Local authority taking legal charge

Grannie G

Volunteer Moderator
Apr 3, 2006
71,761
Kent
Helena, I believe that transfer of assets need to have been established for 7 years, before they are disassociated from the previous owner.
 

jenniferpa

Registered User
Jun 27, 2006
39,448
I think this may be a situation of putting the cart before the horse.

Firstly, if you own your own home but need to go into some form of residential care, assuming that social services are involved (and that's a big assumption: in a lot of areas if you're in that situation you're on your own), someone is going to have to sign a contract with the care home. There is no way that that will be social services UNLESS you or your representatives agree to a charge. If you don't agree to that charge, you'll be signing that on your own behalf, and you'll be responsible for the charges. If one wants to take advantage of the deferred payments scheme, then one's going to have to agree to the charge. It may not be fair, it may not be right, but it is what it is.

Now I think where it gets sticky is that many LA's will try to force the sale of the property, while some seem to be happy to let the deferred payments mount up.

What I'm trying to say is: if one wants residential care one will be signing something: either a contract with the care home, or an agreement with social services, because someone, sometime will have to pay that care home bill.
 

Clive

Registered User
Nov 7, 2004
716
"Helena, I believe that transfer of assets need to have been established for 7 years, before they are disassociated from the previous owner."

This applies to Inheritance Tax. Social Services just have to prove that a house has been transfered with the intention of avoiding Home fees. No time period is set. Best to do any transfers before you become old or ill.
 

noelphobic

Registered User
Feb 24, 2006
3,452
Liverpool
Clive said:
"Helena, I believe that transfer of assets need to have been established for 7 years, before they are disassociated from the previous owner."

This applies to Inheritance Tax. Social Services just have to prove that a house has been transfered with the intention of avoiding Home fees. No time period is set. Best to do any transfers before you become old or ill.
I have a friend who has actually said that her husband and herself discussed the possibility of transferring their house into their daughter's name. They are both in their 40s, without major health problems, and their daughter is still at school! The problem with this is that you are putting an enormous amount of trust in whoever you give the house to. What happens if they go off the rails in some way - get into drugs, gambling, meet the wrong person etc? You could lose your home from under you anyway.

I have considered taking out an insurance policy in case I ever need long term care. The problem with this is that I think the insurance is qute expensive anyway, like most insurance you may (hopefully) never need to claim on it, if you do you may find your claim in denied because of 'small print' etc. I am also morally opposed to seriously ill people having to pay for their own care and hope against hope that this situation may change in the future. I would be very surprised if it did though and do wonder where the money would come from to pay for people like my mum, if she was no longer paying for herself.
 

noelphobic

Registered User
Feb 24, 2006
3,452
Liverpool
jenniferpa said:
If one wants to take advantage of the deferred payments scheme, then one's going to have to agree to the charge. It may not be fair, it may not be right, but it is what it is.

Now I think where it gets sticky is that many LA's will try to force the sale of the property, while some seem to be happy to let the deferred payments mount up.

What I'm trying to say is: if one wants residential care one will be signing something: either a contract with the care home, or an agreement with social services, because someone, sometime will have to pay that care home bill.
My mum is on a deferred payments scheme but we have not 'formally' agreed to a charge on the property ie we have not signed to say we agree. Looking at what Sally says it may be that we are assumed to have agreed, given the fact that we have not mounted a legal challenge. However, it seems strange to me that the Local Authority do not provde either the resident or their next of kin with paperwork relating to this, and that they do not ask for a signature. :confused:
 

jenniferpa

Registered User
Jun 27, 2006
39,448
Brenda, have you been to the land registry site to see whether they have placed a charge on your mother's house? I believe there are certain circumstances when a charge can be placed without the owner being notified, although having lokked through the site, I have no hesitation in saying that it is one of the most confusing, badly arranged sites I have ever come across. :( However I think a search costs a minimal fee, and it might be worthwhile.

Jennifer
PS I assume you haven't signed a contract with the nursing home either?
 

noelphobic

Registered User
Feb 24, 2006
3,452
Liverpool
jenniferpa said:
Brenda, have you been to the land registry site to see whether they have placed a charge on your mother's house? I believe there are certain circumstances when a charge can be placed without the owner being notified, although having lokked through the site, I have no hesitation in saying that it is one of the most confusing, badly arranged sites I have ever come across. :( However I think a search costs a minimal fee, and it might be worthwhile.

Jennifer
PS I assume you haven't signed a contract with the nursing home either?
Are you saying that the land registry website would yield that information Jennifer? Isn't there a confidentiality/data protection issue if that is the case?

I don' think we have signed a contract with the NH but they probably wouldn't have asked us to, as they are getting their money from the Local Authority.
 

jenniferpa

Registered User
Jun 27, 2006
39,448
Yep. This information is held on a public register. This is from the faq

Our Land Register Online website enables members of the public to download copies of title information for a £3.00 fee, payable by credit or debit card.

You can also apply on Form OC1 for an office copy of the Title Register or Plan.
The Register (in brief) contains details of the current registered owner(s);

Details of registered mortgages and other financial burdens and particulars of covenants benefiting or adversely affecting the property. The Plan details the registered extent and boundaries, although it is to scale the plan does not state specific measurements. As not all land is registered if you do not know the title number of the property, please write at the head of the form "Please Supply Title Number" and we will complete a search to establish if the property is registered.

The Land Registry form referred to above can be obtained from all Legal Stationers or from any District Land Registry or downloaded from this website.

http://www.landreg.gov.uk/kb/Default.asp?ToDo=view&questId=7&catId=2

These links describe (sort of) what the land registry does
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/HomeAnd...rvicesForPropertyBuyersAndSellers/DG_10026643

http://www.landsearch.net/faq_engprop.asp
(This seems to be a private company, but at least the decription is clear)

Enjoy!

Jennifer
 

Helena

Registered User
May 24, 2006
715
It is only Oct 2006 when I researched this whole subject when we were faced with the hospital and social services saying my Mother MUST go into an EMI home and i found www.************ plus contacted them

The advice was to write to the Land Registry and warn them the LA might try to register a charge .I have a letter back from Land Reg clearly stating that if anyone tries to register a charge they are legally obliged to warn you and you have the right to object