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Social services withholding monies

Bernie333

Registered User
May 10, 2022
11
0
Hi
My father recently passed away in a care home. He had not been assesed for fees as he refused to give his bank statements. I was not involved with any decision making prior to his passing as I was told he did not want me involved.
I am now dealing with all his finances ect.
I recently went to collect his belongings and was told they had found his wallet which contained cash. The care home said they would deduct any costs for chiropody ect and sent a cheque. After a couple of weeks I enquired where the cheque was to be told that social services are saying it belongs to them and not to release it to me.
They had no power of attorney or deputyship are they legally allowed to do this?
 

Jessbow

Registered User
Mar 1, 2013
4,218
0
Midlands
If he owed and left cash, then yes I'd think they probably are.

You may find care home costs are due from his estate too
 

Bernie333

Registered User
May 10, 2022
11
0
If he owed and left cash, then yes I'd think they probably are.

You may find care home costs are due from his estate too
Yes fees are due that is being dealt with. I just find it unnecessary. Whatever the local authority are due if his estate allows then they would be paid.
 

Palerider

Registered User
Aug 9, 2015
3,135
0
North West
Hello @Bernie333

I am afraid @Jessbow is right. If your father had the funds to pay for his care then the LA can recoup the costs if his entire estate is more than the upper limit of what he legally can hold without paying towards care fees in England and Wales. Given the state of social care they will apply the law in full and the care homewill also recoup any incurred costs as best they can.

I think its best you take some advice and take the next steps very carefully if your dad had more than £23 250 total estate as you can still be billed for his care.
 

Palerider

Registered User
Aug 9, 2015
3,135
0
North West
Yes fees are due that is being dealt with. I just find it unnecessary. Whatever the local authority are due if his estate allows then they would be paid.
Ah I see you are aware. Care homes are very quick to redeem any costs owing unfortunately, but that doesn't stop you from leaving a review on their website ;). Might be useful to email the LA with a short complaint at how they have managed things at a time when you are only just being aware of matters and perhaps a different approach might have been better
 

Bernie333

Registered User
May 10, 2022
11
0
Thankyou for all your replies. I would like some advice on what I should be supplying to the LA. I have ordered bank statements. He went into the care home fom hospital on assessment I am not sure but I think I read somewhere that the first 28 days is not chargeable. Also he was below the lower threshold on arrival, however he was still getting his state pension and by the time of his passing he was above the lower threshold but below the higher. How should the LA assess should it be what he had in savings at the time of arriving in the home or what he had at his time of passing?
 

nitram

Registered User
Apr 6, 2011
25,087
0
North Manchester
Are you either the executor named in the any will or intending to apply for administration?
If so and note that there is an order in which funds must be distributed.

  • funeral expenses, if not previously paid
  • any taxes that are due
  • creditors, such as loans, mortgages, and outstanding debts
  • beneficiaries, if there is a will and no unpaid creditors have come forward
Note that the care home is third on the list and should not be paid until after probate.
If you are doing the work yourself, especially if the estate is small, seek advice from AgeUK or CAB.
 

Bernie333

Registered User
May 10, 2022
11
0
My dad had no will and I am his only next of kin.
there is no probate as he had no other assessts apart from what was in his bank account.
 

nitram

Registered User
Apr 6, 2011
25,087
0
North Manchester
Also he was below the lower threshold on arrival, however he was still getting his state pension and by the time of his passing he was above the lower threshold but below the higher. How should the LA assess should it be what he had in savings at the time of arriving in the home or what he had at his time of passing?
This should be worked through as if everything happened without delays.
As he was below the lower limit he would have been LA funded and therefore not in receipt of state pension.
Depending on how he was discharged he could have been eligible for up to 6 weeks free care.
 

Palerider

Registered User
Aug 9, 2015
3,135
0
North West
My dad had no will and I am his only next of kin.
there is no probate as he had no other assessts apart from what was in his bank account.
On that basis it is straight forward. I would contact the LA and ask them how they wish to proceed, the financial assessor will basically ask for legitimate copies of bank statements and make their assessment from there and then inform you of the assessment. The lack of a Will doesn't change anything, even if someone had a Will it does not protect them from paying for care fees. Its all down to the payemnts and balances on your dads bank statements
 

Bernie333

Registered User
May 10, 2022
11
0
All I know is he was discharged to his home address but when the ambulance went into the house he was on prepaid meters and there was no credit on them. This was November last year. So they arrange for him to go into the care home and be assessed. I have basically had to take a back seat as my dad wouldn't deal with me or even let me in the house I wanted an assessment for dementia but he refused to see any doctors and the LA deemed him as having capacity so would not discuss anything with me.
 

Jessbow

Registered User
Mar 1, 2013
4,218
0
Midlands
I believe that, if he refused to reveal his finances you are charged as though you are above any thresholds, and will cop for full fees. If he was deemed to have capasity, he will also have been deemed to have made that choice.

Sorry, you may have to prepare yourself for hefty care bill
 

Bernie333

Registered User
May 10, 2022
11
0
Ok as far as I am aware he was deemed as having capacity in regards to his care arrangements but deemed to have no capacity over his finances. The LA was in the process of taking over his finances but was not complete at the time of his passing
 

nitram

Registered User
Apr 6, 2011
25,087
0
North Manchester
Get a quote for a funeral and inform his bank showing them the death certificate, ask the funeral director to send the invoice to the bank in due course.
Having sorted that leave it to the LA and care home to sort everything out.
You said the home wanted to retain money for chiropody etc, this infers the LA had been funding his care.
 

Bernie333

Registered User
May 10, 2022
11
0
Thankyou the funeral is all sorted and an arrangement has been made via the bank to pay the invoice. I am awaiting 6 months worth of bank statements which I will provide to LA. when I spoke to them on the phone they were not very nice when I asked why they were asking the care home to retain what was in his wallet. I was promptly told that a substantial amount of money is owed and it doesn't belong to my dad it belongs to the to tax payer
 

Palerider

Registered User
Aug 9, 2015
3,135
0
North West
Thankyou the funeral is all sorted and an arrangement has been made via the bank to pay the invoice. I am awaiting 6 months worth of bank statements which I will provide to LA. when I spoke to them on the phone they were not very nice when I asked why they were asking the care home to retain what was in his wallet. I was promptly told that a substantial amount of money is owed and it doesn't belong to my dad it belongs to the to tax payer
You have no legal duty only an obligation to settle your dads affairs. The LA financial guys can be very rude and abrupt, but they are just trying it on and have probably made assumptions they ought not to have made, I experienced myself when I had to ask for help as mums only real assets were in her property not her bank account, I basically put the phone down on them after telling them outright at the start that I had not been privy to what matters had gone before my dads death and my mums finances. If you have any concerns at a bare minimum take legal advice which in the scheme of things will not cost a huge amount and set you straight on what your focus is as the distributor of your dads estate