1. Expert Q&A: Protecting a person with dementia from financial abuse - Weds 26 June, 3:30-4:30 pm

    Financial abuse can have serious consequences for a person with dementia. Find out how to protect a person with dementia from financial abuse.

    Sam, our Knowledge Officer (Legal and Welfare Rights) is our expert on this topic. She will be here to answer your questions on Wednesday 26 June between 3:30 - 4:30 pm.

    You can either post questions >here< or email them to us at talkingpoint@alzheimers.org.uk and we'll answer as many as we can on the day.

  1. Tubbsy

    Tubbsy Registered User

    Sep 5, 2010
    108
    Surrey
    I'm hoping for opinions/advice about a situation I have with my mum who is in mid stage and some unwanted (by me) 'friends' of hers. It's a very long story but she's an 82 year old, well off widow who has been befriended by a couple my age (early 40s) who live near her (they met dog walking a few years ago), who are not the sort of people she would ever have been friends with before she was ill. A few things have happened that have made me very angry, such as the husband thinking he would make a speech at her 80th party I'd organised with her friends of 70 years, to make me very suspicious of them. Now, my mum is pretty bad and they keep on popping round to see her and then ringing me to basically criticise me that her house is a mess for example. This week they discovered she'd cut her leg s rang to tell me and then 2 days later are checking up that I've dealt with it. I tried to be nice by saying they don't need to keep going to see her as my brother and I are very present (which we are) but then had to say I felt they were getting too involved. I actually wanted to say a lot more but felt it best not to at this stage! Am I being paranoid or is it rather odd for such a couple to be taking such an inter rest in my mum when they know she has me and my brother?
     
  2. sistermillicent

    sistermillicent Registered User

    Jan 30, 2009
    2,951
    I looked back over your previous thread a couple of years ago - are these the same neighbours who seemed invasive then? Did you ever get LPA sorted out as that would seem to be the thing that would put off anyone with devious intentions.

    I would trust your instincts. Could you organise carers to go in every day as they won't overstep the boundaries but will still let you know if anything is wrong like a cut leg.
     
  3. Tubbsy

    Tubbsy Registered User

    Sep 5, 2010
    108
    Surrey
    Hi, thanks for commenting. Yes, it's the same people. We didn't manage to get power of attorney as my mum simply wouldn't give it to us and now she 'lacks mental capacity' so I guess we'd have to go to the court of protection which we can't really afford. I really want to stop these people from being in my mum's life but don't know how. I live 30 mins drive away, have a job and 2 kids so can't just pop over but do visit every week. My brother is more local and visits about 5 times per week. I hate the thought of them being in her house with access to everything (including cash which is always there). Surely most people would consider the fact there's family around to help and not take my mum to get her hair done for example, without telling me or asking if I'd been planning to (which I had) and then not be able to get away quick enough when I answered my mum's door on their return?
     
  4. Tubbsy

    Tubbsy Registered User

    Sep 5, 2010
    108
    Surrey
    Oh and yes, I would like t get careers in but don't really know how to go about it. My mum doesn't want help and would have to pay but as we have no access to her money. Don't see how we could arrange it.
     
  5. kingybell

    kingybell Registered User

    Feb 3, 2015
    115
    Not really sure what to do but I personally would be rude to them and try and isolate them from your mum.
    We have had similar with my mum in law although she's not got any money really.
    I explained she's got dementia and therefore can't make decision on who her friends are.
    I would prefer if that its just family and people we have known a long tine looking out for her.

    Who cares what they think?
     
  6. Tin

    Tin Registered User

    May 18, 2014
    4,829
    UK
    If there is a genuine risk of this couple taking advantage of her financially and you feel you just can't tell them to 'back off' then you really should go for Court of Protection. What about any valuables in the house. It really sounds like this couple have crossed the line or they genuinely believe they are helping you and your family.
     
  7. 100 miles

    100 miles Registered User

    Apr 16, 2015
    109
    There is a teeny possibility that the couple are trying to be helpful.

    When my daughter was at university she helped a distressed neighbour who had dementia whose cat was repeatedly 'stolen'. She usually found the cat asleep in the armchair. I encouraged her to let her neighbour's daughter know that she sometimes went into her house to help her with things (not just the stolen cat) as I was worried she could be accused of stealing things if anything went missing. The alternative would have been to ignore her distressed neighbour's requests for help. Tricky. My daughter couldn't understand why she was met with so much hostility....but I pointed out that the neighbour was very vulnerable so her daughter had a right to be suspicious. (Neighbour eventually moved into a care home.)

    I have no idea about this couple's motives. But sometimes people just want to help. :confused:
     
  8. Tubbsy

    Tubbsy Registered User

    Sep 5, 2010
    108
    Surrey
    I'm quite sure they know I don't like them and it's very tempting to just tell them straight to back off, but I don't think they'd take any notice and I can't actually do anything to stop them going round to her house unfortunately. They couldn't get to her money while she's alive but I do worry that they could somehow get her to rewrite her will and have no doubt they've seen paperwork lying around which shows how much money she's got. Unfortunately, despite my mum being mid stage, she's still as stubborn as she always has been and won't be told what to do, so doesn't take any notice of my brother and I telling her to keep her paperwork hidden. Of course, when she ends up in a home, which will ideally be this year, I can prevent them having any contact and will definitely do so.
     
  9. joggyb

    joggyb Registered User

    Dec 1, 2014
    119
    If you want to consider getting carers for your mum, then do try talking to her GP as a first point of contact and explain your concern. If s/he isn't interested, then contact Social Services and tell them that your mum is a vulnerable elderly adult at risk. That should trigger some action or involvement.

    If not, try talking to Age UK or the Alzheimer's Society. They should be able to hook you up to services available in your mum's area (which may include some free hours of mum sitting), and help you to access them.

    Finally, if you're really worried about this particular couple, and they keep visiting your mum despite you telling them not to, I'd have a word with the local police to put them on notice.

    Good luck.
     
  10. RedLou

    RedLou Registered User

    Jul 30, 2014
    1,161
    If they could financially exploit her to her own or her family's future financial detriment then go to the Court of Protection as you have more to lose if you don't.
    We had precisely the same with one woman who started visiting my dad and helping him with his' paperwork.' When he was taken to a long-stay hospital ward and I removed his cheque book she stopped visiting. I'd say that was pretty indicative of the level of her interest.
     
  11. LYN T

    LYN T Registered User

    Aug 30, 2012
    6,967
    Brixham Devon
    I would say trust your instincts and apply for Deputyship-you will be able to pay using your Mum's funds. My late Husband had a friend who he lent money to (when he was well) as soon as he found out Pete had AD he started sending texts saying that he and his girlfriend were going on holiday to Australia, but they didn't have enough money to do all the things they wanted to do:eek::mad:Big hint there, and when Pete was well he would have stumped up. The trouble was this 'friend' never paid back any of the money that Pete had given him-but that was Pete for you.

    Luckily (!) Pete couldn't use a landline let alone a mobile. I simply put their number on 'ignore' status! Don't know if they got to Australia-no contact since so that suited me fine.

    There are some good people in the world but there are also some real users:mad:

    Take care

    Lyn T XX
     
  12. Chemmy

    Chemmy Registered User

    Nov 7, 2011
    7,593
    Yorkshire
    One thing I've learned from time on TP is that there really are some genuine lowlifes around amongst some people's friends and families.
     
  13. Bod

    Bod Registered User

    Aug 30, 2013
    1,111
    Lpa

    Does your mother have periods where she understands what she is doing?
    even if she forgets later that she has done them?

    To get an LPA the donor has to understand what they are signing at the time of signing only. The fact that next day they can't recall doing it doesn't count.
    Get her GP to be the Certificate Provider, to show she had capacity at the time of signing.

    The forms are simple if taken 1 question at a time. Solicitors are not needed for this!!

    Act fast. Get both LPAs.

    Bod
     
  14. SugarRay

    SugarRay Registered User

    May 5, 2014
    48
    Sunny South East
    We managed to get PoA through a very helpful Solicitor - we (my brother and I) got both, yes it cost us a bit over the grand and yes Mum wasn't wholly there but there enough to sign. It may be worth looking into.. Just throwing it out there. SR. x
     
  15. Isabella41

    Isabella41 Registered User

    Feb 20, 2012
    901
    Northern Ireland
    If there is absouletly no chance of getting POA then you really must go for deputyship. The cost for this comes out of your mum's account so there is no charge to you. Its the only way you can safeguard her finances and her. On one hand there really may be no malicious intent intended by these 'friends' but on the balance of probabilites it is decidly odd when this young couple would be taking such an interest in an elderly woman especially as they know she has a family who are very much involved.
    If it were me I'd make it my business to have a so called accidental casual chat with these folk and then casually say something along the lines of "I can't tell you how relieved we are all are that we finally have power of attorney for mum's finances". If they are after her for money you'd won't see their heels for dust as they will realise there is no chance of getting anything. Its sneaky I know but might be worth a shot.
     
  16. Tubbsy

    Tubbsy Registered User

    Sep 5, 2010
    108
    Surrey
    Bod....thank you for this. I thought that as she is so bad now I wouldn't be able to down this route but he's, she has times of lucidity where she knows what she's doing/saying, so it seems I can. Only problem is she'll be lucid enough to say she doesn't want my brother and I to have it! Thanks again, I will give it a try. :)
     
  17. Tubbsy

    Tubbsy Registered User

    Sep 5, 2010
    108
    Surrey
    Thank you all for your comments and advice. The wife sent me a stroppy text last night in response to mine telling her they're too involved.....am now going over in my mind how to respond to her. It's good to know other people don't just think I'm overreacting to them....I'm a pretty good judge of character and situations and this hasn't seemed right from the beginning. Even my kids think its odd, like me and their dad befriending an elderly widow and spending a lot of time with her. These people have a teenage daughter too...an absolute charmer that one! ;)
     
  18. Liz57

    Liz57 Registered User

    Dec 22, 2013
    184
    I'm sure not everyone is like this but I do know of a situation when an elderly lady with no children had a stroke. The nephew living nearby did lots for her but after some months a "friend" appeared whom the nephew hadn't met before. She "helped out" with shopping and the like which at the time was a relief to the nephew but it soon became apparent that things were disappearing from the house. Not long later it was clear that the lady couldn't look after herself any longer and the nephew, reluctantly, helped find a really nice care home. He continued to visit regularly and after a few months when his aunt died, he found that the "friend" had taken a solicitor to the care home and somehow managed to get the aunt to change her will, leaving everything to the "friend". He chose not to challenge it but was upset not that his aunt's estate had gone to someone unrelated but that all the family items, papers and general history were literally thrown away.

    It's difficult to know who to trust but I'd say go with your instincts.
     
  19. Tubbsy

    Tubbsy Registered User

    Sep 5, 2010
    108
    Surrey
    How does this sound....'It isn't an issue of you troubling me, rather that you respect the fact that she has family around her, taking care of her needs and wishes, which thus far, you haven't seemed to. She may be your friend but she is our mother and you haven't known her long enough to know much about her or her situation. As we have power of attorney, when the time comes, we will move her to a care home'.

    Of course we don't have power of attorney and my mother does go to them for all sorts of things but this is because a) she's lonely and b) she can remember how to walk to their house and c) they have ingratiated themselves into her life to such an extent, I think she has come to rely on them somewhat. I forgot to mention he stores his motorbike in her garage and has also kept his campervan there......something she would never have agreed to as her previous self.
     
  20. Tubbsy

    Tubbsy Registered User

    Sep 5, 2010
    108
    Surrey

    This kind of story terrifies me! My mum did used to have a lot of antiques and medals/war memorabilia which my dad collected.....none of it is there now but I know she sold a lot of it when he died (20 years ago) so can't tell if things have since gone missing. How could I find out if they've got a solicitor to see her???
     

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