructions.People were so busy rushing to complete the paper and at the end it said "just put the paper down on the table and do nothing"
The moral read it all before you knock it.
I think it's all about love,this caring, and kind loving people are born not made,that can be male or female.
Men do cry,I have and so have my two boys, the 6 foot one and the 6 foot three one.
all best wishes
Norman

 

[Michael E]

As a generalisation I do not quite agree with Brucie -

I think that frequently women appear to be more caring and prepared to give of their time to others. My wife's brother is very happy to give me advice and instructions but is not willing to 'Monique sit' for a couple of days to give me a chance to sort some problems I have.

A very nice lady in town visits us 2 or 3 times a week after her work and talks with Monique or takes her out for a glass of wine in a cafe.... I am so very lucky to have her help me. There are more female nurses than male nurses..That is all anecdotal of course -

I think husbands who love their wives or feel they owe them, want to look after them when the bad times come but I am not too certain I could do this for anyone else on a regular basis.

 

[Brucie]

Hi Michael,

How strange... frequently I don't agree with Bruce either!

Once upon a time I had very strong views on all sorts of things. Nowadays I still start off with a view that I have formulated, but only after lots of discussion with myself.

Then I review my view when I hear a different one presented.

Sometimes I stay where I was; sometimes I modify my view; sometimes I change my view; otherwise I simply register the different views and think "ain't life interesting?"

Ah, it is never rocket science is it? ...and of course I am saying nothing new.

Now, to the point at hand.

I came to caring from a husband/wife perspective. In such a situation, where one cares for the other in our sort of position, I don't think there can be a difference whether it is husband/wife or wife/husband.

Where things do change, and where women expand to fill a space all their own, is in indiscriminate caring... indiscriminate in terms that they afford similar levels of care to ... whoever they are caring for.

I couldn't do that as I never opened myself up to be completely vulnerable to anybody else, other than Jan. When my Mum became ill through strokes and diabetes, it was my brother who stepped in and helped. He was living a few minutes away as compared to my 2 hours, but I don't think I could have done what I have done for Jan for my Mum. I'll never know because I was 100% involved and committed in looking after Jan. Still causes me anguish since Mum died a few years ago.

Hey, it occurs to me to point out that my brother is a bloke though......!

 

[jc141265]

Gender issues

Me, I care not because of my gender but because of the relationship I had with the sufferer.

Perhaps women statistically do care more, but as that is already an accepted society stereotype that doesn't need any more publicity maybe we should give the guys a break, especially those that have to continually cop the negative stereotypes all the time, despite giving their all.

Well done guys, well done ladies and to those that don't care, they are to be pitied.

Thats my say!

 

[Brucie]

Nat

your wisdom scares me, yet impresses me more than I could reasonably expect! I was going to say 'more than I can say' but realised that wouldn't have been true because I'd have been saying it.

My life is filled with recursive loops....

 

[daughter]

Bruce - "My life is filled with recursive loops" - do you mean like this?

function fact(the_more_I_learn){
        if(the_more_I_learn <> infinity)
	        return (the_more_I_learn + the_less_I_know)
        else
	        return (the_less_I_know)
}

 

[Brucie]

Close enough, though now you have me even more scared than usual, writing code like that.

I was going to reply with a bit of SAS code, then I thought it might be cool to do some Extended Mercury Autocode, the first programming language I learned in 1965 but then realised there would be few around who would give a hoot, so I leave the title of TP Coder to you, having retired from the fray myself.

Stop;
End;

 

[Norman]

My brain hurts!!!
Can't talk any more now I have to carry on with my caring duties or I won't be finished by 10 pm
Norman

 

[EllieS]

Y'know What?

You're all pretty special people - only hope I can get to a stage soon where my head can cope with all of you bright sparks.

Happy Days.

Ellie

 

[Mary Poppins]

Of Brothers and sons (and daughters too)

I agree with Nat in some part - the relationship you had with the person before their illness counts for a lot, but I also think its the person you are as well. Some of us can't cope with illness whether physical or mental illness so they pretend it isn't happening, I have brother like this he takes the ostrich apoproach to AD - There was nothing wrong for years I was making it up to be nasty in the end I gave up and I think it dawned on him when dad couldn't remeber who he was that I may be right. Even now he copes with it in his way - letting everyone else do everything and turning up now and again to tell mum how busy he is. Funnily enough mum won't hear a word said about him - must be first born syndrome I think! My Sister is a mixture really - she manages to detach herself totally emotionally and to her her dad is no longer there so to her he is gone already and we just need to 'sort out' care for him. And Me? well I have had crohns disease for 35 years so I know a bit about inner strength but apart from that I can't understand my brother and sister - we never had to ask them twice for anything we could always rely on them 100% so to me there is no question of being there for them both. I can still touch my Dad, hold his hand, calm him down tell him I love him and he still smiles at me even though his eyes are vacant. I can help my mum to laugh even when there's not much to laugh at even when dad does something that really upsets her. In fact I would say that our relationship is closer now than ever. My teenage son and daughter still visit their grandma and grandad and they are totally comfortable with grandad and all his oddities, I explained to them very early on that there was nothing to fear (yes I know apart from fear itself!) but my brother hasn't brought his children for 4 years which means my mum hasn't seen them either. Does she cease to become a person because of my dad?

Sorry I am rambling!!!

Just as a footnote I wanted to tell you all about my wonderful daughter (18 years old) who is caring for her best friend who is about to lose her mum to cancer. I just wanted to say how proud I am of how she is coping with it all - perhaps her grandad has taught her something after all

 

[Elise]

Hi Ellie

I here you and i know what it is like to know that you are on your own. My brother and sister at first were all realy concerned, but that soon ended. The visits are less and less and the excuses are "Oh we are so busy and will get to see dad soon" I am tired of figting with them to make them understand that he need visitors and help. They just don't feel the same way as i do. It's strange, i don't know about your situtation but reading about your brother i can relate. Some people are just not made of the special stuff we are made of. I know when someone means so Much to me that i will do anything to make sure they are happy and safe. No matter what has happened in the past!. I get some comfort out of thinking that i am not alone in my quest to make my dad happy and comfortable, not with family members but my good friend that i have, they are wonderful. On days i can't visit dad my friend will go for me. I am going away for christmas this year and she has assured me she will see him on christmas day. "I cried like a baby! My own family won't put them selves out for there own father yet a stranger (my friend will). Trying to find a safe place for them to live is so hard becouse at the end of the day No one can look after your own as well as you can, but with this horrid illness we are unable to do this full time without giving up a whole big chunk of our lives and without having an effect on others. In my case my children, they love there grandad, but it is a lot to put on them to see the progression of this heard renching illness eveyday. I do hope that you will find the write place for your mum. I know that what ever we do for our loved ones is for the best, but the guild never seems to ease. At the end of the day you are a good person and can only do your best.

All the best Elise.

 

[EllieS]

Thank you Elise.

I've not been on the forum for a few days - I'm not sure but I think it may have been making me think too much!

That's what I've got to try not to do - I need to do what I can, trust in myself and get on and find a life for myself - it's what my Mum and my Dad would want.

To hell with the people that don't give a hoot - that's their problem.

WISH I COULD PRACTICE WHAT I PREACH!

Thanks again.

Ellie

 

[connie]

Ellie, stop being so hard on yourself. I agree sometimes we get TP overload, done it often myself, you start worrying about everybodies problems.
Take care of yourself, take time for yourself, and then you will be able to face life a little easier. God bless, Connie