What do I do now???

[ishard]

Now what do I do?

We (Mum and I) have been to the solicitors 3 times now trying to get the LPA set up, and each time the solicitors needs more information than mum can remember so we trot off home again. Last time it was my home address so why didnt she ask me???? I was in the waiting room!!

The solicitor won’t let me go in with Mum and doesn’t explain in a way that Mum would understand. I tried phoning the solicitor and spoke to the receptionist to explain that I need to go in with Mum and explain things to her so that she can understand, not the legalese they use, but the solicitor wont even return my call!!!!

Mum is getting more and more frustrated and anxious about the LPA now. Don’t they know how hard it is to get someone who has AD and doesn’t want to go out to actually go out??

It is getting imperative that we set this up soon and register it straight away as Mum is getting worse by the day and soon she wont be able to do it and then I cant help with her bills or banking etc as I do now, as it is I have to lie to Virgin Media to say I’m my mum when her phone gets cut off for non payment!

Oh and the cost of doing it through the solicitor is 587 quid, that’s without registering it!

 

[jenniferpa]

That's absolutely ridiculous ishard - £587 ????
Have you considered going the partial DIY route? I say partial, because you still have to get someone to do the certificate provider statement. Have a look here http://www.publicguardian.gov.uk/arrangements/how-to-lpa.htm#thelpaform

P.S. I lied to several companies on the phone.

 

[zoet]

Hiya Ishard. What a frustrating situation. I'm not sure about this, but couldn't you give your mum a list of things she needs to know in her hand for her to refer to? Don't know if thats allowed or if it would help her. Also, couldn't she take a friend unrelated to the LPA to act as a sort of advocate as well as yourself?

It is a right palaver I know!. Keep at it. What does the solicitor say by way of advice? I think thats alot of money to pay too. Does your solicitor have experience of dealing with elderly or people with AD? Could you ask for a different one? I know things are urgent, but it doesnt sound like your solicitor is being as helpful as he should be.

Just keep reassuring your mum that it will soon be sorted and then remind her about something to look forward to when she no longer has to worry about it. For example, I keep telling my dad (who also seems very drained with the whole thing) "Just think dad, when we've sorted all this out you wont have to worry about another thing and you can have a think about how you want to do the garden this year, and we can make a list of all your old friends and try to write to them to see how theyre doing!" He likes those ideas and they distract him from the exhausting financial problems.

You know I think the AD is definately worse when they are worried, or in formal situations like talking to the bank or a solicitor, even if you are there. My solicitor was lovely and explained things really well to dad.

I asked the bank if I could be third party on my dads accounts which they did, and now I have the authority to pay things for him, have a card to his account and write cheques. So no more lying to stupid companies! (BT have been the worst so far). So you could try that.

Explain again to the solicitors, and say that you will have to choose another if they do not help you. There will be some good ones out there who know exactly how to get the information from your mum. Keep smiling and good luck!

 

[sue38]

To be fair to the Solicitor (and I am not just sticking up for solicitors ) the notes for the Certificate Provider do say that the attorney cannot be present when you discuss the LPA with the person making the LPA. Also the LPA is still quite new and we haven't had that many people doing the new LPA that it is yet second nature. With the old EPA the basic details you needed were names, addresses and the donor's date of birth. With the new LPA there is much more detailed information required. I have produced a check list for my firm, which I think we will need to refer to for some time, before we get the swing of it.

Having said that I would have no problem with popping through to the waiting room to check someone's address.

Did you ring around for quotes as £500 plus VAT is very much on the high side? Does this solicitor know your Mum? That might be a good reason to stick with them if your Mum knows and trusts them, but otherwise I would go elsewhere. Check how much the existing solicitors intend to charge you if you terminate instructions now.

 

[Skye]

Ishard, that's a ridiculous situation. For one thing, it's way too expensive, and for another, there's absolutely no reason why you shouldn't be present to help explain things. All that's required is that the solicitor is satisfied that your mum undertands what she is signing, and anyone can help to explain to her.

I'd ring your local branch of AS, PRT, or MIND and ask for recommendations for a solicitor who's used to dealing with dementia cases. Your mum needs sympathetic explanation, not bullying.

 

[117katie]

Dear Ishard,

It's daft that you are being told that you can't be present with your Mum during the initial "form filling" - you can actually download the forms and fill them in before going anywhere near a solicitor, so that bit doesn't require absolute privacy. Your solicitor is stressing your Mum unnecessarily.

Sure, a solicitor may well need a chat with your Mum without you actually being present, just to verify that she does indeed understand the finer details of an LPA. But that is all.

I'd have a serious chat with the solicitor - if you can get them to speak with you!! Good luck on that one.

With regard to bills: you don't need to lie to any of the companies involved. Most will accept a letter written or typed by you, but in your Mum's name and signed by her, asking them to send all bills to you for payment. Simple as that. We did it with all bill-senders. BT were the most awkward on the phone - via somewhere or other - but once it was all in writing, no problem whatsoever. Suggest to Virgin Media that they ought to have a "Vulnerable Citizen" scheme whereby they never cut off anyone who needs a phone to be connected - regardless of whether the bill is paid. You don't need to be elderly or have dementia for that to be put into place to protect a vulnerable person.

And I recommend the Third Party on the bank account, too. One form to be filled in. Easy and saves an awful lot of hassle.

I'd also mention to the solicitor that you have "taken advice" and that £587 is a bit steep so would they kindly reconsider their charge! Else go elsewhere - but check first how much their 'severance pay' would be!!

Stress you could do without.

Katie

 

[ishard]

Thank you for your replies it has strenthened by resolve to get the LPA sorted out.

I rang another solicitor and told him all about my Mum and her AD and Dementia and how that expresses itself with her andthat I was going to download the forms from the internet and ask mum (with my help)complete them at home so there is no further stress.
Thank you for directing me to the forms
I then went on to say that it would be best if the LPA was registered straight away and he said that perhaps I should get a letter from her GP to say that Mum can is capable of understand what she is actually signing. She is when its explained to her in ways she can understand.
I asked the new solicitor how much it would cost to register and hes getting back to me on that

The new solicitor seems much more approachable.

lol Now the get the 'other' solicitor to take notice when I cancell them, cos Im sure Mum wont do this.

 

[sue38]

This is an extract from the OPG's booklet LPA 107 which is a guide for Certificate Providers

"Understanding mental capacity
A formal test of mental capacity is not necessary in order to provide a Certificate. However, it is important that you are satisfied that, in your opinion, the Donor understands the LPA they are making, has the mental capacity to make it and that they are not being forced into making it.
It is important that you think about the questions you will need to ask the Donor to establish their capacity and understanding. You may want to consider asking the Donor the following open questions to help you establish if they:
1. Understand the LPA and the powers they are giving:
• What is an LPA?
• Why do you want to make an LPA?
• Who are you appointing as your Attorney?
• Why have you chosen to appoint x as your Attorney?
• What powers are you giving your Attorney(s)?

2. Have been put under pressure to make the LPA:
• Has the Attorney given you the answers to certain questions (like those listed above)?
• Do you have any reason to believe that the Attorney is
not trustworthy?
3. Are aware of any other reasons why the LPA should
not be created.
You will also need to ask questions that are specific to the person and the LPA in front of you. You may want to prepare
a checklist to help you with this.
This list is not a formal test of capacity and is only provided as a guide to the types of questions you may want to ask to help you when forming your opinion as to whether or not the Donor understands the LPA and if he or she has been pressured into making it."

I think it's pretty clear that there is no requirement for the person making the LPA to be able to give all the information, such as everyone's address, themselves and can be helped by the attorney.

It is an absolute necessity however that the Certificate Provider discusses the LPA with the person without the attorney being present. If it later transpires that the attorney was present, the LPA could be void and you could end up in a bigger mess.

I always say to people who bring mum or dad along to make a will that they cannot be present when they sign. If they are unhappy about this I explain that it is much for their benefit so that they cannot be accused of influencing mum or dad.

Ishard, you can download the forms yourselves and just get someone to do the Certificate. This can be a solicitor, the GP, other health professionals, someone who has known the person for 2 years etc. I think in most of those cases you would be charged a fee. You can then download the forms to register the LPA. The fee is £150.

 

[Chrissyan]

I went last September, the solicitor let me go in with Dad. He had used them before but his solicitor was retired this was a lady we had never seen before. She had our Dad's will etc out & already half filled in the forms including my DOB & address which she had got from that. She just wanted it verbally confirmed (by me) that I was still at the same address, DOB was correct etc.

Although Dad had got stressed all day about the visit & I kept having to tell him over & over why we were going, he understood perfectly what he was doing at the time as the solicitor explained it a very simple & easily understood way. Fifteen minutes later it was all done, just my brother to call in later & sign. Dad got the bill two weeks later £35. Not registered of course, all in all an excellent service. ishard I really think that solicitor was no good.

It is an absolute necessity however that the Certificate Provider discusses the LPA with the person without the attorney being present. If it later transpires that the attorney was present, the LPA could be void and you could end up in a bigger mess.

I hope that didn't apply to an EPA as well

 

[sue38]

I hope that didn't apply to an EPA as well

No it didn't.

I think you should expect to pay considerably more for a solicitor preparing an LPA as they are much more involved than an EPA.