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  1. noelphobic

    noelphobic Registered User

    Feb 24, 2006
    3,452
    Liverpool
  2. BeckyJan

    BeckyJan Registered User

    Nov 28, 2005
    18,972
    Derbyshire
    I admire his honesty. Not every human being has the strength and stamina to endure what I (and many others do) have done both for my father and husband and now brother. Thank God I have been blessed with that strength and who are we to criticise those who have not. It does not mean Sir Ian did not love his father as I believe he did.

    I accept you have your viewpoint but that is mine.
     
  3. cragmaid

    cragmaid Registered User

    Oct 18, 2010
    7,963
    North East England
    Why?.....for being honest in admitting how weak he was for not visiting a person who had no knowledge of who he was, let alone who the visitors were. For wanting to spare his family the pain of seeing the old man's disintergration.
    We all face this illness differently, just as it affects each sufferer differently. As is repeated here regularly......there are no rights or wrongs with Dementia. There is only the fact that we all do our best and what is best for one person and what works for their particular situation is unique to them.

    I will not condemn a person, any person, for not being strong enough to withstand the daily onslaught that Dementia brings. I will feel sorry for them, their life was touched by Dementia affecting their relative, friend, neighbour ....or self.
     
  4. starryuk

    starryuk Registered User

    Nov 8, 2012
    1,299
    #4 starryuk, May 24, 2014
    Last edited: May 24, 2014
    Poor man:mad: Didn't want to upset himself.:mad:

    How does he think his father felt?

    Sorry, I can't feel as understanding as you Cragsmaid and BeckyJan. But then my mum has just died. I am feeling a bit raw and resentful towards my 'invisibles'.

    I will try to be more tolerant in a while.
     
  5. Countryboy

    Countryboy Registered User

    Mar 17, 2005
    1,408
    Male
    Cornwall
    Well at least he is honest and truthful I admire him or anyone who does that personally I hate all this politely correctness for me say exactly whats on your mind and if they don’t like tough #/#/ and they can #/#/ off
     
  6. Jess26

    Jess26 Registered User

    Jan 5, 2011
    970
    Kent
    #6 Jess26, May 24, 2014
    Last edited: May 24, 2014
    I was saddened that my brother's two boys who are in their thirties never visited their nan in her CH. One of them told my daughter at mum's funeral that there father had told them not too :( as it would upset them. My daughter took her two small children to visit grannie. She loved seeing them, until she became bed bound in the last couple of weeks. Being adults, I feel they should have overrided him. Mum would have loved to see them.
    I couldn't have stayed away, but it is a personal choice.
     
  7. noelphobic

    noelphobic Registered User

    Feb 24, 2006
    3,452
    Liverpool
    Apart from any other consideration, how could he possibly know if his father was being well looked after if he didn't go to see him?

    He may have believed that his father would not know if he or anyone else was there but he can't know for sure.
     
  8. noelphobic

    noelphobic Registered User

    Feb 24, 2006
    3,452
    Liverpool
    There is no way of knowing whether his father knew he was there or who his visitors were. The rest of his family should have made their own decisions.

    There were times when I couldn't cope with seeing my mum and wouldn't go for a week or two. I always went back though.
     
  9. Rathbone

    Rathbone Registered User

    May 17, 2014
    2,264
    Female
    West Sussex
    I'm with you Craigmaid. As you say, we all do the best we can and it's so easy to judge. Not a lot of point in being Holier than thou in my book; my own shortcomings are far too great for that! I think "owning up" when you have such a high profile takes considerable courage. Like all of us, he has a right to do what he thinks is best for his family. Let's face it, in such circumstances, whatever you say and however you say it, you are bound to jump on somebody's corns! And I think the biggest point is that his father was not aware. It is, of course, likely that given the choice of what to do as the best for his family, his father may well have made the same one. I wish him well.
     
  10. Saffie

    Saffie Registered User

    Mar 26, 2011
    22,501
    Female
    Near Southampton
    His words above - how many times have we heard them?
    They are excuses not reasons.
    What memories?
    The man is still there; he is still your father; he is still human and he still exists so the memories continue until he dies.
    When he is dead, you may choose to concentrate on the good memories but the others are still part of the man.

    As for him stopping his family from visiting and trying to encourage his mother not to as well - I'd like to see him try to stop me visiting my husband.
    If we all thought like that heaven help our poor relatives.
    I don't condemn him, I just pity him for his lack of compassion and inability to care sufficiently for his father whatever way he justifies it.
     
  11. starryuk

    starryuk Registered User

    Nov 8, 2012
    1,299
    My mum was in hospital dying for 6 weeks.

    She knew me or at least knew I was there for her right up until the last couple of days. In fact, even then I got a response, (a very slight lifting of the eyebrow although she appeared to be totally unconscious) when I told her I was there.

    Yes it was very very hard, but I could not have stayed away. Perhaps it is different between father and son.
     
  12. tp18

    tp18 Registered User

    Oct 8, 2012
    144
    Everyone is different, and although it wouldn't be my personal choice to stay away, I have to give Botham credit for his honesty, and respect the choices he made. Its his life and family after all, not mine.
     
  13. Anongirl

    Anongirl Registered User

    Aug 8, 2012
    2,675
    For me (and I'm thinking about my own mum and we haven't reached this point yet) these are the two things that would play on my conscience. Six months is a long time. The last few weeks perhaps or not visiting very regularly I could understand. It's very hard watching someone die.

    I would always feel like I abandoned mum if I didn't at least go and kiss her on the head now and again or whisper in her ear. Just in case, somewhere in there, even for a second she might get some comfort from knowing I was there. It would play on my conscience.

    But that's me. Perhaps I overthink things. If Ian's conscience is clear then he did the right thing. Self preservation.

    The one thing I do agree with is that I would protect my children. They are young now but I always ask them if they want to visit mum. If they don't then I respect that. I wouldn't make them go or stop them going.
     
  14. starryuk

    starryuk Registered User

    Nov 8, 2012
    1,299
    That's how I feel too, Saffie.
     
  15. Rageddy Anne

    Rageddy Anne Registered User

    Feb 21, 2013
    5,990
    Cotswolds
    I'm grateful he has had the courage to tell people , and show himself in what he will have known would be an unfavourable light in the view of some. Look at the publicity he's generated for Alzheimer's. Isn't that what we need?
     
  16. Countryboy

    Countryboy Registered User

    Mar 17, 2005
    1,408
    Male
    Cornwall
    The one thing I do agree with is that I would protect my children. They are young now but I always ask them if they want to visit mum. If they don't then I respect that. I wouldn't make them go or stop them going.[/QUOTE]

    Yes I will agree with that well put , I have discussed with my children what I would like from them and isn't to visit me in a care home that's for sure ,
     
  17. Saffie

    Saffie Registered User

    Mar 26, 2011
    22,501
    Female
    Near Southampton
    #17 Saffie, May 24, 2014
    Last edited: May 24, 2014
    Ah, but he didn't give them the option to visit or not. He says he " made sure they stayed away" and even "urged his mother to do the same".
    That is totally different from giving then the choice.
    It would surely be kinder to let those who wished to see their grandfather do so rather than leave how he is to their imagination.
    My grandchildren have visited my husband.
    He doesn't know who they are, nor probably who I am.
    However, all my grandchildren know that their grandfather has dementia.
    They will also be more understanding when they meet someone with dementia in the future as they are bound to do.
     
  18. Countryboy

    Countryboy Registered User

    Mar 17, 2005
    1,408
    Male
    Cornwall
    My children were 8 and 11 when my dad was diagnosed with dementia their 44 and 47 now so they lived with dementia most of their lives , five members of our family have had dementia including me They all lived to old age all died of something else dementia is just one of life’s obstacles just need to change a few things a person with dementia knows for several years they have memory problems the best answer is to accept it from the start
     
  19. Anongirl

    Anongirl Registered User

    Aug 8, 2012
    2,675
    Yeah I agree. That's why I say I give them the option and respect their decision. I would neither make them go or stop them. At any age I do believe it has to be their choice. I would never want them to turn round to me and say i forced them to go or stay away. It's everyone's individual choice.

    What did hit me was when he said he felt there was no point in visiting. I hope no one gives up on me like that, particular those who apparently love me.
     
  20. Rageddy Anne

    Rageddy Anne Registered User

    Feb 21, 2013
    5,990
    Cotswolds
    One of my grand daughters must have been talking about her Grandpa's Alzheimer's, and a school friend of hers had a suggestion. To reinforce a memory, sing a particular song every time a different subject comes up...For instance, choose a song for the cupboard where he can find the plates, and another song for finding the shed keys, and a different song for when she's expected for a visit. A bit like, for instance, " Bring me laughter..." Does that evoke a memory? We now sing The Dambusters March for remembering where the front door key is. So, yes, she will certainly be more understanding meeting someone with Dementia in the future.
     
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