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Help with Self employed carer

Discussion in 'I care for a person with dementia' started by Anney63, Jan 11, 2017.

  1. Anney63

    Anney63 Registered User

    Oct 5, 2016
    Hi Everyone,
    I am at my wits end.
    My MIL lives with her twin sister they are 96. We have a self employed PA who is part funded b y Social Services. My MIL Altzheimers is getting worse. The carer is really now decided that she wants every other Friday Saturday and Sunday off returning on Monday morning.Thursdays MIL is at a day Centre I live 16 miles away and the other family live over an hour away. I am 75 and have just spent 2 weeks looking after MIL. My feelings are that we should get a new Live In carer via an agency which will take a lot of pressure off both families and keep MIL on an even schedule.putting her into respite every 2 weeks is just going to unsettle her my only other alternative will be a care home. Her twins family want to see about getting an agency in for those 3 days which again will just confuse her.My feeling is that a complete change of live in carer will only unsettle her the once . They dont appear to realise what this does to her. If I decide a care home is the only option as her POA will anyone be able to go against me . MIL doesnt know who I am anymore just thinks I am a carer, There is a lovely home right on my doorstep wher I could see her very often. Can anyone stop me if I take this alternative. The carer is just so impossible to deal with and continuously is making demands
  2. annierich

    annierich Registered User

    Nov 11, 2015
    It depends which POA you have and whether or not you are the only Attorney named on it. If you have sole POA for finances and your MIL will be self funding then I think you could decide how your MIL is cared for, and arrange it. If she is below the £23,000 threshold then SS will need to be involved.
  3. Tin

    Tin Registered User

    May 18, 2014
    Don't know the legalities of POA when it comes to this kind of decision. One thing for sure, you should get rid of an over demanding carer and you are right, having respite every now and then can be very confusing as well as different faces dealing with her daily care. Is the other twin healthy and fit? Why are you considering the input from other twins family - is this just because they live together and that, dare I say it, maybe they are benefitting from your mil having a live in carer. Or possibly its more complicated than that.

    If you have found a suitable care home and your partner is in agreement, self funding in place, etc. I can only see this as a good thing to do.
  4. arielsmelody

    arielsmelody Registered User

    Jul 16, 2015
    You haven't said whether the current carer is live in? It is a bit of a grey area, but if she only works for you, she probably employed rather than self-employed. You also haven't said what days/hours she works? She is entitled to breaks and to holiday - what happens when she is off sick? Relying on one carer isn't enough - even if you go through an agency they will probably want to have at least two or three different carers working at different times.
  5. Anney63

    Anney63 Registered User

    Oct 5, 2016
    The carer is shared the other twin who has dementure, Yes she has 2 hours break per day. Thursdays she has from9am to 3pm when ladies are at day care. Not up until 10 am and the ladies are in bed by 8pm. She is Live in . When she is sick I have had to cover. Its fine having different carers but MIL will be in her own home and with her own things and they will be together. Its the bi weekly disruption which bothers me and also where wil lcarer sleep if we get one in for 3 days the whole thing is unacceptable . The relief Holidays are not a problem I have just spent 2 weeks with MIL so carer could have extra time at Christmas she had 3 weeks in the summer. The whole thing is unacceptable .
  6. jenniferpa

    jenniferpa Volunteer Moderator

    Jun 27, 2006
    I'll probably get shot down for this and it's not that I disagree with you over the effect this arrangement (and the need to give the carer breaks) has over your mil and her sister, but u have to say I do not think the carer is being unreasonable with their requests. To be on duty 24/7 (yes I know she has a 2 hour break and 6 hours on Thursday) seems far too much for one person to manage. Unless you can afford to employ 2 carers I do think a care home is the only practical solution. Although I wonder, what will happen to her sister in this situation?

    Sent from my XT1526 using Talking Point mobile app
  7. Slugsta

    Slugsta Registered User

    #7 Slugsta, Jan 11, 2017
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2017
    I'm another who doesn't think the current carer is being totally unreasonable. In fact, if she is working 11 days out of 14 she is probably well over the number of hours she 'should' work (although I admit that I don't know how live-in carers hours are supposed to be worked out).

    The ideal would be to have a team of 3, or more, carers who cover the whole time between them. That would allow your mother to get used to the same people rather than having a total change for 3 days every week. Otherwise, residential care could be the best option.

    Would your MIL's sister want to go into the same place? It sounds unkind to separate them after all these years :(
  8. Anney63

    Anney63 Registered User

    Oct 5, 2016
    This was her choice we wanted to have 2 carers she wanted to do it on her own. i do think asking for six days off every 4 weeks is unreasonable. She gets up at 10 am and they are in bed at 8pm no records have been kept although I have made repeated requests she is just not the same person anymore and certainly is not doing the same job, She is very manipulative and seems to be able to wind the other family round her fingers even to the case of allowing a man in her room. I am always in the wrong because I want things done properly ,the last thing was mums daily log which hasnt been done for ages. What happens if she gets taken to hospital? The only record I have of her day to day wellbeing is an app on my phone which the agency girl completes on her 2 hour break between 2 pm and 4pm otherwise I have absolutely nothing showing how MIL is on a day to day basis which was part of her original employment but because we both employed her and the other family live further away and is a case of out of sight out of mind and things dont bother them I am always wrong.Im tired of it all now and \\i honestly care home is now the only option i have tried so hard for my dead husbands sake but cant do it anymore.
  9. Jessbow

    Jessbow Registered User

    #9 Jessbow, Jan 11, 2017
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2017
    6 days every 4 weeks is hardly unreasonable, although might be different to what she originally agreed.

    if she works pretty much 24/7, when is she suppose to have a life if she cant have friends in her room? ( Are you really horror stuck about her having MEN in her room? )

    You wont get any one carer 24/7/365 .
  10. Kevinl

    Kevinl Registered User

    Aug 24, 2013
    Addressing the question above, in a word, no, in my view.
    I doubt many homes would want to take someone who doesn't want to be there and in order to keep her they would need to get a Deprivation of Liberty Safeguarding Order which would mean you'd have to prove that it was needed.
    Social workers are very keen on keeping people in their own home wherever possible so you may have to convince them a care home was the only safe option not the most convenient one.
    If one of the sisters goes into care what happens to the other one, would they then be living alone?
  11. Chemmy

    Chemmy Registered User

    Nov 7, 2011
    Do both the ladies have dementia?
  12. Tin

    Tin Registered User

    May 18, 2014
    Slightly off subject I know, but in all my residential posts - overnight guests male or female, were not allowed.

    With everything else going on and putting aside hours worked/time off, it sounds like your relationship with the carer is falling apart and maybe the only way to go is to seriously consider the care home she has found.

    Have to say, I would hate to be in your shoes, especially with all the other family members involved. there is nothing '9 to 5' about residential posts.
  13. Anney63

    Anney63 Registered User

    Oct 5, 2016
    Hi Kevin

    no Im not surprised

    We didnt expect a carer 24/7 365 she has holidays no probs. She acyually does less hours than when she started. With the 2 hours she has off she does about 7 to 8 hours she spends quite a lot of time in bedroom watching tv . The problem with her having 3 days off every 2 weeks is that mum will have to go into respite care . With alzheimers she will get totally confused backwards and forwards . If we got an agency in at least she would be in her own home. Apart from respite she could have a covering carer but there is no spare bedroom and the carer in situ has so much stuff in her room you cant move. no one else will sleep in there, So the alternatives are Respite which is a no go because it would unsettle her too much or a complete new agency which she would be unsettled for a while but eventually be ok as she would be in her own home or care.the other family will not agree so no spare room which just leaves care. Ihave o do whats best for her now.
  14. Anney63

    Anney63 Registered User

    Oct 5, 2016
    Can I say we do pay a fantastic rate which is what she wanted
  15. carpe diem

    carpe diem Registered User

    Nov 16, 2011
    Hi, I'm sorry this situation is giving you a lot of stress.
    You say you find it difficult your self to care for your MIL when covering holidays. I'm sure your carer finds it just as difficult and it's never ending, don't you think she's entitled to a life, some weekends and having a relationship. They are pretty basic rights for an average person.
    Most people with dementia have many different carers and in time your MIL will get used to some new faces.
    You could try phoning some agencies and see what help they can offer.
    I hope you don't fall out with any of your family, I'm sure your husband wouldn't want that. I hope you can talk to them and explain you're finding things difficult and ask them if they could find someone to help at weekends. Good luck.
  16. Anney63

    Anney63 Registered User

    Oct 5, 2016
    Hi Tin
    Yes it is a nightmare

    I have tried to come up with a solution to keep the twins together and that would be to get an agency in They could both stay in their home job done. The problem is the other family are not prepared to get rid of the present carer. So that has put us in this situation. We have to cover the 3 days every 2 weeks. There is no spare room for live in cover so it would be respite for 3 days every 2 weeks which will just not do MIL any good at all. Or I put her in a care home and they are split up and the other family make their own arrangements . They just wont work with me so I have to do what I think is right I cant look after her Im 75 . I have done my best for the last 10 years. It seems that im being looked on as an ogre but this women wanted to work on her own and is paid really well. there's is no way she will work with any one else or share her room which is extremely cluttered. So I'm stuck care is now my only option.
  17. Anney63

    Anney63 Registered User

    Oct 5, 2016
    carpe diem

    Thats exactly what I have done. I spent the whole day getting quotes from agencies for live in care. Mailed them over and got told that we seem to be at cross purposes they though I was getting the agency for the 3 days off every two weeks. I cant make them understand we need another bedroom which we havent got. just give up now I will deal with MILS issue and they can sort their mother out I'm on my own they have family to discuss it all with. Ive tried everything to stop them getting split up .
    The current carers room is an absolute mess and the only thing in it owned by us is the TV . So there is yet another problem. Had enough .
  18. Beate

    Beate Registered User

    May 21, 2014
    Can I ask whether you have both finances and health POA and whether you are the only attorney listed on them? Because if so, it really doesn't matter what your family say. You have to act in the donor's best interests
  19. sue38

    sue38 Registered User

    Mar 6, 2007
    Wigan, Lancs
    Can I ask if you're paying tax and NI for the carer, and is she entitled to a work place pension? Whilst I can see that keeping your MIL and her sister in a home setting, and the cost of care (and household outgoings) being shared makes this desirable, this can't be a cheap option.

    The time off doesn't seem unreasonable but I can see this leaves you with a problem if there is nowhere for a replacement carer to sleep in those 3 days. Moving MIL backwards and forwards to respite every other week would be incredibly unsettling.

    From what I understand you're looking to replace this carer with a single carer from an agency. I honestly can't see any carer (agency or not) agreeing to cover all shifts 7 days a week with no time off. The rate of pay might be appealing at the outset but most people need a life as well as money. If MIL was in a care home she would have different carers at different times.

    You say your MIL's twin's family are in favour of employing an agency carer for the 3 days - how do they envisage this will work if there is nowhere for them to sleep?
  20. Tin

    Tin Registered User

    May 18, 2014
    You know I will probably get shot down for saying this, but at some point the twins will be separated, and they both have dementia? are they truly inseparable? How bad is their dementia?

    If mil is self funding then do what you feel right. A DOL's will probably be put in place by the care home, it is common practice these days and it seems that what usually gets the ball rolling is for a resident to continually ask or insist to go home.

    And again shoot me down, but not so sure I could cope with a live in carer, like the one being described here.

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