Nuisance neighbour

Mazco

Registered User
May 17, 2018
11
0
My cousin (I am next of Kin) almost certainly has some form of dementia. We don't yet have a diagnosis but have an appointment with her gp so are hoping to get some answers.
Currently she is being scammed out of money by phone callers on a regular basis.
She gets very muddled and will agree to anything. We are trying to sort this out.
She is stressed about the amount of money she is losing as she has always been very careful with her money.
To add to her stress we have discovered that she has a neighbour who is making things very difficult.
He decided that he needed to make her garden better for her. (She can't go outside so it really doesn't benefit her) He has been coming to the house on a regular basis doing work that is at best unnecessary and at worst positively detrimental. He has killed her lawn and is now reseeding it at the driest time of the year. He is buying loads of stuff and she is paying him for it. She has a tiny garden and he has spent around £300 of her money.
Earlier this week we called and spoke to him and his wife. We explained that what he is doing is stressing her out and we said very clearly we wanted him to stop.
At this meeting we discovered that he has a key to her house even though there is a keysafe and we specifically told him he shouldn't have a key cut. Apparently he NEEDS a key because he can't be bothered to use the safe and he wants to be there to see what is happening.
We very firmly told him to 1)stop spending her money as she is fast running out due to Scammers
2) Stop doing any work in the garden as she can't afford it and she doesn't need it.
Today I visited and found him in the garden doing the exact job we had very clearly told him not to do.
I didn't speak to him and didn't challenge him at the time. My husband later rang him and politely told him that we were very unhappy about this morning. He basically said he was doing it because he wants to. He then put the phone down on my hubby.
We don't know what to do about this. She may be agreeing to him doing this work, but she is also agreeing to strangers taking £150 a week from her bank account so that doesn't mean very much. She definitely isn't suggesting that the work needs doing.
It appears to me that this is pretty close to being financial abuse but could I report this to social services? Would they be interested?
 

kindred

Registered User
Apr 8, 2018
2,937
0
My cousin (I am next of Kin) almost certainly has some form of dementia. We don't yet have a diagnosis but have an appointment with her gp so are hoping to get some answers.
Currently she is being scammed out of money by phone callers on a regular basis.
She gets very muddled and will agree to anything. We are trying to sort this out.
She is stressed about the amount of money she is losing as she has always been very careful with her money.
To add to her stress we have discovered that she has a neighbour who is making things very difficult.
He decided that he needed to make her garden better for her. (She can't go outside so it really doesn't benefit her) He has been coming to the house on a regular basis doing work that is at best unnecessary and at worst positively detrimental. He has killed her lawn and is now reseeding it at the driest time of the year. He is buying loads of stuff and she is paying him for it. She has a tiny garden and he has spent around £300 of her money.
Earlier this week we called and spoke to him and his wife. We explained that what he is doing is stressing her out and we said very clearly we wanted him to stop.
At this meeting we discovered that he has a key to her house even though there is a keysafe and we specifically told him he shouldn't have a key cut. Apparently he NEEDS a key because he can't be bothered to use the safe and he wants to be there to see what is happening.
We very firmly told him to 1)stop spending her money as she is fast running out due to Scammers
2) Stop doing any work in the garden as she can't afford it and she doesn't need it.
Today I visited and found him in the garden doing the exact job we had very clearly told him not to do.
I didn't speak to him and didn't challenge him at the time. My husband later rang him and politely told him that we were very unhappy about this morning. He basically said he was doing it because he wants to. He then put the phone down on my hubby.
We don't know what to do about this. She may be agreeing to him doing this work, but she is also agreeing to strangers taking £150 a week from her bank account so that doesn't mean very much. She definitely isn't suggesting that the work needs doing.
It appears to me that this is pretty close to being financial abuse but could I report this to social services? Would they be interested?
I think this is more a case for a solicitor writing a warning letter setting out the position very clearly. This is appalling intrusion. I am so sorry. G
 

karaokePete

Registered User
Jul 23, 2017
6,534
0
N Ireland
Hello @Mazco, welcome to TP. I hope you find this to be a friendly, informative and supportive place.

You may feel that the time has come to talk to your cousin about granting you Power of Attorney so that you can have more control of this situation. Here are links to two AS Publications that deal with difficult situations and managing money. I hope they are of some help https://www.alzheimers.org.uk/sites...cisions_and_managing_difficult_situations.pdf

http://alzheimerweb.prod.acquia-sit...actsheets/living-with-dementia-managing-money

If your cousin is being harassed and scammed it may be worthwhile talking to the local police as they may be able to give advice.
 
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Mazco

Registered User
May 17, 2018
11
0
Thanks for your welcome.

We are in the process of getting the Poa. The forms are in and we should have it through by the end of July.
I've had an informal chat with social services this afternoon and they suggested a referral. I think I'm going to go that way but it will obviously have repercussions.
He will be furious and cousin may not be happy either. She sees him as a concerned friend. Unfortunately she also thinks that the young men on the phone are her best friends so clearly can't discern motives.
His parting shot to my hubby when he put the phone down was "Who are you to tell me what to do?"
He clearly isn't concerned for her wellbeing.
His wife hinted that his memory wasn't good so he may have similar problems but still no excuse and actually a recipe for disaster if he also has the beginnings of dementia.
She is involved but doesn't seem to have any control over what he does. She is also cousins friend but it is mainly him that is in the house.
We are finding things difficult enough at the moment trying to manage the situation without him making it so much harder.
 

marionq

Registered User
Apr 24, 2013
6,449
0
Scotland
RE phone calls. Scrape the security number from the back of her card so she cannot give permission for money to be taken from her account. Go through her direct debits and cancel any which look like charity or unknown organisations. Use the BT system for stopping unwanted calls and perhaps buy one of their phones which allows you to block calls from abroad or specific numbers which have been suspect in the past. Split her money into an account holding only a small amount for day to day spending and one which pays her utilities etc.

My guess is the neighbour is heading down the same road as herself.
 

Mazco

Registered User
May 17, 2018
11
0
All great advice but -

She no longer has a debit card as we managed to get the bank to stop it.
Sorted some of the direct debits at the bank today but apparently once you have authorised a dd they can claim again using a different reference number.
She is on talk talk not BT and it is virtually impossible to talk to them on the phone as she never remembers any security details and they won't talk to us. It took about an hour to get through to her credit card company the other day as she couldn't even remember the name of her last school. Fortunately the young lady on the phone was endlessly patient and we finally got to discuss things.
We got her a phone that blocks numbers but she can't use it herself and we can't block withheld numbers as she has an alarm set up and they ring from a withheld number if her alarm is activated.
We will be able to deal with her bank when we get poa and will almost certainly do what you've suggested with separate accounts.


RE phone calls. Scrape the security number from the back of her card so she cannot give permission for money to be taken from her account. Go through her direct debits and cancel any which look like charity or unknown organisations. Use the BT system for stopping unwanted calls and perhaps buy one of their phones which allows you to block calls from abroad or specific numbers which have been suspect in the past. Split her money into an account holding only a small amount for day to day spending and one which pays her utilities etc.

My guess is the neighbour is heading down the same road as herself.
 

Rosettastone57

Registered User
Oct 27, 2016
1,839
0
Thanks for your welcome.

We are in the process of getting the Poa. The forms are in and we should have it through by the end of July.
I've had an informal chat with social services this afternoon and they suggested a referral. I think I'm going to go that way but it will obviously have repercussions.
He will be furious and cousin may not be happy either. She sees him as a concerned friend. Unfortunately she also thinks that the young men on the phone are her best friends so clearly can't discern motives.
His parting shot to my hubby when he put the phone down was "Who are you to tell me what to do?"
He clearly isn't concerned for her wellbeing.
His wife hinted that his memory wasn't good so he may have similar problems but still no excuse and actually a recipe for disaster if he also has the beginnings of dementia.
She is involved but doesn't seem to have any control over what he does. She is also cousins friend but it is mainly him that is in the house.
We are finding things difficult enough at the moment trying to manage the situation without him making it so much harder.
My first thought was to change locks but from what you're saying it seems perhaps your cousin is enabling this man's company so I'm not sure that would work. Once you have POA then you can take more control as other posters have said. A very difficult situation as neither party are seeing they have problems. Hopefully others have better advice
 

Mazco

Registered User
May 17, 2018
11
0
My first thought was to change locks but from what you're saying it seems perhaps your cousin is enabling this man's company so I'm not sure that would work. Once you have POA then you can take more control as other posters have said. A very difficult situation as neither party are seeing they have problems. Hopefully others have better advice

We've done that. She was in hospital for 7 weeks after she broke her hip in March. While she was there we became aware that half the world had keys (that she had given them). We changed the lock and told everyone that no one was to have a key. She had a key, we have a key and there is one in the key safe. We gave the code to everyone who needed access. This guys wife was one of them. She spoke to me and told me all the reasons they needed a key. I told her quite clearly that she didn't. Cousin would let them in or in an emergency they could use the safe.
We found out on Tuesday that he had decided soon after she came out of hospital that Cousin needed a spare key so he'd gone and got one cut and also got one for himself. He can't remember the code for the safe and "its too much bother to use that every time". No understanding that he shouldn't go in unless she let's him in. Even after we told him in Tuesday night that he shouldn't have got the key he was in there in her absence today.
She is definitely facilitating everything he is doing but she seems to be incapable of saying "no" to anyone.
 

Rosettastone57

Registered User
Oct 27, 2016
1,839
0
All great advice but -

She no longer has a debit card as we managed to get the bank to stop it.
Sorted some of the direct debits at the bank today but apparently once you have authorised a dd they can claim again using a different reference number.
She is on talk talk not BT and it is virtually impossible to talk to them on the phone as she never remembers any security details and they won't talk to us. It took about an hour to get through to her credit card company the other day as she couldn't even remember the name of her last school. Fortunately the young lady on the phone was endlessly patient and we finally got to discuss things.
We got her a phone that blocks numbers but she can't use it herself and we can't block withheld numbers as she has an alarm set up and they ring from a withheld number if her alarm is activated.
We will be able to deal with her bank when we get poa and will almost certainly do what you've suggested with separate accounts.
I'm afraid without POA dealing with talk talk and so forth will be virtually impossible . Frustrating as it is these companies set up their security measures to protect the customer. I assume the alarm is for the house or are you talking about a personal alarm such as carelink for a person who has had a fall in the home? If it's for the house with POA I'm wondering if a withheld call could be diverted to your number or another responsible person. Not sure if that's possible to be honest.
 

Mazco

Registered User
May 17, 2018
11
0
I'm afraid without POA dealing with talk talk and so forth will be virtually impossible . Frustrating as it is these companies set up their security measures to protect the customer. I assume the alarm is for the house or are you talking about a personal alarm such as carelink for a person who has had a fall in the home? If it's for the house with POA I'm wondering if a withheld call could be diverted to your number or another responsible person. Not sure if that's possible to be honest.
I should have made it clearer. It's a carelink type alarm. When she presses the button (if she's wearing it when she has an emergency and it isn't on her dressing table) they ring to check she's OK but they use a withheld number.
I realise we don't have a hope with talk talk. Id call them with her there and get her to say that I can discuss it with them but she has no idea of any security details.
We think we should have the poa through by the end of July so we might be able to start things off then.
 

Malalie

Registered User
Sep 1, 2016
310
0
If you can get the money situation sorted out with POA, and you are confident that this neighbour is not a threat in any way to your cousin and she has no problem with him coming in and out, could it not be seen as a boon that somebody is checking on her frequently?

I wish you luck with the banks - hopefully it will all become easier when POA is awarded.
 

Mazco

Registered User
May 17, 2018
11
0
If you can get the money situation sorted out with POA, and you are confident that this neighbour is not a threat in any way to your cousin and she has no problem with him coming in and out, could it not be seen as a boon that somebody is checking on her frequently?

I wish you luck with the banks - hopefully it will all become easier when POA is awarded.
If he was coming in and checking on her we'd be fine with that. He comes in whenever he wants to, often when she isn't there. He comes to make huge changes to her pocket hanky sized garden. He buys things he wants for the garden and she pays for them. He does ridiculous things which we will have to sort out at some point.
In the past few weeks he has watered her lawn (10 foot square) with a sprinkler for an hour - just before it rainrd heavily. It was so waterlogged it died.
He then spent today planting grass seed, at the point when weather forecaster are saying it is the driest month for years.
His best job was to dig up her path, bury the ridiculously long plastic hose (that he insisted on buying to water her lawn to death) and then concrete it in.
He only comes into the house when she's there to tread mud across her kitchen floor and leave her to clean it. He comes when she isn't there to nose around and see what he can find.
On Tuesday we actually asked him to stop doing the garden and just go and talk to her. Today he was there while she was out (he knew that) doing the garden.
Clearly isn't interested in checking up on cousin. I wish he was. It would make our life so much easier.
 

Rosettastone57

Registered User
Oct 27, 2016
1,839
0
If he was coming in and checking on her we'd be fine with that. He comes in whenever he wants to, often when she isn't there. He comes to make huge changes to her pocket hanky sized garden. He buys things he wants for the garden and she pays for them. He does ridiculous things which we will have to sort out at some point.
In the past few weeks he has watered her lawn (10 foot square) with a sprinkler for an hour - just before it rainrd heavily. It was so waterlogged it died.
He then spent today planting grass seed, at the point when weather forecaster are saying it is the driest month for years.
His best job was to dig up her path, bury the ridiculously long plastic hose (that he insisted on buying to water her lawn to death) and then concrete it in.
He only comes into the house when she's there to tread mud across her kitchen floor and leave her to clean it. He comes when she isn't there to nose around and see what he can find.
On Tuesday we actually asked him to stop doing the garden and just go and talk to her. Today he was there while she was out (he knew that) doing the garden.
Clearly isn't interested in checking up on cousin. I wish he was. It would make our life so much easier.

You could get a solicitor letter as others have said but it sounds like to be frank that if he has his own mental health difficulties he's not going to take much notice. There is a system of a camera you can put on the doorbell that is activated by a proximity sensor when someone approaches. This is linked to your phone. No personal experience of this but if he comes in you could call police and say there is an intruder. Drastic action I know but something to consider.
 

Malalie

Registered User
Sep 1, 2016
310
0
Hmmm - see what you mean. It's is adding more stress to an already stressful situation obviously. Could you apply yourself rather more forcefully to his wife? A solicitors letter might not register with him, but it might with her. If he has undiagnosed Dementia, she may be 'walking on eggshells' with him though...

I'm just thinking about a way that you and she and the key safe could have a key that can't be copied...(and a way that "Mrs Helpful Neighbour" could be persuaded not to give him the code......)
 

love.dad.but..

Registered User
Jan 16, 2014
4,962
0
Kent
If he was coming in and checking on her we'd be fine with that. He comes in whenever he wants to, often when she isn't there. He comes to make huge changes to her pocket hanky sized garden. He buys things he wants for the garden and she pays for them. He does ridiculous things which we will have to sort out at some point.
In the past few weeks he has watered her lawn (10 foot square) with a sprinkler for an hour - just before it rainrd heavily. It was so waterlogged it died.
He then spent today planting grass seed, at the point when weather forecaster are saying it is the driest month for years.
His best job was to dig up her path, bury the ridiculously long plastic hose (that he insisted on buying to water her lawn to death) and then concrete it in.
He only comes into the house when she's there to tread mud across her kitchen floor and leave her to clean it. He comes when she isn't there to nose around and see what he can find.
On Tuesday we actually asked him to stop doing the garden and just go and talk to her. Today he was there while she was out (he knew that) doing the garden.
Clearly isn't interested in checking up on cousin. I wish he was. It would make our life so much easier.
I agree with you...this seems like a gross invasion of her privacy and he seems determined to continue. If cousin is independent enough to use a key then changing the locks again which I would be tempted to consider may not work as he can get access to her key to cut another. Does cousin have enough lucidity for you to talk to her about your concerns of this neighbour and especially his access to her house and the unnecessary jobs he has decided needed doing? Would speaking to his wife on her own be an option so she at least understands that you consider her husband's involvement intrusive and unnecessary and your cousin will not pay for any of his job suggestions unless you give agreement first...May put him off....that as you and your OH are very capable of looking after your cousin's affairs health and property and pointing out that power of attorney is being granted and he will be required to step back...they don't have to know that it will be a month. Such a difficult situation but whether or not he has his own mental health problems your cousin must be safeguarded from his intense attentions.
 

Mazco

Registered User
May 17, 2018
11
0
I agree with you...this seems like a gross invasion of her privacy and he seems determined to continue. If cousin is independent enough to use a key then changing the locks again which I would be tempted to consider may not work as he can get access to her key to cut another. Does cousin have enough lucidity for you to talk to her about your concerns of this neighbour and especially his access to her house and the unnecessary jobs he has decided needed doing? Would speaking to his wife on her own be an option so she at least understands that you consider her husband's involvement intrusive and unnecessary and your cousin will not pay for any of his job suggestions unless you give agreement first...May put him off....that as you and your OH are very capable of looking after your cousin's affairs health and property and pointing out that power of attorney is being granted and he will be required to step back...they don't have to know that it will be a month. Such a difficult situation but whether or not he has his own mental health problems your cousin must be safeguarded from his intense attentions.
 

Mazco

Registered User
May 17, 2018
11
0
Again these are great ideas but I don't think there's an easy answer.
We spoke to cousin yesterday to specifically ask if she was aware that he had a key and if she was happy him to be there when she is out. She said it's fine.
I'm struggling to know where we stand with consent.
I've worked in Safeguarding with children for years so understand how consent works with kids. A 13 year old can't consent to a relationship with an adult teacher for instance. However consensual the relationship it is still illegal as the 13 year old cannot legally give consent. I presume that a vulnerable adult who is shown to not have mental capacity would also be in the same position.
I'm not sure how that would translate to someone who doesn't even have a diagnosis of dementia.
She is demonstrating that she has problems making wise decisions when she is saying yes (and paying money) to any sales caller but does that mean anything if we were to make a referral to social services about her neighbour.
She believes that he is her best friend in the whole world. If she was a child I would immediately identify this as grooming but does that apply to a grown adult who is adamant that she is fine?
 

Beate

Registered User
May 21, 2014
12,179
0
London
In my book, yes. I know this whole mental capacity thing is a minefield as you are allowed to make unwise decisions when you are classed to still be compos mentis but tell that to the people trying to extract others from the grasp of a cult for example!
 

love.dad.but..

Registered User
Jan 16, 2014
4,962
0
Kent
I have not changed my views from your description. However a difficulty that may have to be considered by you when poa is granted ....if it is thought or it is borderline as to whether cousin still has meaningful mental capacity.... hopefully your cousin will be agreeable to you helping with her finances but if not...until mental capacity is lost you cannot step in which may make helping her from making these unwise decisions impossible. Health poa cannot be used until mental capacity has been lost
 

Mazco

Registered User
May 17, 2018
11
0
I have not changed my views from your description. However a difficulty that may have to be considered by you when poa is granted ....if it is thought or it is borderline as to whether cousin still has meaningful mental capacity.... hopefully your cousin will be agreeable to you helping with her finances but if not...until mental capacity is lost you cannot step in which may make helping her from making these unwise decisions impossible. Health poa cannot be used until mental capacity has been lost
We've talked about her finances and she is saying that she is happy for us to take a lead on things. I think she is very frightened to realise how much money she is giving away so it will be a relief for her.
I just hope she doesn't change her mind.
My other concern is that this guy could easily turn her against us if he tries. That could change things significantly.