mam been hurt in care home

Discussion in 'ARCHIVE FORUM: Support discussions' started by j.j, Jun 18, 2008.

  1. j.j

    j.j Registered User

    Jan 8, 2007
    91
    My mam is in an emi unit which we are generally pleased with, i take her out most days and when i take her back there are times when we sit in the lounge together for up to 25 minutes without seeing a member of staff because they are busy in other areas, On Sunday she had a scratch on her face which had been done by another patient, (9 patients on mams side)some with challenging behaviour. We were not to concerned about incident until yesterday when I had phone call to say Mam had another scratch but much worse down side of her face, they think they know who has done it but no member of staff seen it happen. Our great concern is that the patients are left on their own for periods of time when something serious could happen. We cannot praise the staff enough for their care but feel at times they are very stretched. When we raised our concerns today we were told the home meets goverment guidelines on staffing levels, (like the goverment know what they are talking about!) just feel a bit sad today with the whole struggle for proper care,

    j.j
     
  2. hendy

    hendy Registered User

    Feb 20, 2008
    506
    West Yorkshire
    Hi JJ
    I am sorry your mum has received injuries at the hands of another patient. Luckily they are not too serious but unpleasant and painful nevertheless. You were right to question the home, and like you, I would not be satisfied with their answer. Would they be so glib if the injuries had ben more serious? You are right again that the staffing levels do seem inadequate, whatever CSCI have said, if you feel that mum is at risk from lack of supervision/understaffing, there are other people you take the matter up with CSCI is one and go to a senior social worker to express your concerns. I think you may get a response either way. The main thing is that you feel satisfied your mum is going to be reasonably safe, they do have a duty of care to her after all.
    take care
    hendy
     
  3. Jillybean

    Jillybean Registered User

    Mum hurt in Care Home

    Hi J.J.

    Firstly,let me say how sorry I am that your Mum is in a Care Home because of Alzheimers. You haven`t said how old she is, but I am guessing she is probably over 70?

    My mother is in a nursing home. She has been there for about 4 months, following her assessment in a mental hospital for the elderly for about 6 months.

    When she was in hospital and since she has been in the nursing home, she has had more than one "scrape". Very often, the staff cant (or wont?) say how it happened. She had only been there a week when she had a big plaster on her knee and they told me they found her with a strip of skin hanging down from her leg. Their explanation was that it can happen easily from just a knock when their skin is so thin because of their age. I found it rather hard to believe because it had never happened when she was in hospital.

    I am sure that you are right that a lot of "residents" are left un-attended at various lengths of time. As you say, they are understaffed and unfortunately, I am convinced this is the case with all care and nursing homes and hospitals.

    Everyone knows (or maybe not?!) what a hard job the staff have to do and that they probably get paid peanuts for it, which is why there are never enough staff and also why you will see an increase in foreign workers, because they will work for less.

    To coin a cliche`, I`m afraid I have to blame the government for not providing 1) enough care homes (though most are privately run these days) and 2) don't have enough regulations and inspections for the same.

    This means that any care home is overpopulated, understaffed and many grotty places that you wouldn`t wish to put your worst enemy in.!

    I also think that there are not enough care homes that are in-between a care home and nursing home - ie if you need constant care, but are only in the first stages of alzheimers, you shouldnt have to share your home with people who are in the more progressed or last stages - which can not only be stressful for the resident but very depressing for the relative/visitor to see how their loved one is going to end up.!

    If I had the money, I would buy several properties in the UK and have them staffed sufficiently and make them lovely places to live - whether or not you are aware of your surroundings.! Sadly it is not to be....

    Sorry, will get off my soapbox now......... I wish you and your Mum all the best and I am just glad to see that my lovely old Mum is still underneath the illness, and cherish each moment I spend with her until she has no need for me at all anymore....

    Try and stay positive and anytime you need a chat, contact me on this site...........

    Take care.

    Jilly :)
     
  4. Skye

    Skye Registered User

    Aug 29, 2006
    17,000
    SW Scotland
    Hi j.j

    I agree with Hendy that you are right to be concerned.

    My husband is also in an EMI unit, and I complained about the staffing levels -- and they were increased. There is supposed to be one member of staff (nurses and carers) to every four residents in an EMI unit.

    They should also not leave the lounge unattended for long periods like that. There's supposed to be someone there at all times, though sometimes it's unavoidable that they have to attend to a fall, etc. But 25 minutes is unacceptable.

    I'd definitely have a word with the manager. Some EMI patients are quite strong, and can really hurt someone.
     
  5. hendy

    hendy Registered User

    Feb 20, 2008
    506
    West Yorkshire
    Dear jily
    Oh dear, and imagine then how depressing and stressful it is to have a relative and loved one in end-stage dementia. I'm not sure this was the issue that JJ was upset about.
    hendy
     
  6. Taffy

    Taffy Registered User

    Apr 15, 2007
    1,314
    Dear jj, I can understand your concerns and it's not right that your mum and others are not properly supervised.

    Jillybean made some valid points and my thoughts on your above quote are, the governments only knows to well what is happening in some of these places.

    I am sorry for you that you have this added burden maybe you could mention to the home that this is assault on your mum and it needs to be policed so it doesn't happen again. These managers are responsible for the welfare of residents.

    I hope for the sake of you and your mum that this stops and more staff are available. Take Care, Taffy.
     
  7. TinaT

    TinaT Registered User

    Sep 27, 2006
    7,095
    Bolton
    Dear JJ

    Please write or e mail to the following with your concerns (google in the names and you will get an e mail address):

    Ivan Lewis - Parliamentary Under Secretary of State and your own MP. You can also write to the Cheif Inspector at the CSCI.

    As many of you know, I have visited quite a few Care/EMI homes and was very distressed by the lack of adequate staffing levels. I have seen two staff trying to care for 23 residents!

    I sent e mails to all the above people which resulted in the care homes being reinspected within six months of my complaint. All passed the second inspection with flying colours - What can one say?? The sad thing is that CSCI regulations are not themselves up to standard. They are happy to accept the minimum - I'm not!!

    xxTinaT
     
  8. Sandy

    Sandy Registered User

    Mar 23, 2005
    6,847
    Hi j.j.

    Just curious, but did they actually tell you what those guidelines are?

    My limited understanding, looking at the standards document on the Dept. for Health website:
    http://www.dh.gov.uk/en/Publicationsandstatistics/Publications/PublicationsPolicyAndGuidance/DH_4005819

    is that there are no hard and fast rules for staffing levels. It's all based on the particular circumstances of the home and its residents and agreed with the Commission for Social Care Inspection.

    I suppose that even between two EMI homes, differences in the layout of the home (multiple small common areas or one large one), and differences in the residents (all permanent vs. some respite) and their needs might justify different staffing ratios. I have even read CSCI reports where it has been agreed that staffing levels were too low given the needs of the residents and the care home has agreed to hire more staff.

    I think you could reasonably make the case that these attacks indicate that the levels of staffing are too low for the type of residents and you could put that concern in writing to the CSCI.

    I guess on a practical level I would be asking two questions:

    1) What are they going to do to monitor the situation as the attacks are escalating?

    2) If it is the resident that they think it is, what steps could they take to reduce the liklihood of further attacks?

    Take care,

    Sandy
     
  9. Brucie

    Brucie Registered User

    Jan 31, 2004
    12,413
    near London
    did you ask them what were the staffing levels they have?

    It is a lovely easy reply to make - that they meet guidelines [whatever that means] - but more relevant is how many residents there are for each member of staff, and how the staff are deployed.

    Certainly problems caused by other residents can always be a problem, but generally that should be the case only once - after that the problem resident should be continually under observation in my view.

    In my Jan's home there is always a member of staff around when I visit [and they are there when I arrive so it is not contrived]. Sometimes, because I am there in a public area, they may leave me there with the residents, knowing I will call them should there be a need.

    In a home with even small numbers of residents, things will happen requiring temporary re-deployment of staff on duty. For example, lifting a resident fo move them somewhere, even answering the door to visitors.

    What Sandy and others say here makes sense to me.
     
  10. j.j

    j.j Registered User

    Jan 8, 2007
    91
    Thank you for your kind replies to my post, we have a meeting in two weeks to voice our concerns of which we will ask what are the goverment guidelines on staffing. I have just took my Mam back to the home after bieng out for the afternoon, I took Mam to the lounge and another patient was taken out to the corridoor( I presume this must be the patient whom scratched Mams face). Then staff went off, I sat in lounge for a while and a patient went over to the television and pulled it off onto the floor, I dashed over and put things right and sat for a further 15 minutes before any staff came. My problem is the staff are wonderful and I don,t want to complain about them, I just feel there should be more of them.
     
  11. hendy

    hendy Registered User

    Feb 20, 2008
    506
    West Yorkshire
    Dear JJ
    I am sorry that the problems seem to be continuing. At least you have arranged a meeting. Is this with the home management or Social Services? I do understand about you not wanting to cause trouble for the staff,as you say, there are just too few of them and that of course is a management issue.
    take care
    hendy
     
  12. Taffy

    Taffy Registered User

    Apr 15, 2007
    1,314
    Hi j.j,

    This is just from my experience....staff never seen this as complaining they seen it as a chance to get more staff and would quite often urge the relatives to put any concerns in writing. I can't comment on the UK system but in Australia the guidelines are only set for Nursing Homes and in the Hostels it's management that decides.

    I can understand your concerns they are very valid ones and I hope that your concerns are taken serious.

    Good Luck, Taffy.
     
  13. Brucie

    Brucie Registered User

    Jan 31, 2004
    12,413
    near London
    I tend to agree with Taffy.

    Most care home staff want to do a good job, and if there are not enough of them to manage that, then they are the first to know.

    I think a clear indication of times [and it happens at all homes] when there are too few staff around is when they all disappear from an area when a resident has a visitor. In effect the visitor becomes the eyes of staff during their time there.

    Staff - and management - I have found to acknowledge staff short numbers at times when that is apparent. I agree that input from visitors can help to make a case for more staff, assuming there is a shortage, and that there is a budget.

    I think it is important to differentiate between management at the home, and any management there may be at head office, if there is a head office. Best not to lump them together. Often the manager at a home is fighting alongside the residents for better resources - against the purse holders elsewhere in the organisation.

    Perhaps this is another time to keep a diary of happenings when at the home - not to brandish to staff, because it is never good to feel spied upon and that may have consequences - but just to gain a feel for what sort of things are happening.
     
  14. Skye

    Skye Registered User

    Aug 29, 2006
    17,000
    SW Scotland
    Yes, this happens at John's home, too. Usually the staff will come and have a chat and a giggle with me when I'm there. If they all disappear, I know it's because they're struggling.

    I agree with this too. When I had my hissy fit the day I felt John was neglected the charge nurse went straight to the manager and said he'd resign if he didn't get more staff. He'd been trying for more for some time.

    The manager agreed that the need was there, it was reported to head office, they had a visit from a high-up, and extra staff were put in place.

    It was awful for me at the time, but CN and carers were very grateful to me, and I haven't had any trouble since.

    It's definitely worth making the point.
     

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.