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Home carers

banger696

Registered User
Sep 17, 2015
225
North East
Mum came out of hospital a few weeks ago and has had home care twice a a day arranged by SS. They were booked for an hour each session but only stay for 5-15 mins per session. We are self funding but the council has said they will invoice us every 4 weeks, will I be billed the full amount or for only 15 mins per session?

I asked the council department responsible for this and got a letter back detailing charges and a paragraph underlined about savings' deprevation but no answe to my question. Any ideas?
 

fizzie

Registered User
Jul 20, 2011
2,730
You need to keep a record of exactly how long they stay then when you are billed don't pay it return a copy of your log of time spent at your house and tell them you will pay for the service they have provided!!
 

banger696

Registered User
Sep 17, 2015
225
North East
Yes it's an agency and they keep a log with time's on which I am scanning. She has a named social worker but although she was cc on the email to the funding department, hasn't been in touch yet, so I will keep copying their log.
 

fizzie

Registered User
Jul 20, 2011
2,730
I do agree about the phone call but it is important to put everything in writing, even a follow up email..a written record will be vital when it comes to payment.
 

Selinacroft

Registered User
Oct 10, 2015
936
Mum came out of hospital a few weeks ago and has had home care twice a a day arranged by SS. They were booked for an hour each session but only stay for 5-15 mins per session. We are self funding but the council has said they will invoice us every 4 weeks, will I be billed the full amount or for only 15 mins per session?

I asked the council department responsible for this and got a letter back detailing charges and a paragraph underlined about savings' deprevation but no answe to my question. Any ideas?
Hi
I can't understand why SS would be sending you an invoice if you are self funding. Self funding means just that, that you organise care on your own and pay for it. From my experience you need to watch the agency like a hawk . I'm just about to cancel my morning visits when i am at work. I will be taking over the breakfast and morning meds and have some help later on when I am at home. This way I can supervise time spent and jobs allocated to them. The agency that CHC used and that I continued with once CHC was refused, cut corners and whiz off asap. They do as little as possible so I need to either change them or intensely supervise them but I certainly won't be paying for work not done.
A previous agency tried to send carers out to Dad when he was s till in hospital and I had notified 3 members of their team on separate occasions. I told them dad was not at home so they left each time and the bills came rolling in for an hour a time. I kicked up big time and got them to issue credit notes against the invoices.
Watch you back, record everything and complain when they take the Micky. They will most certainly try and bill you for anything and everything.
 

banger696

Registered User
Sep 17, 2015
225
North East
I will be keeping a close eye on them as one particular carer gets my mum to sign something and non of the others do, also she is here 5 mins and puts down 15.
 

Tin

Registered User
May 18, 2014
4,825
UK
Like someone else has asked, if you are self funding why is local authority involved with billing you. Now you must find out what it is your mother is signing, are you there when this carer visits, if so ask to look at what your mum has just signed, don't be shy, be in the room with them next time, just say you are interested. Obviously it is something the carer takes away with her so is probably some sort of time sheet. Most agencies follow a care package and must fill in a report on their visit including time arrive and time leave, this should be left in your home for you to look at any time. If there is no report/time sheet/care package in your home, make one and tell carers to fill in at every visit. You have to know what's going on.
 

banger696

Registered User
Sep 17, 2015
225
North East
There is a log that they all fill in with time arrived and time left and what they do while they are here, mostly the entries are had a chat all well, I am taking a copy of this just in case it disappears. Only 1 out of the 3 carers asks mum to sign.

One thing that irks me is the response from the council funding department in response to my email about one carer only being here 5 minutes and not wanting to be charged for an hour.

She replied with a letter setting out the charges for the care package in 15 minute intervals but then at the bottom of the letter took the opportunity to point out about asset deprevation. She must think I have mums money, I do manage it but it is in her name, and have already signed a declaration to say we dont want a financial assessment and have over the required savings to be self funding.
 

Tin

Registered User
May 18, 2014
4,825
UK
If there is any deprivation going on then it is not you but possibly the care agency billing for one hour visits when actually only there for 5 minutes. I know rounding up to the next hour or half hour is acceptable but not by that much. Is this carer filling in the report form with correct times?
 

curtainsgalore

Registered User
Nov 2, 2014
46
When SS first moved carers in for my Mum it was an assessment team from the LA to assess the amount of care and the time needed to carry out that care. This was free for 6 weeks then the LA found a suitable care agency to become Mums carers and I paid them directly. The LA would pay the care agency for me then bill me, but this was 50p more per hour so seemed a nonsense.
Although I have heard that if the LA will fight your corner if there is a problem with the care agency and you are paying them.
 

Tin

Registered User
May 18, 2014
4,825
UK
When SS first moved carers in for my Mum it was an assessment team from the LA to assess the amount of care and the time needed to carry out that care. This was free for 6 weeks then the LA found a suitable care agency to become Mums carers and I paid them directly. The LA would pay the care agency for me then bill me, but this was 50p more per hour so seemed a nonsense.
Although I have heard that if the LA will fight your corner if there is a problem with the care agency and you are paying them.
So that's why/how local authority are involved. Makes sense, maybe its the same deal for you, 6 weeks free. Still, worthwhile finding out what your mother is signing.
 

banger696

Registered User
Sep 17, 2015
225
North East
If there is any deprivation going on then it is not you but possibly the care agency billing for one hour visits when actually only there for 5 minutes. I know rounding up to the next hour or half hour is acceptable but not by that much. Is this carer filling in the report form with correct times?
The times are for 15 minute visits in the log others about 25, I will ask next time she asks mum to sign.

I have no idea why me asking about a carer only spending 15 minutes and should I be charged for one hour should get me a letter with underlined paragraph about savings deprivation but it annoys me.

The social worker who arranged the package said they should attend for 1 hour at lunchtime and 8pm, but are now turning up at 6pm because of the dark nights and having to walk home in the dark, only one has a car and she is weekends.
 

banger696

Registered User
Sep 17, 2015
225
North East
So that's why/how local authority are involved. Makes sense, maybe its the same deal for you, 6 weeks free. Still, worthwhile finding out what your mother is signing.
I dont think its free as they have sent me the rates of payment and to expect an invoice after 4 weeks but I think it is an assessment package of 6 weeks. Time to call the social worker on monday methinks.
 

fizzie

Registered User
Jul 20, 2011
2,730
In the end we took on a private carer - found locally, sometimes your carers café or group will be able to recommend someone - lots of the agencies are big time rip offs - as we are a small town anyone who cares privately really values their reputatioin so I guess it would depend where you live whether this is possible
 

Pickles53

Registered User
Feb 25, 2014
2,474
Radcliffe on Trent
I have no idea why me asking about a carer only spending 15 minutes and should I be charged for one hour should get me a letter with underlined paragraph about savings deprivation but it annoys me.

The social worker who arranged the package said they should attend for 1 hour at lunchtime and 8pm, but are now turning up at 6pm because of the dark nights and having to walk home in the dark, only one has a car and she is weekends.
I would be annoyed too, but the most likely explanation is that it's a standard letter template and nobody has bothered to remove the irrelevant paragraph, or that some lawyer has told them they must include this in all correspondence about finance so that when there is a deprivation of assets issue people can't say they didn't know.

If the care package says 8pm that's when they should come. It is not your problem that they don't have cars or don't like walking home when it's dark. That's the nature of the job; it involves unsocial hours. They can't change the care package to suit their personal convenience.

If you can't get this sorted quickly, it might be less hassle to look yourselves for another agency. Mum was self-funding and we dealt directly with the agency. It wasn't by any means all plain sailing and we had a lot if teething problems, but it was easier than complaining to the LA and waiting for them to take action.
 

Lancashirelady

Registered User
Oct 7, 2014
110
If your mum is totally self-funding, then there is absolutely no reason why the LA are paying and then you are reimbursing them, with all the hassle that involves. Far easier to deal directly with the agency, or any agency that you wish to use. My mum is part-funded by our LA and partly by her own contributions. I was asked whether we wanted the LA to arrange the care, but as we were already using a agency we were happy with (paying privately, but when her care needs increased we got the LA involved), we asked for her to have Direct Payments. So I still deal with the agency directly, opened a current account which the LA pay into, and Mum also pays into.
My Mum is self funding but her care is arranged via the LA. The contract with the care agency is at a lower rate (not sure how much lower) than if it were arranged privately. It took the LA over 6 months to even send us a bill and 2 years on they are still miles out of date. As for the carers, until the company was taken over recently they had to log in and out by phone - was just a code they put in so didn;t cost us anything but kept an accurate record of time spent in the house. Now they have been given mobiles with GPS so that the office can tell where they are and bill accordingly - though I have heard rumours of a carer sitting in her car for 20 minutes then in the house for 10 minutes and charging for a 30 minute visit. If I catch them doing this at Mum's there will be blood on the carpet!