husband's licence has expired would he be eligible to go to a driving centre ?

[Airstream]

I have an ongoing problem with withdrawal of driving licence for my husband over a year ago.
We have travelled extensively and he was in Royal Navy so always on the move !
Almost each day he asks why he can’t drive I have done almost everything to explain why ( Dementia) GP has explained, also support groups, he stares at car through window and I see the anger coming banging things with his stick and even his head on one occasion also verbally abusive to me, he calms after about an hour and sometimes falls asleep.
I said sell car ( I drive) thought if I bought another one different colour etc etc ... so many questions!
I wondered if he could do a driver assessment a d they would fail him I wouldn’t like him to drive now after almost a year.. but as his licence has expired maybe he wouldn’t be eligible to go to a driving centre ?
Thanks for listening!

 

[Sarasa]

Hi @Airstream and welcome to Dementia Talking Point. This is a topic that comes up a lot. I did a search and it came up with all these threads and I'm sure there are more. They might answer your queries.
Others will be along shortly with their experience of undertaking an assessment or renewing your husbands licence, as this isn't anything I've had to deal with.
I am a bit concerned about your husband being aggressive and verbally abusive. It might be a good idea to talk to the support line about options for support. These are the details phone 0333 150 3456 or email dementia.connect@alzheimers.org.uk.
Keep posting you'll get lots of help and support here.

 

[Spamar]

@Airstream , on a driving assessment they won’t take him out on the road at first, there will be various questions etc and they will try a static vehicle first. My husband was failed because he didn’t put his foot on the brake heavily enough. He pointed out that this wasn’t his vehicle and his was different. But they still failed him. His main problem was not following direction signs. So he could get to a place because the way home had signs to villages, not the main town!
I always wonder if that was a put up job!

 

[Thethirdmrsc]

Hi @Airstream and welcome. Sometimes it comes down to how safe you feel with him driving, and how safe it is for others. My OH lost his license two years ago. He still talks about it, and is still bitter but less so over time, but he was very unsafe. He couldn’t read how fast others were, and lost the ability to navigate. So within the month I sold both his beloved jag and my mini, , and bought a neutral car. It was hard, but head down and I got on with it.

 

[Shedrech]

hello @Airstream
a warm welcome to DTP

it may be worth calling your local centre and asking them directly
I take it that the medics advised your husband not to drive and the DVLA were informed of this ... so his licence was revoked ... though you say 'expired' so maybe at some point your husband chose not to or forgot to renew

if explaining the reason each time your husband asks is putting you at risk of aggression, find a form of words to simply, neutrally and sympathetically tell him eg "Your licence has expired so sadly you aren't able to drive now" and walk away (find something you need to do eg go to the loo, check on some cooking) .... don't go into details about the dementia, or the GP or anything else as the fact that he doesn't have a current licence is sufficient to explain why he cannot legally drive ... if he carries on, or says he wants to sort out his licence, say 'that's a good idea' and leave him to it again ... find some distraction eg a favourite TV programme, a coffee and cake

is there anywhere to park the car which is out of sight, so the car isn't a trigger to his questions

 

[Airstream]

hello @Airstream
a warm welcome to DTP

it may be worth calling your local centre and asking them directly
I take it that the medics advised your husband not to drive and the DVLA were informed of this ... so his licence was revoked ... though you say 'expired' so maybe at some point your husband chose not to or forgot to renew

if explaining the reason each time your husband asks is putting you at risk of aggression, find a form of words to simply, neutrally and sympathetically tell him eg "Your licence has expired so sadly you aren't able to drive now" and walk away (find something you need to do eg go to the loo, check on some cooking) .... don't go into details about the dementia, or the GP or anything else as the fact that he doesn't have a current licence is sufficient to explain why he cannot legally drive ... if he carries on, or says he wants to sort out his licence, say 'that's a good idea' and leave him to it again ... find some distraction eg a favourite TV programme, a coffee and cake

is there anywhere to park the car which is out of sight, so the car isn't a trigger to his questions

Thankyou have tried parking car when not in sight he just gets anxious as he can’t see it. Ir’s never ending the distress he feels am going to have another chat with GP
THANKYOU

 

[Countryboy]

I will offer some positive advise
but first of all if your husband is receiving any finical support because of his disability being dementia obviously he will never get his driving licence back second his age will also be a factor,

Having said that just remember Doctors & medical professionals to follow certain guidelines when you develop a ‘notifiable’ medical condition or disability anything that could affect your ability to drive safely such as : Notifiable conditions are. They include: diabetes if you takin insulin, syncope {fainting } heart conditions including pacemakers , sleep apnoea , epilepsy, strokes, glaucoma, dementia, the only place to get an assessment of driving ability its at the mobility driving centres just remember all the others DVLA ect are bureaucrats just following policy and procedure any decision or advise they give you could affect you for the rest of your life possibly another 25 plus years the bureaucrat will have forgotten about you in a few minutes so the only think thing through for your self

ps I was diagnosed with dementia 22 years ago I’m still driving

 

[Dianej]

My partner was advised not to drive again when he received his diagnosis of Alzheimers three months ago. He immediately forgot everything that was said at the Memory Clinic. He insists there is nothing wrong with him, refused an MRI scan, and will not take his medication because he "doesn't need it". He forgets that he should not drive, so every day is Groundhog Day where I have to explain to him that he has "memory problems" and the doctor thinks it would be unsafe for him to drive, and that he is not insured, and he becomes angry and says he can drive and the doctor was not qualified and doesn't know her job. We now rarely go out of our village, as I try to avoid plans that will involve the car. I think a more varied life with days out etc might be good for both of us, but I know that any mention of going somewhere by car means that he will have forgotten that he can't drive, and we will have another angry scene. When he suggests going somewhere in the car, I make an excuse why we shouldn't go there as I dread the same old same old. He is 74, and has been driving since he was 16, and driving was a large part of his working day, so I guess old habits die very hard. I have thought of getting rid of the car, but I bought it for myself to fulfil almost a lifelong ambition, and I think "Do I have to give everything up for this blasted disease. Will I have anything left of myself soon." I hoped the driving thing would have eased by now and he would have accepted it or forgotten about it, but there is no sign of that happening.

 

[update2020]

This is such a hard one and very very common. It was the thing my husband was angriest about, I think. I did change our car (as you suggested) and we also moved house into a location where using it was less necessary (and it was parked where he couldn't see it). This did help quite a bit, since he loved the new house and also enjoyed walking everywhere - and taking buses and trains. As the dementia progressed his anger lessened and his acceptance of me driving increased a lot. Things became easier as his understanding and memory dimmed. However even now - when things are quite advanced and he is in a care home - he still searches endlessly for 'the car' when he is at his most agitated. All of this unfolded over years (he stopped driving 8 years ago - and that was probably a bit later than he should have). SYMPATHY <3

 

[Countryboy]

The information is out there if you look at DVLA. then decide how to proceed

Driving during medical enquiries

The time taken to obtain all necessary reports can be lengthy but a licence holder may retain entitlement to drive under Section 88 of the Road Traffic Act 1988. However, a driver whose last licence was revoked or refused because of a medical condition or is a high risk offender re-applying after a drink/drive disqualification from 1 June 2013 would not, however, be eligible to drive until they are issued with a new licence.

The driver may be covered to drive, but this carries implications for road safety in that the licence holder may continue to drive with a medical condition that, on completion of DVLA’s enquiries, may ultimately result in licence withdrawal.

It is for the patient to assure themselves that they are fit to drive. Medical professionals who are asked for an opinion about a patient’s fitness to drive in these circumstances should explain the likely outcome by reference to this guide. The final decision in relation to driver licensing will, however, rest with DVLA.

By reference to DVLA’s guidance, the doctor in charge of an individual’s care should be able to advise the driver whether or not it is safe for them to continue to drive during this period.

Patients must be reminded that if they choose to ignore medical advice to stop driving this may affect the validity of their motor insurance cover. Doctors are advised to formally and clearly document the advice given.

DVLA is solely reliant on doctors and other healthcare professionals for the provision of medical information. To make timely licensing decisions that impact on the safety of the individual and the public, DVLA needs information to be provided as quickly as possible.

When DVLA holds all relevant information, a decision can then be made as to whether or not the driver or applicant satisfies the national medical guidelines and the requirements of the law. A licence is accordingly issued or refused/revoked.

Outcome of medical enquiries

DVLA does not routinely tell doctors of the outcome of a medical enquiry. Drivers are always informed of the outcome, either by being issued a licence or by notification of a refusal or revocation.

For cases in which the driver may not have the insight and/or memory function to abide by the refusal or revocation of their licence – for example, in cognitive impairment, dementia or a mental health condition – DVLA would usually send a decision letter to the GP.

When a notification is received from a doctor in accordance with the GMC guidelines, unless relevant to one of these conditions affecting mental capacity, DVLA will send an acknowledgement letter only to the GP, to confirm receipt of the original notification.

 

[Muffin23]

This is such a hard one and very very common. It was the thing my husband was angriest about, I think. I did change our car (as you suggested) and we also moved house into a location where using it was less necessary (and it was parked where he couldn't see it). This did help quite a bit, since he loved the new house and also enjoyed walking everywhere - and taking buses and trains. As the dementia progressed his anger lessened and his acceptance of me driving increased a lot. Things became easier as his understanding and memory dimmed. However even now - when things are quite advanced and he is in a care home - he still searches endlessly for 'the car' when he is at his most agitated. All of this unfolded over years (he stopped driving 8 years ago - and that was probably a bit later than he should have). SYMPATHY <3

My husband has just received a letter from the DVLA to say his license will not be reissued.
It feels so sad for both of us. I do drive but only locally. I’ll have to see how he reacts over the next few weeks.
It’s another bit of him that’s being lost. At times I feel such grief as I’m slowly inch by inch loosing him. We’ve been together since 17 years old. Now are 76. I miss the one he was but love him ever more with each day. He was always there with the car when I went anywhere and Always met me but that’s stopped. It’s just a low time for me. I’m cheerful with him but sometimes I’m smiling but my heart is breaking. I’m told worse is yet to come. I have no close family so sometimes it’s hard not to be able to have a cry with someone who could just hug me. Sorry if this seems selfish

 

[SeaSwallow]

You are not selfish at all @Muffin23 It is so hard to watch our loved ones change because of this disease.

 

[Hermann]

A sad milestone, Muffin23, but for the best.

My father was still driving four years ago and doing 200-300 miles per week. In spite of an existing cognitive impairment diagnosis the doctor had recently cleared him to drive with the DVLA.

My own observations, however, led me to feel that he was not actually fit to drive. After weighing my father's continued freedom of movement against the safety of other road users, the latter won. The last thing I wanted was for harm to come to others because my father was still out and about in a car. I took his car key off him. His sixty year-long clean driving record will now always stay that way and no-one can be harmed as a result of my failure to act.

Which brings me on to the most critical thing in all of this: that those in charge of someone's care have a duty to act if they feel there is a risk to the public in their loved one continuing to drive.

 

[sapphire turner]

Yes I agree, it is so hard tho! My mother had dementia and was a terrifying driver. Eventually she hit another car in a supermarket car park and we took the keys off her. But for a year before that my sister and I would not get in the car with her. I am relieved that she never hurt anyone. But her confidence plummeted once she couldn’t drive, she stopped writing a diary and kind of gave up on life.
My husband has dementia and 3 years ago I refused to let him drive me anywhere after several near misses. He is still really angry about it and constantly criticises my driving but at least he has stopped driving and won’t be causing any accidents.