Should it be mandatory for care home staff to have vaccine?

[Max68]

Been reading about the fact that quite a high percentage of care home staff are refusing to have the Covid vaccine. I won't print percentages as they vary from article to article but it has got me thinking about whether mum's care home insists on it or not, even though pretty much everyone at the home went down with Covid in a recent outbreak.

I'm undecided on this. I'm not generally in favour of draconian types of rules that force things upon people but obviously we live in difficult times. At the same time does it matter if some staff don't if all the residents have had two vaccines? I guess the science can't say for certain but obviously I would obviously like mum, and of course us who visit to be as safe as possible and if that is only possible if everyone who enters that care home has had a vaccine then it maybe seems sensible.

Just wondered what others thoughts are on this?

 

[nae sporran]

I live in supported housing and the care staff have not expressed any reservations about having a vaccine. One had a bad reaction, but they all seem fairly happy to have regular testing and to be prioritised for the vaccine. At the risk of upsetting anyone I would be reluctant to allow anyone into our flat to look after my partner who was opposed to having the vaccine.

 

[nitram]

At the same time does it matter if some staff don't if all the residents have had two vaccines?

The % effectiveness of a vaccine is a public health statement not the effect on an individual.
Just another risk to be factored in.

 

[Bikerbeth]

I don’t know what the guidelines are for Hospital staff but I think they should be the same for Carers.
on the practical side (although not right) if there is a shortage of Care Staff anyway by enforcing vaccinations then the shortage may get worse. This is obviously not right but it does seem to be reality.
I would like Care Home Managers to persuade existing staff to have it and I would have thought some of their co workers would prefer all workers to have it.
I do feel though that any person who has a valid reason for not having the vaccination should not be discriminated against. I guess by valid I mean people who have been advised by the professionals not to have it.
sorry my thoughts have gone a bit random

 

[Jessbow]

I think its quite difficult to INSIST a certain category HAS to have it. Where will it end?
All NHS Staff.

All carers?

teachers?

supermarket staff?

Anyone who works in a shop/Public facing role?

 

[nitram]

I don’t know what the guidelines are for Hospital staff

https://www.england.nhs.uk/coronavirus/wp-content/uploads/sites/52/2021/03/C1195-guidance-on-supporting-covid-19-vaccine-uptake-in-staff-v2.pdf

 

[Canadian Joanne]

When I was a child in Canada, I was not allowed to start school until I had my smallpox vaccination. There may have been some loopholes but I don't know if or what they were. Everyone I know of a certain age has their vaccination scar.

I know this may well be an unpopular stance, but I don't see why we cannot do the same for COVID. I realize a very few people may react badly but my opinion is that nothing created by human beings will ever be 100%. There will be those who have existing conditions which will prevent them from getting vaccinated, a cousin of mine being one of these. But if the vast majority are inoculated, there will be herd immunity to protect those who cannot.

I really do not understand the views of those who don't want to be vaccinated for non-medical reasons.

 

[Max68]

I too agree if there is a medical reason why someone shouldn't have it then I can understand that but if it's just choice I can't understand it. It's like masks in some ways, I have a mate who is a severe asthmatic so is exempt from wearing a mask but he says he would rather struggle to breathe in a mask than be on a ventilator, which is hard to argue against! It interests me because I lost most of my hearing when I was a kid which was put down to side effects from the whooping cough vaccination. A few years later we were friends with a family down the road and for religious reasons they didn't do vaccines. The little girl in the family, a friend, suffered whooping cough and died from it. When I think of my hearing loss now in my 50's I look at the positives that the vaccine possibly saved my life. Having said that I have heard that vaccine back in the day could also cause brain damage, so whether I would think the same if things had been worse or I had lost all of my hearing I don't know.

 

[DennyD]

Yes, they should have the vaccine. Carers look after very vulnerable people, and to me it becomes a safeguarding issue. The person working as a carer has a choice of what they do, where they go, who they meet, ie they free to make their own choices, and yes the current situation allows them to make a choice whether to be vaccinated or not. This is their right, but in my opinion they do not have the right to put another - someone whose welfare they are responsible for - knowingly in danger. The cared-for, especially when living in a care/nursing home, is often not in a position to ask whether those who look after them has been vaccinated and is therefore unable to make a decision whether they wish to be cared for by that person. Often they are not in a position to walk away. Doctors, nurses, student nurses etc have to have certain vaccinations to be allowed to practice , so why not those in caring roles?

 

[Lawson58]

It seems to me that it should be mandatory for staff who are working with vulnerable people to have the vaccination.

The matter of choice is that the ones who have decided not to be vaccinated have made the choice to leave the industry.
When I was much younger, I worked at the University of Queensland Medical School and the whole of the student body and staff were given smallpox innoculations, no choice as it was considered to be essential.

 

[Palerider]

Been reading about the fact that quite a high percentage of care home staff are refusing to have the Covid vaccine. I won't print percentages as they vary from article to article but it has got me thinking about whether mum's care home insists on it or not, even though pretty much everyone at the home went down with Covid in a recent outbreak.

I'm undecided on this. I'm not generally in favour of draconian types of rules that force things upon people but obviously we live in difficult times. At the same time does it matter if some staff don't if all the residents have had two vaccines? I guess the science can't say for certain but obviously I would obviously like mum, and of course us who visit to be as safe as possible and if that is only possible if everyone who enters that care home has had a vaccine then it maybe seems sensible.

Just wondered what others thoughts are on this?

Its a good question and I think anyone working in close clinical contact with ayone professionally should have the vaccine. Just to point out that TB and Hep are compulsory for heatlh care workers if they wish to be clinical and I think Covid vaccination should be as well -especially in social care

 

[canary]

When OH had a hospital admission for test recently I was asked whether OHs carers had been vaccinated. I checked with the agency and all of the carers employed by the agency have had at least one jab (and a lot of them have had both). I know that all the carers are on zero hours contract and from what the carers have said when they are here (so I realise that it is only hearsay) although the agency cannot insist that they all have the jab, anyone who refuses it for any reason other than medical, is likely to be sidelined and not get many hours work.

 

[Duggies-girl]

I worked in a NHS lab and we all had the Hep B vaccine because we handled blood products. I can't remember if it was compulsory but it didn't always work. I had three different courses over the years and I never made any antibodies to Hep B and was classed as a non responder and I wasn't the only one. It is quite common and I was still allowed to work there.

We are not tested after we have the vaccine so who knows who is or is not really protected.

If my dad had been in a care home then yes I would have wanted everyone who went near him to be vaccinated because he was too frail and too ill to take chances with. I had the flu jab every year for years just for my dads sake.

 

[Canadian Joanne]

As soon as my mother went into care, my husband and I got the flu jabs every year. It's only logical to prevent bringing in the flu to an extremely vulnerable population.

 

[Palerider]

I worked in a NHS lab and we all had the Hep B vaccine because we handled blood products. I can't remember if it was compulsory but it didn't always work. I had three different courses over the years and I never made any antibodies to Hep B and was classed as a non responder and I wasn't the only one. It is quite common and I was still allowed to work there.

We are not tested after we have the vaccine so who knows who is or is not really protected.

If my dad had been in a care home then yes I would have wanted everyone who went near him to be vaccinated because he was too frail and too ill to take chances with. I had the flu jab every year for years just for my dads sake.

If you work in a lab thats not direct clinical contact with people or patients then that is about work hazards and self risk to exposure. If you have contact with patients you cannot work unless you have TB and Hep and levels of titres to evidence immunity.

I agree titres should be tested post vaccine etc, but with such a mass program of vaccination and the evidence supporting immunity I am not sure of the purpose of post vaccine tests at this stage, although I agree in the future it would be useful.

The standard remains for many of us with a sense of professional ethic in conatct with patients, we have the vaccines

 

[anxious annie]

I feel that those working in care homes should be vaccinated to help stop "outbreaks", which result in visits from family not allowed, and also to help protect vulnerable residents and other members of staff. Unless they are medically exempt.

 

[Spamar]

There is exceptions, such as for people who are allergic to any of the ingredients of the vaccine.

 

[Lone Wolf]

Is there any data on the magnitude of risk posed to a fully vaccinated care resident by an unvaccinated care worker wearing full PPE and tested daily and when positive test numbers in the community are low?

Is it correct, as government advisors have said previously, that the vaccinations may not prevent getting or transmitting the virus but act to reduce the symptoms?

What would be the impact on care home staffing levels particularly in areas with a high percentage of anti-vax demographics?

Is it correct that the vaccines have only been approved for emergency use?

 

[Wildflowerlady]

Personally I think if someone is working in a CH is a Health Professional or is providing a Care Package in someone's home from an agency that they should be having the vaccination, I do consider it is a duty of care to do so. I do accept that there will be some carers that will be advised not to have the vaccination for medical reasons but the vast majority surely can be vaccinated and should be as they are working with many vulnerable people.
I wore a mask, apron and gloves but I still caught Covid from visiting my dad in the CH when he was End Of Life. I was made aware that three members of staff at the CH tested positive the same time as dad also had his positive test results. What I don't know is how many other residents also contracted Covid but it was a large home with 80 residents so its unlikely my dad was the only one. I'm not really sure but I suppose there could be a chance that dad caught Covid from hospital following a stay there and went back to the CH with it. I'm unaware if my dad was ever tested before being sent back to the CH this was in January this year. Dads test was done as a routine test at the CH 8 days after leaving hospital and not because they suspected he had caught it. It remains that however my dad caught Covid that Staff/Carers at the home also had it and quite likely it was passed onto other residents as well.

 

[panface]

Absolutely care home staff should be vaccinated! If no valid reason other than they don’t want it, then it should be mandatory if working with vulnerable people. It is a duty of care. In my mother’s care home only 70% of staff have had the vaccine. The majority of carers are young and are worried it will cause fertility problems in the future for them. I understand their concerns but they have a duty of care and if they are adamant they won’t have it then they should look for another job!
Just imagine if all the vaccines available for different deadly diseases were not taken up by the public! It doesn’t bare thinking about.