Help, Dad's dementia is going to kill him and me

[JPG1]

Am puzzled, which is not unusual!

Apparently, it is when he leaves the lounge and heads off to the toilet. If he turns left out of the lounge rather than right then the door he comes to which he knows is his bedroom, the toilet is further along the same corridor.
... ... ...
.

Burf,

If they know that your Dad is turning left rather than right from the lounge en route to the toilet, then that means that someone is watching him. Otherwise they would not have been able to tell you whether he turns left or right .... unless they are watching him.

So why can't they gently and caringly re-direct your Dad in the direction of the toilet, which they by now have worked out he may need.

Otherwise, they wouldn't be watching him, would they?

What is the purpose of their watching your Dad, without being able to help him?

I am finding it difficult to work out how they can stand by and watch your Dad struggle to find his way to the toilet, but not be able to HELP him find his wayto to the toilet.

.

 

[burfordthecat]

If they know that your Dad is turning left rather than right from the lounge en route to the toilet

Hi JPG1

They have not told me that, I have observed dad doing the left rather than right when I have been visiting him when he is heading off for a wee. I (being rather protective), always follow him to the toilet and if he heads off in the wrong direction, I merely say the other way dad, this toilet is closer.

I do know because of the layout of the home, if he turns left out of the lounge, the corridors take him past his bedroom door and then finally to another toilet further along the same corridor.

What is the purpose of their watching your Dad, without being able to help him?

Good point, JPG1. One thing that I have noticed is that the lounge dad choses to sit in, does not always have a staff member present. Don't get me wrong, they are always around but may not see dad heading off towards the toilet.

 

[burfordthecat]

Does this sound normal?

On a bit of a roll tonight - sorry

Most times I go to visit dad, he has not been shaved, has never had his teeth cleaned and sometimes is freezing cold because he does not have the "right clothes on". I know for a fact that he has not had a bath or a shower since he moved to this CH (it is now 4 weeks today). Don't get me wrong, it is not the staff who are not doing their jobs properly, it is dad who is refusing any help what so ever.

So, why is it, when I arrive, I can get dad sorted. I shave him, make sure that he has enough clothes, cut finger nails, clean glasses and just recently asked him to "pass me his teeth" (much to the horror of my 3 year old who then spent the rest of the visit trying to get her teeth out. ) So within 30 mins dad is happy and sorted. I do not mind doing this, because he is my dad and I love him, but I don't visit every day. So what happens when I don't go? Dad's partner visited yesterday and he was freezing cold, even though he had enough clothes on and was even wearing an outdoor fleece. She took him back to his room and sat him infront of the heater until he warmed up. All the time dad was saying "let me drive you back home when I can get the fire going in the lounge and then we will both be warm"..."Get me out of here, I am cold and I want to go home to my fire, where I will be warm" So, so very sad.

 

[jenniferpa]

Burf - does he say he's cold? Or do you detect it my touching him and then asking? I am a bit concerned that they don't seem to be able to "manage" him. My mother would tend to refuse help, but could be persuaded with the appropriate handling, and this seems to be the case with your father. It didn't even (with my mother) require any duplicity just a "matter of fact" approach - it's time for your shower etc. Does he have a primary care worker? And if so, perhaps you could involve her/hom when you get him to do whatever needs to be done. Perhaps your father (who seems a fairly unique person) needs different handling than most and they simply don't grasp how to do it. If they watched you, maybe they'd pick up a few tricks.

 

[TinaT]

And I have the opposite situation to being cold. It is so hot in Ken's care home that I sometimes think I'm going to faint! This has a 'knock on effect' as when I bring him home, he has got so used to the overheating that I have to have the central heating on full. Even on the one or two mild days we have had recently I have to put a thick coat on him if we are to sit out for ten minutes or so.

There has been some research where strips of one colour on the floor or wall leading from the hallway to the toilet had a very good response.

Regarding the lighting which only comes on once the person has entered the toilet (how daft is that) I think I can go one better. In the completely refurbished assessment ward my husband was on, the bedroom he was sharing had an en suite wet room with shower and toilet. The shower had a sensor device which switched it on when anyone walked under it!!! For goodness sake - where is the common sense of these planners????
xxTinaT

 

[gigi]

Hello again Burf..

I posted earlier...

As well as the regular toileting..if carers see dad up and on the move can they not direct him to a bathroom...just in case?

In light of what you've just said....

Most times I go to visit dad, he has not been shaved, has never had his teeth cleaned and sometimes is freezing cold because he does not have the "right clothes on". I

...I'd be asking questions.

Good advice from Jennifer...

Does he have a primary care worker? And if so, perhaps you could involve her/hom when you get him to do whatever needs to be done. Perhaps your father (who seems a fairly unique person) needs different handling than most and they simply don't grasp how to do it. If they watched you, maybe they'd pick up a few tricks.

Love xx

 

[burfordthecat]

Burf - does he say he's cold? Or do you detect it my touching him and then asking? I am a bit concerned that they don't seem to be able to "manage" him.

Hi Jennifer

No. dad is actually cold to the touch. Which I do find surprising because the CH is always warm but not "stuffy". This was something which he complained about whilst living on his own, he was always "cold" even though he had many, many layers of clothes on and was sitting almost on top of a very hot Rayburn.

Made me smile, your reference to dad being unique. That's one word for it, I think more that he is just so strong willed and stubborn. He has said to many people that I am a very nice daughter, but I can be so stubborn....where do you think that I get that from?

 

[lesmisralbles]

Hi Burf

Ron is alway's cold to the touch
But, in bed, warm as toast. Feet and hand's
Circulation.
As you get older the heart does not pump as it should.
So, feet and hand's become cold. Extremities
Do not worry

Barb X & Ron ZZZZZ

 

[burfordthecat]

Long chat with the CH today

Hi

Despite still feeling "under the weather" I felt as though I had to visit dad today. It started well, as dad had been shaved today. Things improved further when I entered his room to see that the shaver point and light above the sink had finally be replaced and was now working. Lucky timing for the CH, this was going to be my first complaint.

Whilst I was in dad's room I decided to ask what he was doing if he needed a wee in the night. Well, he looked at me and said, "I use the sink, in the corner...but don't worry, I make sure that I always run the taps afterwards. I asked him if he would like me to get him a bottle for use during the night. He seemed very happy with the idea, so we will see how things go tonight.

I had a long chat with the assistant manager today about dad's weeing problem. We agreed that staff would try and toilet him regularly during the day and also prompt him if he was on walkabout if he needed the toilet. She is also going to make sure that some toilet direction signs are put up. I have also stated that I did not want dad's room to be locked as I felt that this was not helpful.

Whilst we were chatting I asked about dad not allowing help with any personal care. Apparently, dad is offered a bath each week but has always declined. The staff are not allowed to enforce a bath, as that would be classed as abuse. I am thinking that I may get him to take a bath during one of my visits. Not ideal, but I think that I would rather him take a bath, with me helping rather than none at all. I am just hoping in time that he will become more accepting of staff members dealing with him.

 

[Grannie G]

Burford................

You are doing well.

 

[JPG1]

I decided to ask what he was doing if he needed a wee in the night. Well, he looked at me and said, "I use the sink, in the corner...but don't worry, I make sure that I always run the taps afterwards.

Burf,

If I may ask, what was your Dad's profession when he was still in work and earning a crust?

I am intrigued by the way he described to you what he does if he needs a night-time wee.

I will explain eventually. But it is interesting.

.

 

[jenniferpa]

Yes you are doing well Burf. I think it might help if you did persuade him to have a bath during a visit to get him used to the concept. Mind you, while I understand the logistics of the once a week bath (and that's probably what most of us grew up with) I'm not entirely sure that I'd be happy that they aren't offering showers, say, more frequently. When you think about incontinence issues and cleanliness once a week doesn't really seem to be enough. My mother's home showered her every other day at minimum (and sometimes everyday if she'd cooperate). I'm not saying she was always cheery about it, but a matter of fact approach "yes this is the shower, and yes you need it" went a long way. I'd really like to know how they are asking him. We all know there's a big difference between asking "would you like a bath" and "this is the bath and now you're going to get into it".

 

[burfordthecat]

Burf,

If I may ask, what was your Dad's profession when he was still in work and earning a crust?

I am intrigued by the way he described to you what he does if he needs a night-time wee.

I will explain eventually. But it is interesting.

.

JPG1

Now you have spiked my curiosity. Oh course you can ask about my dad's profession. He was a initially a bricklayer but then ran his own small building firm up until he retired. My dad was such a hard worker, as a bricklayer, he needed to two labourers just to keep him supplied with materials.

 

[burfordthecat]

I'd really like to know how they are asking him. We all know there's a big difference between asking "would you like a bath" and "this is the bath and now you're going to get into it".

Hi Jennifer

I had the exact same question to the CH today. They have said to me that they have to give the person "the choice" and if they just said "it's bath time for you, get into it" that could be classed as abuse because they are not giving them the choice. So, does that mean if I "make" dad to take a bath, I am abusing him

Whilst I agree that showers and baths would be the best solution, at the moment, one bath a week is better than nothing at all (provided that I can convince dad to venture in) I believe all of this bathing issue has become a problem since dad had leg ulcers and was in bandage for months on end and as such no bath. Since that, he never seems to have gone back to having baths.

 

[Grannie G]

It`s a bit ridiculous isn`t it.
I`m sue they don`t phrase the question in the same way when they take them to the toilet .

 

[jenniferpa]

They have said to me that they have to give the person "the choice" and if they just said "it's bath time for you, get into it" that could be classed as abuse because they are not giving them the choice. So, does that mean if I "make" dad to take a bath, I am abusing him

Oh please, give me strength. What about suggesting a different choice - "do you want to use this bathroom or that one" or "do you want to wear this shirt after your bath or that one". I won't suggest "do you want to have your bath now or later" because that's just storing up trouble. Some people just don't get it.

 

[JPG1]

Well, Burf, you have just blown my theory ... almost, but not quite.

I was wondering whether your Dad might have worked away from home, sometimes if not always.

Many people who ‘travelled’ in their younger working years found themselves “overnighting” in some grotty hotel, long before the ‘en-suite’ loo, then shower, and long before, if you were very very lucky, a bathroom became part of your grotty hotel room booking. It was a long trek to the nearest toilet.

So you just had to “make do” with whatever facilities came your way. And, if that was a wash basin in the room that you had booked, and if you were there at 3 am and in need, then you just did what you had to do. And doing what your Dad described, “I always run the taps afterwards”. Sounded perfectly sensible to me!!!

So .... knowing now that your Dad was a bricklayer, thinking goes now along the lines of, your Dad may have been ‘bricklaying’ at the time, but in need of ... ... ... . And like many good persons, availed himself of the available facilities!! Which may have been a ... whatever then.

Old memories linger.

So just a thought.

.

 

[burfordthecat]

Oh please, give me strength. What about suggesting a different choice - "do you want to use this bathroom or that one" or "do you want to wear this shirt after your bath or that one". I won't suggest "do you want to have your bath now or later" because that's just storing up trouble. Some people just don't get it.

Hi Jennifer

Like your style. Had not thought of the option of clothes or venue. I will talk to the CH.

Just out of interest, if it is on his care plan that "dad does not have mental capacity" then the CH will do what ever I ask of them. I know that dad's SW had deemed him not to have mental capacity to decide where he should live, but I am not sure that it extends to "personal care" issues. This whole Mental Capacity Act seems to be so confusing and some times, not really helpful at all.

 

[Heather777]

Mental Capacity

Hi I am not even sure what mental capacity means and I am sure that it is just a phrase used by SW's when it suits. My dad messes himself and wets the bed. When I went into see him today he was wet in the bed with the clothes that he had on from the day before However, as he didn't want to get dressed they left him in bed. They said that they kept popping in to ask him what he wanted to do, surely that is abusive leaving him like that??? Yet they say he doesn't have capacity to decide where to live, his medication, for his finances how on earth does he have the capacity to decide to lay in that mess???

How on earth are you supposed to know what to complain about when they change the goal posts to suit themselves?

Heather

 

[burfordthecat]

When I went into see him today he was wet in the bed with the clothes that he had on from the day before However, as he didn't want to get dressed they left him in bed

Hi Heather

Sorry that you seem to be having such a hard time of it. No, being wet in the bed is not acceptable. Regardless of your dad's wishes, the staff should have made sure that he was dry, clean and that the bed was also dry. If it was me, I would have insisted that the staff got it sorted.

Is your dad compliant or is he in denial, as my dad is?

Hoping things get easier for you