• Expert Q&A: Rare dementias - Tues 3 March, 3-4pm

    Our next expert Q&A will be on the topic of rare dementias. It will be hosted by Nikki and Seb from Rare Dementia Support. If you have any questions about rare dementias, they will be here to answer them on Tuesday 3 March between 3-4pm.

    You can either post your question >here< or email them to us at talkingpoint@alzheimers.org.uk and we'll be happy to ask them on your behalf.

Threatening Suicide

Natashalou

Registered User
Mar 22, 2007
426
london
Just back from four draining hours with mum. when I arrived, she was in the lounge. she hates being in the lounge, with what she calls "those people"...eg other residents. However she now has to be watched 24/7 due to the constant falling over, and understandably this cant be provided if she stays in her room.
She went immedietly into moan overdrive the second I got there.
She had been seated next to another reasonably aware resident and even that lady told her to stop moaning! (it was funny)
She then announced she wanted me to find "one of those places to kill her". I told her such places dont exist (although I know for the terminally ill they do abroad). She then spent an hour assuring me she would find a way "to do it! ".
By bad chance, my older son (aged 21) is going through big trauma at present and I spent last night convincing him that his (not serious) suicide threats werent a good idea. this had eveidently worked as he had gone to see his grandmother and eaten all her sweets!
I FEEL LIKE TELLING THEM TO SIGN A PACT!!
On a more serious note, nothing I do or try or suggest seems to work. I have told the nurse on duty who will speak with the doctor about gettin her some anti depressents but I feel so at a loss to try and help her.
she cant walk, she cant use one arm, she is mildly incontinent, she claims to be in constant pain (although im not sure I actually believe that bit), she cant really see, she is confused and forgetful which seems to get worse each day, she has paranoia and persecution complex (she was having medication for that but has had to come off it due to having stronger painkillers).
She seems to think I ought to be there all day and every day and doesnt understand I have a full time job (well two jobs actually) a younger son than Mr "Im Suicidal" to see to. She is fuming that I cant go with her to the hospital on Thursday but I just cannot take any more time off work.
I am frankly feeling suicidal myself at this exact moment!!!:mad:
 

Margarita

Registered User
Feb 17, 2006
10,824
london
I am frankly feeling suicidal myself at this exact moment!!!



will your with good company now , so don't go anywhere as we all need you :)

Don't think i can say anything that would help you cope with your mother moods . only for you that a (((hug)))
 

BeckyJan

Registered User
Nov 28, 2005
18,972
Derbyshire
I have just read your post and wish I could help - but just do not know how.

Dementia is one hell of a place to be - but you have your son to worry about as well. I hope his problems are sorted soon as that in turn will help you. At least he spends time with his Grandmother which must be a good sign.

Suggest you sit back with a glass (or two) of wine or similar - forget the suicidal bit - and remember that we are all behind you here.

Take care Love Beckyjan
 

Grannie G

Volunteer Moderator
Apr 3, 2006
70,405
Kent
Natashalou said:
she now has to be watched 24/7 due to the constant falling over,she cant walk, she cant use one arm, she is mildly incontinent, she claims to be in constant pain (although im not sure I actually believe that bit), she cant really see, she is confused and forgetful which seems to get worse each day, she has paranoia and persecution complex (she was having medication for that but has had to come off it due to having stronger painkillers). :
Dear Natasha,

It seems you are another who is having a really bad time but;

However hard it is for you to cope with, if I had all the above I`d feel exactly the same as your mother.

And probably so would you.

The big problem with dementia, is sufferers live in their own world where there is little or no concern for others.

With those who perhaps always did put themselves first, it is unrealistic to expect anything different.

And the hardest task for carers is to tolerate it and not let it affect them.

When you find the answer to the 6 million dollar question, please share it with me.

Until then, all I can say is `Sorry, I know what you`re going through.`

Love xx
 

Lila13

Registered User
Feb 24, 2006
1,342
I don't think those places abroad for the terminally ill would accept someone with dementia? they'd have to sign something to show they are mentally capable of making such decisions.

My mother also used to go through episodes of suicide threats, not just in her last years, I don't know how serious they were, after a while we just stopped taking much notice of them as we'd "heard it all before". I don't know whether in the end refusing to eat and drink and messing around with medication really did amount to suicide.

She used to threaten to kill all the rest of us too, my father, grandmother, brother, dog, cat and all, if she could think of a way of making it look like an accident.
 
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Kathleen

Registered User
Mar 12, 2005
639
65
West Sussex
Grannie G said:
Dear Natasha,

It seems you are another who is having a really bad time but;

However hard it is for you to cope with, if I had all the above I`d feel exactly the same as your mother.

And probably so would you.

The big problem with dementia, is sufferers live in their own world where there is little or no concern for others.

With those who perhaps always did put themselves first, it is unrealistic to expect anything different.

And the hardest task for carers is to tolerate it and not let it affect them.

When you find the answer to the 6 million dollar question, please share it with me.

Until then, all I can say is `Sorry, I know what you`re going through.`
I agree completely with Sylvia on this one.

Concentrate on your son and maybe spend less time with your Mum when she is in such a negative mood.

I am incredibly lucky to have a Mum who is mostly contented and can giggle for England.

On the rare occasions we visit and she is in a spiteful frame of mind, we cut the visit short.......it doesn't help either of us when she is like that and the staff say she soon stops when we leave.

Your sons seem to need you more than your Mum at the moment, especially the eldest, so maybe it would be worth leaving your time at home with them for a while.

Hopefully the doctor will find a balance of medication to help your Mum feel better soon.

Kathleen
 

panda

Registered User
Apr 16, 2006
88
Surrey
I know what you are going through, my mum has only been in the home one week and she spends all of her time tellig any one that will listen how evil I am. I also have children that have sadly been neglected while I have been trying to cope with work mum running my home and hers, my mum is much less affected than yours I think and she is now looking and sounding great. The home are great and really looking after her. In a way this does not help because it makes me doubt what I have done and in 5 weeks there will be a meeting to decide if she has settled. Mum is still adamant that she is going home, I dont know what happens at these meetings but because she looks so good she may be able to go home and then I dont know how I will manage again. I kept away from visiting this week because she was so awful on my last visit and yesterday she was very nice, it was a hard thing for me to do but it seemed to work...
 

Grannie G

Volunteer Moderator
Apr 3, 2006
70,405
Kent
Dear Panda,

I hope the meeting goes well and it is decided your mum is well placed. The improvemnt in her condition shows she is in the right environment and I wouldn`t worry too much that she might be sent home.

The home knows how she was on admission and knows how she is now.

Take care
 

Kathleen

Registered User
Mar 12, 2005
639
65
West Sussex
panda said:
I think and she is now looking and sounding great. The home are great and really looking after her. In a way this does not help because it makes me doubt what I have done.
As your Mum is doing so well, try not to doubt your decision, it sounds as if it was exactly the right one for all of you.

Your children need you and your Mum is well looked after.

Again, I have to agree with Sylvia, as the home know both her condition on admission and now, it is very unlikely she will not be allowed to stay where she is.

Good luck at the meeting.

Kathleen
x
 

Natashalou

Registered User
Mar 22, 2007
426
london
no

Lila13 said:
I don't think those places abroad for the terminally ill would accept someone with dementia? they'd have to sign something to show they are mentally capable of making such decisions.

.

No, of course they wouldnt and I guess dementia isnt terminal anyway plus I dont think she would ever REALLY go even if it were possible..she doesnt even have a passport!!
however I am happy to report the stress of the last few months has resulted in a weight loss of of approx 9kg. I have worked off a lot of my stresses exercising and my stomach is back to the pre children washboard it was 22 years ago. Because I have been trying so hard to keep well for everyone myself, my diet has improved and in turn my skin hair and nails.
Every cloud has a sliver lining!!!:D
 

Grannie G

Volunteer Moderator
Apr 3, 2006
70,405
Kent
Hi Natasha, that really is making a positive out of a negative. I wish I could say the same. :eek:

I will begin, not tomorrow, but now.;)

Love xx
 

Margarita

Registered User
Feb 17, 2006
10,824
london
Now that sounds good

mine is also back to pre children washboard :D yes I was always big even back then , only when I had my children did I lose weight got down to a size 12-14 with exercising , working looking after them
 

Margarita

Registered User
Feb 17, 2006
10,824
london
No, of course they wouldnt and I guess dementia isnt terminal anywa

AZ is terminal so would I not have that choice if I got AZ) if I wanted to do that , just wondering

I don't think those places abroad for the terminally ill would accept someone with dementia? they'd have to sign something to show they are mentally capable of making such decisions.
mentally capable , they take your signature on a good day and say its legal OK, for money matters , anyway I wonder if a living will would cover my wishes, and I am taking about wishes in really late last stages
 
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Lila13

Registered User
Feb 24, 2006
1,342
Margarita said:
AZ is terminal so would I not have that choice( if I got AZ) if I wanted to do that , just wondering
No, if you really wanted to do that you'd have to do it yourself before needing someone else to help. Deciding the right time must be very difficult.
 

Margarita

Registered User
Feb 17, 2006
10,824
london
No, if you really wanted to do that you'd have to do it yourself before needing someone else to help. Deciding the right time must be very difficul
what even in that country that lets you do it , can't remember the country name .

because they still are helping you , even if you take it yourself
 

Natashalou

Registered User
Mar 22, 2007
426
london
it is complex

It seems to me it is the concept of assisted suicide which is illegal..but I BELIEVE it is legally possible for a doctor in the uk to administer a dose of pain relief which they know will almost certainly be fatal, if it is only that dose which will alleviate the degree of pain.
I am saying here what I was given to understand a few years back when I had an aunt dying of cancer, all that could be done had been done , she had gone home to die, and had Mc Millan nurses going in . (It was they who told me) .
The doctor came and she was in significant pain, drifting in and out of conciousness, it was a matter of time anyway, and he prescribed a massive dose of, I think, morphine.
The nurses said, when it was given she would slip away.
that is what happend and it was a more dignified end than lasting on a few more days in agony.
BUT i have always had slight discomfort over that. My aunt did not ask for that dose, and who was anyone to deny her the last few days, hours or even minutes of life?
She had cancer since 32 years old , but had battled it until 72 years old, having treatment and operations, had been a real fighter all her life and I dont know what was going on in her mind at that point of her demise.
 

Margarita

Registered User
Feb 17, 2006
10,824
london
I dont know what was going on in her mind at that point of her demise.
that what i wonder sometime , my mother sister was given morphine , long story .

thats why I would want my wishes know to my children in a living will , any way I'll stop typing about that & hope that your feeling better in yourself now or in the future to help you cope when you visit your mother xx
 

sue38

Registered User
Mar 6, 2007
10,854
51
Wigan, Lancs
but I BELIEVE it is legally possible for a doctor in the uk to administer a dose of pain relief which they know will almost certainly be fatal, if it is only that dose which will alleviate the degree of pain.
From talking to friends who are doctors I know that a few years ago they would have given a potentially lethal dose of morphine to say a late stage cancer patient if that amount of morphine was necessary to relieve the pain, and if they died as a result....well so be it.

Since Shipman however I think that doctors now have to be VERY careful with the result that they are having to leave people in pain rather than giving a potentially lethal dose.

Sue
 

Lila13

Registered User
Feb 24, 2006
1,342
I think assisted suicide is legal in Switzerland and Holland.

But it would be legal for you to take a lethal dose of something here, if you did it without any help. (At least better than the days when suicide was a crime and the bereaved family were left with that shame as well as normal grief/guilt.)

Too difficult to decide when to take it ...


Margarita said:
what even in that country that lets you do it , can't remember the country name .

because they still are helping you , even if you take it yourself
 

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