Mental capacity assessment

[canary]

I can understand that this is an anxious time for you.
Please dont worry about finances at the moment. Top-ups are optional - the LA is duty bound to find at least one place that will meet his needs and will not require top-ups. You can apply for half of any private/occupational pension for yourself and there may be benefits that you would be eligible for too.

I really dont think that you have to tell him if it is made permanent. I doubt that he will realise that it is past the assessment time - people with dementia lose their internal recognition of time passing. To them, a couple of minutes seem like hours and conversely, they will often insist that something that actually happened months ago happened "only this morning" . When mum was in her care home there was a time when I couldnt visit because of problems with OH. I sent her postcards so that she knew I had not abandoned her, but when I visited her again she thought it was only a couple of days since I had last been

 

[Arthurgeorge]

And I think you are able to get 25% off your council tax bill as a single person.

 

[MartinWL]

I wouldn't tell him explicitly that he is never going home, just try to change the subject if he asks, or say he will go home when he gets better, when the doctor says he is better, etc. Avoid inflammatory conversation if you can.

On the financial front you do have a problem that many experience of bills that are no longer shared between two people. I believe you are entitled to a contribution from his income, I dont have the details but doubtless someone else will explain that. ( @canary explained as I was typing this!) If he owns half the house he should pay half the cost of building insurance and maintenance from his savings. Do you have POA? You will never be obliged to contribute to his fees from your own income and if his savings run out the local authority will have to pay for his care. If you have any joint accounts it will be as wel to separate them now.

 

[nitram]

His income paid for the fuel bills, council tax and water charge plus the running costs for the car. I will now have to take over all of these from my income. I'm quite certain that in time I will have to move to somewhere less costly to run but if I sell our home and have profit from the sale half of that will be his and presumably taken into account for care costs.

Have a read through
https://www.ageuk.org.uk/globalasse..._in_a_care_home_if_you_have_a_partner_fcs.pdf especially 7& 8

 

[yorkie46]

Thanks @Arthurgeorge we have already been getting the 25% council tax discount because of my husbands dementia. Anyone who is living with dementia should be eligible for this discount. I have today received a letter from DWP basically telling me his attendance allowance will now stop. I did expect this.
I will look at the link you sent me @nitram I found interesting information on the Alzheimer's society website titled When does the NHS pay for care. It has raised some questions I need answers to but also mentions the possibility of part NHS funding if he isn't eligible for full funding. He already had a financial assessment done by the local authority for care at home but this will need to be reviewed in the light of recent changes. I'm trying not to worry too much about finances but I like to be armed with as much information as I can when I approach the authorities about it! Don't want to be on the back foot because I know they won't offer to pay for him!

 

[nitram]

It has raised some questions I need answers to but also mentions the possibility of part NHS funding if he isn't eligible for full funding

See 5.1 in

https://www.ageuk.org.uk/globalassets/age-uk/documents/factsheets/fs10_paying_for_permanent_residential_care_fcs.pdf

You will continue to get 25% off council tax as a sole occupant, you need to inform council.

 

[Thethirdmrsc]

I have just been through the mill of the financial assessment and it’s not nice. My husband had reasonable pensions which paid for most of our bills with the AA and carers allowance, since I looked after him. But I am left with just £400 a month from one of them, as there was a difference between occupational and annuity ( don’t ask) As we are LA funded, he pays £267 a week for his care, and as he went into care at the end of December the invoice from the home was backdated meaning a bill of £1900 paid this week, with the next £1070 paid in March and every 4 weeks thereafter. I have 1 part time job, earning £206 a month, and am struggling to get another. I have applied for 9 so far, with 4 knockbacks. i didn’t think that this time of my life would be such a struggle. Luckily the house is owned by us and disregarded since I live in it, but my bills, food and petrol are a struggle, and I am £100 a month in petrol since I visit him 3 times a week. The SS didnt care about me, they didn’t explain anything, and were slow to act, and I felt like I was in the twighlight zone. It was bad enough having my OH in the home, b7t dealing with the money worries was the worst stress I have ever had.

 

[MartinWL]

@Thethirdmrsc Yours is such a difficult situation and must be a common one. I believe you can ask the local authority to allow a larger personal allowance that might be given to you by your husband. I think @nitram is good on this subject so might perhaps help. It might be useful to contact a citizens advice bureau and see if they have an advisor who can go through your finances in detail to explore whether there are any entitlements that have been overlooked.

 

[Palerider]

I have just been through the mill of the financial assessment and it’s not nice. My husband had reasonable pensions which paid for most of our bills with the AA and carers allowance, since I looked after him. But I am left with just £400 a month from one of them, as there was a difference between occupational and annuity ( don’t ask) As we are LA funded, he pays £267 a week for his care, and as he went into care at the end of December the invoice from the home was backdated meaning a bill of £1900 paid this week, with the next £1070 paid in March and every 4 weeks thereafter. I have 1 part time job, earning £206 a month, and am struggling to get another. I have applied for 9 so far, with 4 knockbacks. i didn’t think that this time of my life would be such a struggle. Luckily the house is owned by us and disregarded since I live in it, but my bills, food and petrol are a struggle, and I am £100 a month in petrol since I visit him 3 times a week. The SS didnt care about me, they didn’t explain anything, and were slow to act, and I felt like I was in the twighlight zone. It was bad enough having my OH in the home, b7t dealing with the money worries was the worst stress I have ever had.

I cared for my mum so things in terms of the LA assessment were different in some respects mum immediately had no savings above the threshold of £23, 350 after living their lives before dad died mostly in Spain, all that was left was the property which itself included some significant matters to resolve, they both having taken out an equity release . I was the LPA for mum and yes I understand what you mean about the 'mill of financial assessment' -even though I was presenting things some of which I knew nothing about the process was dreadful where it got to the point I told the assessor on the phone that I was not willing to continue with his line of questioning as I was being held to account for things I had no prior knowledge about.

Its an awful process to go through for anyone at a time when things already for most of us seem bleak and yes I agree @Thethirdmrsc there is no empathy or suppport because penultimately they want as much as they can get in terms of payment and they frankly don't give a damn about the pooor person on the end of the phone who is already frazzled and pre-occupied with essentially what is self survival.

Its good ou have got a disregard, make sure your council tax is reduced to the lowest it can be. I would personally get back to the financial assessor and tell them that you are now left as a course of the action taken in adject poverty and they need to re-assess funding and provide any evidence you can. Alternatively if you are feeling burned out as a many of us are at that stage seek support through Citizens Advice or the Alzheimer's Society helpline -they are good at what they do in these circumstances and are there for people that really do need help

Dementia Support Line

If you need dementia support, we’re here for you. Get personalised information, support and advice by calling us on 0333 150 3456.

www.alzheimers.org.uk

 

[Thethirdmrsc]

Thank you both, I will. When the First council Lady called on the 23-Dec, to tell me that all his pensions would be taken, I burst into tears, but she said she would find out and call me back. No she didn’t. The assessment was bigged up, and all it is are forms, which could have been done months ago., but they are still intrusive and require bank statements going back months. The actual system is flawed, and doesn’t account for carers who are not of pension age, and who then face big life changes, as if Dementia wasn’t big enough. When I got the forms I was so mad that I send the financial team a really, for me , nasty letter.

 

[yorkie46]

@Thethirdmrsc I was going to suggest the same thing, speak to citizens advice. I found them helpful when applying for higher rate attendance Allowance. I really hope you get some help because this is unacceptable.

 

[yorkie46]

I haven't posted for some time because things have been very difficult. My husband moved from hospital to the care home as a discharge to assess patient on Wednesday. He had a fall that evening because he tried to get up from a chair. I think he forgets that he can't walk. He wasn't injured. On Thursday he phoned me crying and wanting me to collect him because he wasn't happy and didn't want to stay there. I explained to him again why he was there and that I would visit as soon as I'm allowed to. He couldn't understand why, as he'd seen on the news that Covid restrictions had been lifted, I couldn't go to see him. After a very upsetting call I spoke to the nurse. She said they were going to move him to a downstairs room to a more sociable area and would get him into the lounge. I spoke to the administrator later on Thursday and she told me he had been in the lounge and had been ok. She went to check on him while I was on the phone. On Friday I had another phone call to say he had fallen again but was ok. Saturday afternoon he phoned me extremely distressed. Crying and asking to come home. I explained again why he is there and that they will try to help him to see if he can walk, that he will see a physio and that the doctor at the hospital said he needs 24 hour care which he can't have at home. He said well nobody comes at night unless I call them. I explained that would be the case at home but I would be the only one here and if he needed to go to the toilet I couldn't help him. He said he wouldn't expect me to but he still didn't see why he couldn't be at home. He said he's not getting better he's getting worse! He said the other residents in the lounge he was in didn't talk and he sometimes doesn't ask for help because he thinks the staff are too busy with other people. I tried to impress on him that he needs to ask for help because he has as much right to it as everyone else, that's why he is there. After this call I was very upset. I spoke to the nurse. She said tomorrow she is going to take him to a different lounge where the residents are able to hold a conversation. She said he had been ok and not distressed during the morning but had been asking for me. She said she would talk to him and explain things to him again. I told my daughter all this and she offered to phone him a bit later to see how he was. She spoke to the nurse who said he was eating so she phoned back a bit later. He was fine. Held a conversation with her. Did mention that he wanted to come home but she explained that he needed to get better and the reason why he's there. He wasn't at all distressed. She impressed on him as I had that as soon as we can visit we will. She said he sent his love to me and didn't mention his conversation with me! I'm going to phone later today to speak to the nurse to see how he has been and tomorrow try to sort out about visiting because I keep being told different things. I was told as soon as his PCR test result was back we could go then another time I was told we have to wait ten days because he had been in hospital. If I can't visit next week I'm going to try phoning him rather than leaving it for him to phone me just to see if I get a different reaction. I was initially a lot better after my daughter's conversation with him but later I became very upset again. Everyone tells me it's early days and he will settle in time but I don't think he will, people don't know him like I do. I fear that the only option will be for him to come home and I'll just have to accept that I will have to care for him as best I can between carer visits. I can't see any other way forward at the moment. I don't yet have an allocated social worker so have no professional to call on for help. It all feels such a mess.

 

[Sarasa]

Hi @yorkie46 , it may well take your husband a long time to settle, and he may never be completely content. However I think it is likely to be the same if he came home. His saying he wouldn’t expect you to take him to the loo at night shows he has no understanding of his condition. I know it’s horrible and tough , but just because he wants to do something it doesn’t mean that he should be allowed to do it.
Maybe get your daughter to be the line of communication for a week or two, he knows how to manipulate your feelings.
I do hope you can get to see him soon and see what things are like. It may be worth talking to the staff about how he is. You may well be surprised at how content he is most of the time.

 

[canary]

Please dont bring him home @yorkie46 . You are understandably upset, but you are thinking with your heart and not your head. You will not be able to look after him at home and he would just end up back in hospital again.

People do settle. I honestly did not expect my mum to settle either because she had been so adamant that she wouldnt go into a care home and had fought tooth and nail against it. But she did settle and was happy. She made friends and joined in the activities, which I would never have believed she would do. It did take a couple of months for her to settle, though and she spent the first 6 weeks packing to go home.

It is normal for someone, when they first move into a care home, to save up all their anger, distress and complaints for their main carer. When I used to visit mum (this was pre-covid) I would see other relatives come into the lounge to see their PWD and it was like a switch flicked. Before the relative arrived they might have been laughing and chatting, but as soon as they saw their relative they were upset, full of complaints and begging them to take them home. As soon as their relative left, the switch was flicked over again and they were back to laughing and chatting. I could hardly believe what I was seeing! You are obviously getting the brunt of his complaints, but that doesnt mean that he is like that all of the time.

 

[kindred]

Please dont bring him home @yorkie46 . You are understandably upset, but you are thinking with your heart and not your head. You will not be able to look after him at home and he would just end up back in hospital again.

People do settle. I honestly did not expect my mum to settle either because she had been so adamant that she wouldnt go into a care home and had fought tooth and nail against it. But she did settle and was happy. She made friends and joined in the activities, which I would never have believed she would do. It did take a couple of months for her to settle, though and she spent the first 6 weeks packing to go home.

It is normal for someone, when they first move into a care home, to save up all their anger, distress and complaints for their main carer. When I used to visit mum (this was pre-covid) I would see other relatives come into the lounge to see their PWD and it was like a switch flicked. Before the relative arrived they might have been laughing and chatting, but as soon as they saw their relative they were upset, full of complaints and begging them to take them home. As soon as their relative left, the switch was flicked over again and they were back to laughing and chatting. I could hardly believe what I was seeing! You are obviously getting the brunt of his complaints, but that doesnt mean that he is like that all of the time.

Canary, you are right. I volunteer in a nursing home for dementia. This is exactly how it is.
I was joking with one lovely resident who then had a family visit and hu have never heard such blaming and shouting! When they had gone she reverted to being her lovely seif and we went on with flower arranging ….

Please dont bring him home @yorkie46 . You are understandably upset, but you are thinking with your heart and not your head. You will not be able to look after him at home and he would just end up back in hospital again.

People do settle. I honestly did not expect my mum to settle either because she had been so adamant that she wouldnt go into a care home and had fought tooth and nail against it. But she did settle and was happy. She made friends and joined in the activities, which I would never have believed she would do. It did take a couple of months for her to settle, though and she spent the first 6 weeks packing to go home.

It is normal for someone, when they first move into a care home, to save up all their anger, distress and complaints for their main carer. When I used to visit mum (this was pre-covid) I would see other relatives come into the lounge to see their PWD and it was like a switch flicked. Before the relative arrived they might have been laughing and chatting, but as soon as they saw their relative they were upset, full of complaints and begging them to take them home. As soon as their relative left, the switch was flicked over again and they were back to laughing and chatting. I could hardly believe what I was seeing! You are obviously getting the brunt of his complaints, but that doesnt mean that he is like that all of the time.

 

[MartinWL]

Please dont bring him home @yorkie46 . You are understandably upset, but you are thinking with your heart and not your head. You will not be able to look after him at home and he would just end up back in hospital again.

Wise advice from the wise bird.

 

[Jaded'n'faded]

He can't come home because you can no longer manage - you know that. And he really can't understand that so he'll keep asking. I also think it would be good to let your daughter do most of the communication for the next few weeks. If he asks after you, she could even say, that you're not very well - completely exhausted and the doctors say YOU need to rest. And continue with the same mantra 'the doctor says...' for him of course.

He will adjust and get used to it. I'm not saying he will like it or be happy but he'll be safe with carers 24/7 and that's the most important thing.

 

[Violet Jane]

@yorkie46, nothing has changed since you made the decision that your husband needs to be in full time care. If you re-read your posts you will see why you made that decision. Perhaps the memories of what your life was like before your husband went into hospital have faded slightly and this is causing you to question that decision, along with your husband's obvious distress when he rings you. As has been suggested above, it might be better if you ring your husband. Perhaps you need to stop answering the phone when he rings. After all, if there was anything important that you needed to know the home would ring you. Ask the home to tell you how much of the time he is distressed. It's possible that he is content most of the time but you are getting a skewed impression because whenever he rings you he is upset.

 

[yorkie46]

Whenever he phones me the nurse has dialled the number and passes the phone to him. I have asked them to try not to let him keep phoning because I don't feel it's good for either of us but I guess that's difficult for them if he keeps asking.

 

[canary]

Whenever he phones me the nurse has dialled the number and passes the phone to him. I have asked them to try not to let him keep phoning because I don't feel it's good for either of us but I guess that's difficult for them if he keeps asking.

So difficult.
When he phones, could you say something like "Hello dear, lovely to hear from you, but I cant talk now as Im going shopping" or something like that and then just ring off.
xx