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Memory service are clear that he must cease driving

MartinWL

Registered User
Jun 12, 2020
313
If I were you, I would keep the original letter away safely. It's entirely possible that your father would rip up the letter because he disagrees with it.
Ah yes. More likely he'd lose it. I scan important documents and store them digitally, with backup, just in case. The carers also whatapp photos of things like that to me.
 

MartinWL

Registered User
Jun 12, 2020
313
My father has had a swift letter from the DVLA, so I must eat some humble pie and withdraw some of my caustic comments about them. They have revoked his licence, which he finds devastating. My tasks now are (1) dissuade him from wanting to appeal, or go to a solicitor, which would be hopeless. (2) Get him to agree that I should arrange to sell the car. I don't yet have the POA , it is due in a couple of weeks. I don't think he will forget and drive anyway, because this is such a big thing for him that he won't forget it. He says it is a death sentence.
 

Canadian Joanne

Volunteer Moderator
Apr 8, 2005
16,707
66
Toronto, Canada
What would be the problem if he appeals? I don't think the DVLA would change the opinion. Yes, it might be hopeless but if you say "Yes, I'll get that going day after tomorrow", would that placate him for a time? As for arranging to sell the car, I would first put it somewhere he cannot see it every day.

Good luck with it all - for six months my mother constantly asked in the most suspicious manner "Where's my car?" when her car was in British Columbia and she was in Ontario. It drove me mad but I would respond that Norm (her husband) was taking care of it and had it in at the garage for expensive repairs.
 

Duggies-girl

Registered User
Sep 6, 2017
2,095
I agree, use the delaying tactics and go along with him. An appeal looks good and may keep him happy.

My dad occasionally broached the subject of driving again and I just said that he could although they would make him take another test because of his age. He didn't want that and eventually he accepted it.
 

Jaded'n'faded

Registered User
Jan 23, 2019
938
High Peak
My father has had a swift letter from the DVLA, so I must eat some humble pie and withdraw some of my caustic comments about them. They have revoked his licence, which he finds devastating. My tasks now are (1) dissuade him from wanting to appeal, or go to a solicitor, which would be hopeless. (2) Get him to agree that I should arrange to sell the car. I don't yet have the POA , it is due in a couple of weeks. I don't think he will forget and drive anyway, because this is such a big thing for him that he won't forget it. He says it is a death sentence.
Well, he would say that, wouldn't he? It's a dramatic statement, intended to make a point (which it does!) but it isn't true! Selling the car plus having no more insurance to pay would fund a lot of taxis.

If you can find a friendly local taxi driver it would help. Sometimes having the same driver on a regular basis can be really positive and your dad might get to like being chauffered around.
 

MartinWL

Registered User
Jun 12, 2020
313
I have looked into the appeal process but the starting point is really to get medical evidence of fitness to drive. I think that would be impossible. An appeal would take a long time during which ther would be reason to hang on to the car in the hope of success. It could be expensive but above all will delay acceptance of the inevitable. He would have to appear before the magistrates at the appeal hearing, it would all be stressful in the extreme. There is no new evidence to get the DVLA to reconsider before going to the magistrates.
 

Canadian Joanne

Volunteer Moderator
Apr 8, 2005
16,707
66
Toronto, Canada
@MartinWL the point is not for you to start an appeal, but to allow your father to think he can do it. Let him do so but do not assist him. After all, he thinks he's perfectly capable. If the first point is to get medical evidence of fitness to drive, let him try and figure it out. If he can, so be it. From what you say, it will be virtually impossible for him to even get the medical evidence he is fit. If this hopeless quest keeps him occupied, well and good

As for the car itself, I still recommend hiding it if possible.
 

MartinWL

Registered User
Jun 12, 2020
313
@MartinWL the point is not for you to start an appeal, but to allow your father to think he can do it. Let him do so but do not assist him. After all, he thinks he's perfectly capable. If the first point is to get medical evidence of fitness to drive, let him try and figure it out. If he can, so be it. From what you say, it will be virtually impossible for him to even get the medical evidence he is fit. If this hopeless quest keeps him occupied, well and good

As for the car itself, I still recommend hiding it if possible.
He has a reasonably large house but unfortunately neither he nor I have a large estate in which a car could be hidden! I won't be helping him to appeal, but I want him to accept that the car must be sold and get on with that so he can move on. Whilst the car is gathering dust in the garage, which it will be if there is a prospect of an appeal, I fear it will be very hard for him to adjust to sa new car-free way of life.
 

MartinWL

Registered User
Jun 12, 2020
313
I hope you aren't explaining the appeals process to your father. Surely you don't want him to drive if the GP says he's not safe to do so? Hide the keys and leave him to it. If you really think he'll get a locksmith, move the car.
I am hoping to explain that the appeal process is hopeless so he will agree to let me sell the car. I don't plan to do anything to encourage him to appeal and I doubt that he could do it without help. But it is his car not mine, he has mental capacity to make a decision on selling it, and as others have pointed out in these forums, a person cannot be deemed not to have capacity just because a decision is unwise. He would have to sign the transfer form. (POA not yet registered) So persuasion is my best option!
 

MartinWL

Registered User
Jun 12, 2020
313
After this week's visit I think I will be able to sell the car. I have nowhere to hide it and nobody is currently insured to drive it but I will get temporary insurance when I need to take it to show to dealers. I think that so long as the car remains in the garage he will cling to the idea of driving. He was in tears when I raised the subject of selling the car and I know that it will be traumatic for him when the car goes through the gate. He varies between sad acceptance and defiant intention to fight his case. He doesn't believe he has dementia or serious memory loss. Unfortunately a lot of searching has failed to find document V5C in the house and you cannot sell a car without this as it is proof that you own the car and have the right to sell it. So I have applied for a duplicate and will have to wait for that to arrive. Losing the car itself is going to cause even more trauma and depression but I think like many a painful process it will be best to get it over and done with quickly. Mercifully he has not shown any sign of intention to drive it unlicensed and uninsured.
 

Countryboy

Registered User
Mar 17, 2005
1,483
Cornwall
If a person is given a diagnoses of dementia and is still Active in body and mind and wants to continue to drive then they can take a driving assessment if they pass the Driving assessment then take the DVLA to Court it not difficult simple just take control of your own destiny let your Driving do the talking

A driving assessment can confirm your practical driving ability and may be useful if DVLA are making medical inquiries. ... The aim of an assessment is to check physical and cognitive ability to drive a vehicle in safety and comfort and to offer advice on aids and adaptations that may assist driving.
 

RosettaT

Registered User
Sep 9, 2018
513
Mid Lincs
DVLA arbitrarily withdrew my OH driving license as soon as they were told of his diagnosis. OH appealed, did an assessment and passed with flying colours and got his license back but it took eight months. I since found out what they did was not the way they usually go about it. OHs private OT does the medical side of these assessments and explained what should have happened tho' I can't remember with clarity what she said now.
 

Countryboy

Registered User
Mar 17, 2005
1,483
Cornwall
I have put a PDF doc on so that those who have never experienced the Driving situation will see the DVLA procedure or form the send to your GP ok I realize in my case it was 2012-13

I fought for 12 years to get my Full Driving Licence back was it worth it Yes every minute it was my Liberty I was fighting for ok I had my GP Consultant OT’S and Family supporting me 100%
 

Attachments

MartinWL

Registered User
Jun 12, 2020
313
If a person is given a diagnoses of dementia and is still Active in body and mind and wants to continue to drive then they can take a driving assessment if they pass the Driving assessment then take the DVLA to Court it not difficult simple just take control of your own destiny let your Driving do the talking

A driving assessment can confirm your practical driving ability and may be useful if DVLA are making medical inquiries. ... The aim of an assessment is to check physical and cognitive ability to drive a vehicle in safety and comfort and to offer advice on aids and adaptations that may assist driving.
All very well in some cases. But dementia is a progressive illness and the ability to drive today does not mean that it will be safe in the future. The aim should be to stop people driving before they endanger themselves and the public, not to wait until that danger is obvious.
 

Countryboy

Registered User
Mar 17, 2005
1,483
Cornwall
We can only reply with our own individual experiences I was diagnosed with Alzheimer’s in 1999 age 56½ had PET & SPECT brain scans in 2003 & 2004 and was diagnosed with frontal-temporal-dementia I now almost 78 still driving my Car I also ride Fireblade CBR1000 motorbike so I’m only speaking from experience and trying to inform those newly dignosed with dementia remember dont wait for tomorrow becuse it never comes its always today
 

Pete1

Registered User
Jul 16, 2019
879
Hi @MartinWL , it is very difficult for sure, sounds like a really tough week for you both. You are getting there.
 

Duggies-girl

Registered User
Sep 6, 2017
2,095
Hi @MartinWL I should have stopped dad from driving long before I did as he was clearly a danger to himself and other people. I count myself very lucky that nothing major happened. You are doing well even if it feels like a battle.
 

jugglingmum

Registered User
Jan 5, 2014
5,916
Chester
Hi @MartinWL I should have stopped dad from driving long before I did as he was clearly a danger to himself and other people. I count myself very lucky that nothing major happened. You are doing well even if it feels like a battle.
I am in the same position as I had no clue about dementia. Mum had a crisis which thankfully did not result in an accident but given mum was going on for weeks about she hadn't driven the wrong way down a dual carriageway I suspect she nearly did.

The crisis was a big wake up call and mum didn't actually return home. I removed her car keys and hid them so that no one else in the house knew where they were. She was very nasty and aggressive to my then 12 year old daughter wanting the keys.

In hindsight mum hadn't been safe to drive for a couple of years. She had had diagnosable dementia for 4 years and signs of issues for about 7 years.

I had nightmares for weeks because she had taken my 8 year old son in the car on previous visits when not safe.

Mum's insurance had also lapsed 9 months previously I discovered and she had been picked up on recognition cameras more than once with a pending prosecution.

She didn't understand why she wasn't safe to drive and was very cross. When I mentioned the car wasnt insured it was meaningless to her. The police had made it clear to me that they didn't think she was safe.

It is tough but I wasn't going to let her drive again.

Incidentally we got a one day multi car policy extension to ours to return to Derby (from Chester) to fetch her car. She lived in Hertfordshire at the time and got lost driving up to our house for Christmas.
 

Duggies-girl

Registered User
Sep 6, 2017
2,095
@jugglingmum Dads car had dents in every corner and even the dents had dents. He scraped a parked lorry and caved in the front wing and the passenger door. He had a scrape down the drivers side too and was running around on a space saver wheel because he had written off his proper wheel when he hit a traffic island. According to dad none of these things were serious and the lorry driver was okay about it because he hadn't damaged the lorry. Dad freely admitted that he had caused all of the dents and that they were no more than you would expect with normal wear and tear. The car was only a year old and it was a motorbility car.

I let the disability people know and they agreed that dad could keep it if only I drove it. I had to take it somewhere to be looked at and it was pronounced as safe to drive with the damage being cosmetic so they would not repair it. I drove that blessed car around for another two years before it had to go back and hated getting in and out of it in a car park because people probably thought it was my damage. After the three years it had to go back and we got a new one. I was so embarrassed at the state of it but the man wasn't at all phased although he said that it was one of the worst that he had seen. Then he gave me another brand new one that I drove for another year. They still sent dad the £500 good condition cheque which I queried with them and they said that everyone gets it regardless. I could of fallen off my chair.

In hindsight it could have been far worse but I felt guilty for months.
 

MartinWL

Registered User
Jun 12, 2020
313
Things have moved on. His licence has been revoked and his insurers refused to renew. He has not driven at all but the situation is still distressing him a great deal and he keeps talking about an appeal and how he can drive better than most people. My next hurdle is selling the car. We have lost the registration document so I am awaiting a duplicate, without which it cannot be sold. I know this is going to be traumatic for him. It may be that he will refuse to sell although I hope to get him to agree. Managing the actual sale. driving the car away, is going to be hard. I might get carers to distract him or take him out do he doesn't see the car leaving the garage. I am hoping that selling the car might bring a sort of closure so that he can start to accept the situation. It is going to be similar to bereavement I fear.
 
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