Not sure whether to tell!

[Lady M]

Further to my recent thread/s about when to consider care homes etc and having taken notice of helpful advice from others have been viewing local CH online! Just really for information.
As a quirk of fate the CH which I thought looked a possible in the future is advertising a ‘Come and See, Afternoon Tea ‘ next week!
Great, I thought , I shall go along and see in a relaxed and hopefully informal way!
Do I even mention it to OH!
He has reacted and stated when distressed or angry, that the GP and I are colluding to’put him in a home’ so the idea of a rational conversation regarding this is non existent!
However, the idea of not trying to explain or even mentioning seems so foreign to me.
I am think I should tell our sons, who I am certain, like myself do realise that the probable next move for OH will be a CH.
I have seen mention of ‘love lies’(?)would this be one of those or just deceitful. ?
I suppose in my heart I know what I should do but!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Jessbow]

How much does he like a cuppa and a piece of cake?

I wonder if you could sell it as a charity fundraiser or something?

Otherwise go along and enjoy the cake on your own.

 

[canary]

Actually, I wouldnt say anything about it until the day and then just say you want to go out for a cup of tea and cake and go. He might not even realise that it is a care home (dont enlighten him if he doesnt realise) - you might want to describe it as a "hotel". Dont ask him whether we would mind staying there as the default answer to that sort of question is usually "no". In fact, dont say very much at all apart from saying that it looks a nice place. Make up your own mind. Once they get to the stage of a care home you have to decide for them.

 

[Sirena]

I agree with Canary. Wait till the day, see how he is at the time and whether you think he'd like to go with you - but just sell it as tea and cake in a nice place, don't mention care homes or staying there. That will just result in upset and an argument, and there is no point in distressing him. When I moved my mother to a care home (a year ago today) I told her she was having a mini break and she seemed to happy to believe it was a guest house/hotel.

 

[Lady M]

I agree with Canary. Wait till the day, see how he is at the time and whether you think he'd like to go with you - but just sell it as tea and cake in a nice place, don't mention care homes or staying there. That will just result in upset and an argument, and there is no point in distressing him. When I moved my mother to a care home (a year ago today) I told her she was having a mini break and she seemed to happy to believe it was a guest house/hotel.

Thanks, however that is not possible, as he is well aware what the building is! And although declining his dementia is varied. I suspect that I shall go along alone!

 

[Lady M]

Actually, I wouldnt say anything about it until the day and then just say you want to go out for a cup of tea and cake and go. He might not even realise that it is a care home (dont enlighten him if he doesnt realise) - you might want to describe it as a "hotel". Dont ask him whether we would mind staying there as the default answer to that sort of question is usually "no". In fact, dont say very much at all apart from saying that it looks a nice place. Make up your own mind. Once they get to the stage of a care home you have to decide for them.

Thanks for the reply!
Oh he would know it’s a care home!
I suspect I will go along anyway.
Now beginning to wonder what I really need to look for/ ask about, do I just follow my instinct or make a list! How do you ask to go on a waiting list etc??

 

[Grahamstown]

Further to my recent thread/s about when to consider care homes etc and having taken notice of helpful advice from others have been viewing local CH online! Just really for information.
As a quirk of fate the CH which I thought looked a possible in the future is advertising a ‘Come and See, Afternoon Tea ‘ next week!
Great, I thought , I shall go along and see in a relaxed and hopefully informal way!
Do I even mention it to OH!
He has reacted and stated when distressed or angry, that the GP and I are colluding to’put him in a home’ so the idea of a rational conversation regarding this is non existent!
However, the idea of not trying to explain or even mentioning seems so foreign to me.
I am think I should tell our sons, who I am certain, like myself do realise that the probable next move for OH will be a CH.
I have seen mention of ‘love lies’(?)would this be one of those or just deceitful. ?
I suppose in my heart I know what I should do but!!!!!!!!!!

I have just been to a care home with my husband after I visited last week and was invited to bring him for a coffee or lunch. I didn’t tell him until this morning because he wouldn’t remember anyway and told him we were going on an outing for coffee. I said that if I got ill then I would need somewhere to look after me so I was going to see this place which I had seen near my hairdressers. It all went well and he liked ‘your place’ as he referred to it, and happily agreed to go for lunch again in a couple of months. I am now using ‘love lies’ at times to save him anxiety. He can’t remember what we did this morning any more and has been fine, no anxiety about himself because he is perfectly fine and well.
P.S. the care home manager was the one who suggested that I bring him for the occasional visit so that if he needed to, he would know it and the way things are going he will need respite at least for my health if not his own.

 

[marionq]

I have just been to a care home with my husband after I visited last week and was invited to bring him for a coffee or lunch. I didn’t tell him until this morning because he wouldn’t remember anyway and told him we were going on an outing for coffee. I said that if I got ill then I would need somewhere to look after me so I was going to see this place which I had seen near my hairdressers. It all went well and he liked ‘your place’ as he referred to it, and happily agreed to go for lunch again in a couple of months. I am now using ‘love lies’ at times to save him anxiety. He can’t remember what we did this morning any more and has been fine, no anxiety about himself because he is perfectly fine and well.
P.S. the care home manager was the one who suggested that I bring him for the occasional visit so that if he needed to, he would know it and the way things are going he will need respite at least for my health if not his own.

That seems incredibly civilised. I like that manager.

 

[MrCanuck]

One thing you can ask is if there is a Support Group for those who have a family member there. They had this at the care home my mom was at, facilitated by one of the staff. I found it an amazingly important thing. Not only do you get to meet others who are in the same boat as yourself, but you also get to hear some of what's going on at the place - both good and bad and as a group you can discuss things with a representative of the home.

 

[canary]

Now beginning to wonder what I really need to look for/ ask about, do I just follow my instinct or make a list! How do you ask to go on a waiting list etc??

Try to look past the decor. Quite often care homes put their resources into things that will impress the relatives, rather than things that will benefit the resident with dementia. Would your husband really need an onsite hairdresser, spa, cinema, bistro, or any other bells and whistles?
Is it a mixed dementia and non-dementia home? If it is a mixed home then quite often the staff have little understanding of dementia and are unable to meet their needs. Is the home secure?

Look at the care. See how the carers interact with the residents. How do they deal with someone in distress? Are there areas that are left unstaffed? What is the staff to resident ratio?

Many care homes say that they are for people with dementia, but often once they get to a certain stage they will serve that resident notice. One of the things you will have to decide is whether you want him to go somewhere which will look after him right to the end, or whether you are happy to move him once he has progressed to a point of them not being able to meet his needs. Ask how they would deal with someone who is up during the night and the ones who wander around, often going into other peoples rooms. How would they deal with resistance to personal care? Would they tolerate aggression? How much aggression and do they have ways of dealing with it? Ask what behaviour they would not tolerate.

If you are looking for somewhere that he can stay till the end then look for people who are further along the dementia pathway, even the very advanced stage. If there are none then this probably means that they do not look after them beyond a certain point. Ask how they would deal with end of life care. If they are vague then they probably never do it.

Find out about funding. If he will be LA funded find out about top-up fees - even if he would be self-funding find out about top-up fees for when his funding runs out. Find out how long the waiting list is.

Dont make any snap decisions - go and look at other places too.

 

[Sirena]

Thanks for the reply!
Oh he would know it’s a care home!
I suspect I will go along anyway.
Now beginning to wonder what I really need to look for/ ask about, do I just follow my instinct or make a list! How do you ask to go on a waiting list etc??

Everything that Canary said - plus, use your instinct. When you walk in, does it feel friendly and welcoming? My final question to myself was "If I had to live here myself, would that be okay?" -- obviously, it's a care home, no one wants to live in one, but making allowance for that, do you feel comfortable there?

 

[Lady M]

Try to look past the decor. Quite often care homes put their resources into things that will impress the relatives, rather than things that will benefit the resident with dementia. Would your husband really need an onsite hairdresser, spa, cinema, bistro, or any other bells and whistles?
Is it a mixed dementia and non-dementia home? If it is a mixed home then quite often the staff have little understanding of dementia and are unable to meet their needs. Is the home secure?

Look at the care. See how the carers interact with the residents. How do they deal with someone in distress? Are there areas that are left unstaffed? What is the staff to resident ratio?

Many care homes say that they are for people with dementia, but often once they get to a certain stage they will serve that resident notice. One of the things you will have to decide is whether you want him to go somewhere which will look after him right to the end, or whether you are happy to move him once he has progressed to a point of them not being able to meet his needs. Ask how they would deal with someone who is up during the night and the ones who wander around, often going into other peoples rooms. How would they deal with resistance to personal care? Would they tolerate aggression? How much aggression and do they have ways of dealing with it? Ask what behaviour they would not tolerate.

If you are looking for somewhere that he can stay till the end then look for people who are further along the dementia pathway, even the very advanced stage. If there are none then this probably means that they do not look after them beyond a certain point. Ask how they would deal with end of life care. If they are vague then they probably never do it.

Find out about funding. If he will be LA funded find out about top-up fees - even if he would be self-funding find out about top-up fees for when his funding runs out. Find out how long the waiting list is.

Dont make any snap decisions - go and look at other places too.[/QUOT

WOW!
Thanks ! Yes I have read about the so called ‘high end’ and like you say maybe for the relatives to believe that
‘Luxury ‘ is best!
(Having had to pick a CH for my father many many years ago we(OH& me) choose the friendliest, home like but not the best looking , and certainly had no regrets ! )
This is somehow different, more emotional and OH needs being complex!
At present it’s the loss of mobility therefore not any kind of independence that is paramount.
I think???he could be in mid stage dementia ( Mixed, Alzheimer’s and Vascular) but that changes in a daily basis! I have just looked online again and it states in the CH information that a three floor building, one floor for non dementia residents and two floors for nursing and dementia residents??
I have just looked on line at The Alzheimer’s Society fact sheet about CH so need to digest that and your informative answer. Thank you so much.
I sincerely hope that the ‘need’ for CH is a way off!!! But I suppose every carer on TP Feels the same.
I do all this and then In sickness and in health’ reawakens in me!!!
Thanks for you help!

 

[Lady M]

One thing you can ask is if there is a Support Group for those who have a family member there. They had this at the care home my mom was at, facilitated by one of the staff. I found it an amazingly important thing. Not only do you get to meet others who are in the same boat as yourself, but you also get to hear some of what's going on at the place - both good and bad and as a group you can discuss things with a representative of the home.

Just read your reply!
Thanks, that’s a new one , I have never heard of or would have thought about! Many many thanks!!

 

[Lady M]

Everything that Canary said - plus, use your instinct. When you walk in, does it feel friendly and welcoming? My final question to myself was "If I had to live here myself, would that be okay?" -- obviously, it's a care home, no one wants to live in one, but making allowance for that, do you feel comfortable there?

Hi Sirena,
Thanks, yes I believe that instinct, gut feeling, call it what you like, is usually that very best guide!!!
Thanks for your reply!

 

[Lady M]

I have just been to a care home with my husband after I visited last week and was invited to bring him for a coffee or lunch. I didn’t tell him until this morning because he wouldn’t remember anyway and told him we were going on an outing for coffee. I said that if I got ill then I would need somewhere to look after me so I was going to see this place which I had seen near my hairdressers. It all went well and he liked ‘your place’ as he referred to it, and happily agreed to go for lunch again in a couple of months. I am now using ‘love lies’ at times to save him anxiety. He can’t remember what we did this morning any more and has been fine, no anxiety about himself because he is perfectly fine and well.
P.S. the care home manager was the one who suggested that I bring him for the occasional visit so that if he needed to, he would know it and the way things are going he will need respite at least for my health if not his own.

Hi Grahamstown!
Thanks for your helpful reply!
It sounds as if you have struck gold! Just goes to show there are CH that Care!
Thanks again and best wishes for you and OH !
Wishing you a peaceful evening !

 

[jenniferjean]

One thing you can ask is if there is a Support Group for those who have a family member there. They had this at the care home my mom was at, facilitated by one of the staff. I found it an amazingly important thing. Not only do you get to meet others who are in the same boat as yourself, but you also get to hear some of what's going on at the place - both good and bad and as a group you can discuss things with a representative of the home.

A good idea. I'm a fair way off looking for a CH (I hope) but will try and keep that in mind when the time comes.

 

[Sirena]

A good idea. I'm a fair way off looking for a CH (I hope) but will try and keep that in mind when the time comes.

I'm not sure how common that is in the UK? It isn't something I've seen but some CHs may offer it.

 

[Phoebe2]

Further to my recent thread/s about when to consider care homes etc and having taken notice of helpful advice from others have been viewing local CH online! Just really for information.
As a quirk of fate the CH which I thought looked a possible in the future is advertising a ‘Come and See, Afternoon Tea ‘ next week!
Great, I thought , I shall go along and see in a relaxed and hopefully informal way!
Do I even mention it to OH!
He has reacted and stated when distressed or angry, that the GP and I are colluding to’put him in a home’ so the idea of a rational conversation regarding this is non existent!
However, the idea of not trying to explain or even mentioning seems so foreign to me.
I am think I should tell our sons, who I am certain, like myself do realise that the probable next move for OH will be a CH.
I have seen mention of ‘love lies’(?)would this be one of those or just deceitful. ?
I suppose in my heart I know what I should do but!!!!!!!!!!

Hello Lady M
I am fairly new to this hideous world of dementia, but like you spotted a coffee and cake opportunity at our local care home,
My OH is very hostile towards me and is convinced he has been misdiagnosed, (like so many others). Anyway I made my mind up to go along, I have no family nearby and his family are no help, so I know I need to find my own support network,sooner rather than later.
I did tell him about the day out, told him it was a fund raiser for alzheimers and an opportunity to find out more about the disease, his brother also has Alz, so he was happy to learn more for him.
The afternoon was a huge success, he did know it was a care home, but after lots of cakes and a friendly tour - stopping off at the residents bar, he thinks it a delightful place and now talks about the retirement village.
He chatted happily with other residents, I'm sure he thought he was hosting a garden party.
We have been back since, he breezed in ready for more of the cakes, petted the resident cat, wandered about, chatting to new friends, and was keen to sign up to attend again for a visit from the local primary school.
So what I think I am saying is, it can work out fine. We are going into the 'coffee shop' again next week, he has even written it in his diary !! The following week he is 'joining them for lunch' ( day centre 10-4 ), and looking forward to that too. Love lies are essential, and so far the care home use them too. I was begging for a day placement, the carer took charge, invited OH to come in for lunch one day, he was thrilled with the invitation and the deal was made. I know it won't always be so easy, but what a relief
All residents and guests are happy and content, not drugged up and comatose, I am so pleased he could be in a day centre soon, even once or twice a month will make my life so much easier, and this all happened from a coffee and cake visit.
I hope your visit works out well x

 

[Lady M]

Hello Lady M
I am fairly new to this hideous world of dementia, but like you spotted a coffee and cake opportunity at our local care home,
My OH is very hostile towards me and is convinced he has been misdiagnosed, (like so many others). Anyway I made my mind up to go along, I have no family nearby and his family are no help, so I know I need to find my own support network,sooner rather than later.
I did tell him about the day out, told him it was a fund raiser for alzheimers and an opportunity to find out more about the disease, his brother also has Alz, so he was happy to learn more for him.
The afternoon was a huge success, he did know it was a care home, but after lots of cakes and a friendly tour - stopping off at the residents bar, he thinks it a delightful place and now talks about the retirement village.
He chatted happily with other residents, I'm sure he thought he was hosting a garden party.
We have been back since, he breezed in ready for more of the cakes, petted the resident cat, wandered about, chatting to new friends, and was keen to sign up to attend again for a visit from the local primary school.
So what I think I am saying is, it can work out fine. We are going into the 'coffee shop' again next week, he has even written it in his diary !! The following week he is 'joining them for lunch' ( day centre 10-4 ), and looking forward to that too. Love lies are essential, and so far the care home use them too. I was begging for a day placement, the carer took charge, invited OH to come in for lunch one day, he was thrilled with the invitation and the deal was made. I know it won't always be so easy, but what a relief
All residents and guests are happy and content, not drugged up and comatose, I am so pleased he could be in a day centre soon, even once or twice a month will make my life so much easier, and this all happened from a coffee and cake visit.
I hope your visit works out well x

What a lovely reply!!
I am so glad that one of the many things that is put on ‘us’ a carers has for you at least a bright light on the horizon!
Like you I am new to this and feel ‘taken over’ my all recent events!
I feel the double whammy of OH loss of mobilty and the dementia is just too much in one hit!!! Yes I know it is extremely hard on him BUT also on me!!!
I have this morning, after being woken again at 4.15 ( another story!) that I will go to the afternoon tea at the CH next week! As a trial inspection, so to speak, but I shall go alone! And then take matters from there.
I am fortunate that we have sons who are supportive and I know that they will give me the backing as and when the time comes!
In the meantime I have resolved that I must consider myself more! Meet up with my friend for lunch( was a monthly thing hasn’t happened since OH was hospitalised) .Also hopefully I am going to try a short day at the spa just to see how OH will manage with just the carers, ,
Thanks again for your reply it has at the least given me( and others I am sure) a ray of Hope!
Wish me luck with my resolutions!
Let me know how OH enjoys his lunch etc!
And thanks again

 

[maryjoan]

Try to look past the decor. Quite often care homes put their resources into things that will impress the relatives, rather than things that will benefit the resident with dementia. Would your husband really need an onsite hairdresser, spa, cinema, bistro, or any other bells and whistles?
Is it a mixed dementia and non-dementia home? If it is a mixed home then quite often the staff have little understanding of dementia and are unable to meet their needs. Is the home secure?

Look at the care. See how the carers interact with the residents. How do they deal with someone in distress? Are there areas that are left unstaffed? What is the staff to resident ratio?

Many care homes say that they are for people with dementia, but often once they get to a certain stage they will serve that resident notice. One of the things you will have to decide is whether you want him to go somewhere which will look after him right to the end, or whether you are happy to move him once he has progressed to a point of them not being able to meet his needs. Ask how they would deal with someone who is up during the night and the ones who wander around, often going into other peoples rooms. How would they deal with resistance to personal care? Would they tolerate aggression? How much aggression and do they have ways of dealing with it? Ask what behaviour they would not tolerate.

If you are looking for somewhere that he can stay till the end then look for people who are further along the dementia pathway, even the very advanced stage. If there are none then this probably means that they do not look after them beyond a certain point. Ask how they would deal with end of life care. If they are vague then they probably never do it.

Find out about funding. If he will be LA funded find out about top-up fees - even if he would be self-funding find out about top-up fees for when his funding runs out. Find out how long the waiting list is.

Dont make any snap decisions - go and look at other places too.

@canary - this is a really very useful post - it should be in a leaflet and handed out!
May I ask your advice - and anyone else's that have experience of this kind of thing?

I need surgery on both knees and am currently in a lot of pain and not sleeping well. One doctor at our surgery has told me I will not be considered for surgery whilst I have OH to look after, so I took that as correct.
My knees have got a lot worse since Dr said that, so I am going back to see a different doctor in a couple of weeks.

Obviously, OH will need to go somewhere whilst I have my knees sorted - I don't want to leave it too long. Should I start finding a home that is nursing and dementia as he needs both, now, so things are prepared for when I have surgery, or do I phone Social Services and see what they say?

We cannot self fund, and I do have a feeling that my knees will be the downfall of OH living at home...... not quite sure what I should be doing....

suggestions please, as I have no experience of this part of the journey.....