It sometimes seems so futile

Discussion in 'ARCHIVE FORUM: Support discussions' started by Brianj, Mar 23, 2007.

  1. #1 Brianj, Mar 23, 2007
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2007
    My name is Brian (living in Nokia Finland) and my father has Alzheimers. My carer mother died last year and now we are battling with Peterborough PCT who are trying to invalidate my mothers Will which she made the first time my father 'went in'. It was a tenancy in common. They state she tried to 'reduce or avoid care home charges'.

    I notice on your site that in Birmingham there is a wonderful project to assist those who need advice about writing wills http://www.alzheimers.org.uk/News_and_Campaigns/News/22032007_free_will.htm I think this is a great idea and I hope many take this gift.

    I have read so many stories on the Internet about how PCTs use their legal machinery to force the sale of homes. To say my mother's Will is illegal is a new one on me. These stories portray ordinary people with endurance and courage and how some find the strength to fight for their loved ones often against the odds. Although it sometimes seems futile there is a lot of support in the Alzheimers Society and I am so grateful to the Peterborough Branch who gave succour to my mother in her darkest moments :) .

    Thank you

    Brian
     
  2. noelphobic

    noelphobic Registered User

    Feb 24, 2006
    3,452
    Liverpool
    Hi Brian and welcome to TP. I've moved your post because I think you will get more replies here.

    I'm sorry to hear of your mother's death and that you are now haviing problems over her will. I assume this means that the PCT are objecting to money being left to people other than your father. Is that right? My mum, who has dementia, went into residential care soon after my dad died. I'm not sure that the PCT even asked us about my dad's will, but that is probably because enough was left to my mum to mean that she was self funding.

    I hope the situation with the PCT can be resolved with as little stress as possible.

    Brenda
     
  3. "Hi Brian and welcome to TP. I've moved your post because I think you will get more replies here."

    Thanks for that Brenda :)

    "I assume this means that the PCT are objecting to money being left to people other than your father. Is that right? "

    Yes my mother made a tenants in common Will...something like a divorce where she left her half of the bungalow to us children and the other half goes to my father (who is intestate) who, according to the PCT, became self funding the day after my mothers death. The problem for them is half a house is locked or not liquid because I need the house as a base to visit my father (I live in Finland). The letter we received states "In determining the amount of capital held, the funding Authority can treat the resident as still possessing an asset that has been previously transferred, if it is believed that a significant reason for the transfer is to avoid or reduce care home accommodation charges. This determination will apply particularly if the transfer of the asset took place at a time when the client's care needs were complex and/or deteriorating, and it could reasonably be predicted that there would shortly be a need for residential care." 8Feb 2007

    I hope the situation with the PCT can be resolved with as little stress as possible.

    Thank you Brenda. The firm of lawyers who is handling probate and drew up my mother's will is fighting with the PCT. No stress Brenda, just simmering anger.


    Brian
     
  4. noelphobic

    noelphobic Registered User

    Feb 24, 2006
    3,452
    Liverpool
    It does sound like an awful situation to be in. I would be less surprised at the PCT challenging your mum's will if the whole property had been left to her children, rather than just half of it. I'm not saying that I would have agreed with it either way, as I am opposed in principle to seriously ill people having to pay for their own care.

    I hope you win your case Brian.

    Take care
    Brenda
     
  5. Helena

    Helena Registered User

    May 24, 2006
    715
    Brian

    its vital that your lawyers also check out www.************ and throw that at the PCT as well not only do they have no right to grab your house they have no right whatever to charge you for care Your parent is entitled to CONTINUING CARE free
     
  6. sue38

    sue38 Registered User

    Mar 6, 2007
    10,856
    Wigan, Lancs
    Hi Brian,

    As a solicitor this is a new one on me.

    We often advise husbands and wives/partners to change the way in which they own the home to tenants in common, which enables them to leave their share to children or whoever, and not to the survivor. This should mean that their share should not be taken into account when assessing the survivor's means.

    How dare the PCT challenge your Mum's right to leave her estate to her children, the donkey sanctuary or whoever she damn well pleased? In effect they are saying that she should have left her share of the house to the PCT! I'm not surprised you're simmering!!

    Good luck. I am sure that you and your solicitors will successfully challenge this ridiculous attitude, but would be interested to hear the outcome. Keep us posted.

    Sue xx
     
  7. Libby

    Libby Registered User

    May 20, 2006
    625
    North East
    HI Brian

    My Dad and mum changed their wills a couple of years before dad died - leaving half of their house to the 5 of us, and the other half to the surviving relative. Dad had cancer at the time, and Mum had just been diagnosed as having AD.

    We did sell the house when Dad died as Mum went into a home, but at one point, when we were finding it hard to sell, we even thought about renting it out.

    Hope you get things sorted.

    Libs
     
  8. Brucie

    Brucie Registered User

    Jan 31, 2004
    12,413
    near London
    Hi Brian

    please call the Alzheimer's Society [UK] Help Line

    The helpline is open from 8.30am to 6.30pm Monday to Friday.

    The number to dial is 0845 300 0336

    ask to speak to the legal person.

    The key point here is, i believe, that if you had lived full time with your mum and been dependent on the property as a home, then there might have been no problem. As a visitor there, living abroad, the PCT may see her leaving you her half as trying to avoid paying care costs.

    It will be a tricky one and the date on which the will was made may be crucial.

    I don't know, but even if you win the half share back, the place may need to be sold to release the other half of funds for care. Again, if you lived there on a daily basis that would not be so, the place should not be sold, though a charge might be put on your father's half.

    You need to get legal advice.
     
  9. Thank you

    I would like to thank Noelphobic, Helena, Sue 38, Libby and Brucie for taking the time to read and reply to my messages. I will get advice and not give up.

    Best wishes

    Brianj
     
  10. Scoop

    Scoop Registered User

    Nov 20, 2006
    99
    I have no advice but wish you luck!

    I am interested in the outcome too as my parents are currently moving and planning to do Tennants in common with me and my sister to split it 4 ways. They have been planning this for years not to avoid paying care but to avoid too much inheritance tax ( Daylight robbery tax )

    Scott
     
  11. Conrad

    Conrad Registered User

    Jan 15, 2007
    16
    How bizarre! I presume the PCT are trying to access the capital within your father's share of the property.

    The more logical method would be to request a sale of the house rather than question the will.

    It's quite common, for inheritance tax purposes, for houses to be owned in this way.

    But surely it would be easier (and cheaper), if you are unwilling to sell now, to place a charge against the property rather than contet the will.

    Hardly efficient use of resources!
     
  12. jenniferpa

    jenniferpa Volunteer Moderator

    Jun 27, 2006
    39,417
    Ah, but by trying to contest the will now, they potentially get double the pot as it were. If they (the PCT) let it stand now they will be out of luck when it comes to the future if Brian's father's share runs out. I can see why they're doing it, but it's despicable.
     

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