If financial assessment isn't completed, what happens?

[nitram]

"The difference between what a resident is assessed as being able to contribute from means- tested income and assets including his former main or only home and the amount he would be assessed as being able to contribute if his main or only home were disregarded is then deferred."

Home is disregarded - resident assessed to contribute x

Home has been sold and capital available - resident assessed to contribute y

Home not sold, deferred payment scheme agreed - resident contributes x and (y-x) is deferred.

 

[fr0d0]

Thanks Chemmy. Sorry for being vague. I think it's in my nature!

Yes I think you're right to just go ahead. Just the usual butterflies I guess.

Ooh I didn't realise Jennifer was in the US.

Yes Saffie, I expected all of the income required to be eligible. I think what's confusing me is, that statement assumes that the assets are paying and not the income, as in this case.

 

[jenniferpa]

Sorry - late as usual. The quote I gave comes from the section of CRAG (Charging for Residential Accommodation Guidelines) dealing with deferred payments. Saffie's interpretation of what I meant is spot on, as is nitram's explanation.

The only thing I want to add is that under the new system, where people pay interest on the amount deferred, those interest payments also accrue as a deferred amount.

Since CHC has been refused, the only option as I see it is to complete the LA financial assessment now while continuing to appeal the CHC decision since as others have pointed out, should that CHC decision be overturned, back payment will be made.

 

[fr0d0]

I think it means that any income will have to be paid towards the fees if the LA are funding, just as happens for everyone.
That is the rate would be the LA rate less any income paid by the resident.
That's how I read it anyway. Jennifer will correct this if it is wrong.
Nobody gets totally free care as income has to be included.

Thanks Saffie, and Jennifer for the confirmation.

So this sounds hopeful. The resident will be paying the LA their income, which looks like it will cover the whole payment to the nursing home.

As I've said, the resident expects to pay their income, as well as what ever is deemed necessary beyond that of their assets, to the LA if a deferred payment can be agreed upon, following the assessment.

 

[Soobee]

This scares me as it means that I could in theory be issued with a bill even though it's been over a year since mum died - no contribution was decided because I said we'd go for a deferred payment. Never heard a thing after that and they paid everything after the 12 week disregard.

 

[jenniferpa]

Soobee - when you (or whoever) wound up your mother's estate, did you advertise in the London Gazette for creditors? Because if you did, they will be out of luck.

 

[Soobee]

No I haven't and I haven't finished doing probate officially yet. I didn't think I needed to advertise (it's not compulsory) because I know who my debtors and creditors are. Have they got 6 months after that?

 

[jenniferpa]

If you did advertise, (both in the LG and a local paper if there is real property (I think)) then they have 2 calender months from the date of the advertisement. If you didn't and the estate has been distributed then the executors become personally liable for any potential debts.

No, it's not compulsory but it's a wise move.

 

[Soobee]

That's really helpful, thank you!

There's a risk that doing the notice will bring things to their attention as they obviously have to check the gazette and the local newspaper for these notices. The longer I can lie low the less likely they would be to successfully claim anything.

To be honest, I am not sure it would be legal for them to suggest I need to pay contributions which were never even mentioned when she was alive.

 

[jenniferpa]

If you don't advertise and they find out 7 years later they will be able to successfully sue the executors. Really. Realistically I would expect it to rear its ugly head the next time the LA does an audit. I would suggest that unless you are the sole beneficiary and are prepared to pay up if they come asking, you would be far better off not trying to avoid the issue. And your mother's estate does owe this money to the LA - if it isn't paid then that's less money the LA has to help others.

 

[jenniferpa]

To be honest, I am not sure it would be legal for them to suggest I need to pay contributions which were never even mentioned when she was alive.

But it's not you that would be paying them, it's your mothers estate.

 

[Soobee]

I would take your point if I was avoiding contributions. But they were never agreed. As soon as they took over payment when mum went below the threshold I never heard from them again. So I never got anything saying you should pay x and we'll pay y (except for at the time of the 12 week disregard).

 

[Soobee]

Yes I'm using me as shorthand - I know it's from their estate.

 

[jenniferpa]

It's possible they have written it off. If they dropped the ball with regard to the assessment they may have decided they were at fault. Personally, I would do a down and dirty calculation about how much it is likely to be (cost of home minus pension contributions plus the PEA) and put that much in an interest bearing account.

 

[Soobee]

I thought I'd do that but the beneficiaries/other executors have told me they want the money rather than me putting it aside. I'll draw up a letter saying they should put x amount of money aside in case it is ever challenged and they'll be liable not just me.

 

[jenniferpa]

Umm - if you are the executor then no, the other beneficiaries won't be liable unless they are executors as well, just you. Do you want to take that risk? I wouldn't.

 

[Soobee]

Umm - if you are the executor then no, the other beneficiaries won't be liable unless they are executors as well, just you. Do you want to take that risk? I wouldn't.

They are executors with powers reserved. So I think they'd be liable, especially if they sign a document agreeing that.

 

[Soobee]

(sorry Fr0d0 for taking over your thread for a page)

 

[fr0d0]

No problem