• All threads and posts regarding Coronavirus COVID-19 can be found in our area specifically for Coronavirus COVID-19 discussion.

    You can directly access this area >here<.

Have had to make a tough decision

lensgirl

Registered User
Jan 14, 2020
49
hi

Apologies for the ridiculously long post!

Since nans alzheimers started becoming noticeable and while we were waiting for the results, nan started getting verbally aggressive and i was the one it was always aimed at. Other family members were luckily not treated the same way, and she could be vile to me in one breath and nice as pie to them literally in the next.

We are currently in the process of selling her property and moving her to a retirement place where she will be a lot safer. I spoke to her yesterday at 8am and she was perfectly fine, but i did mention that I needed her bank card details to give the solicitors for the searches.

By 11am I had a phone call telling me she wasn't moving and she hung the phone up on me. About 5 minutes after that I got a phone call from a worried taxi driver about a job he had just done with my nan. Luckily his wife works with people with dementia and he knew straight away something wasn't right and was clever enough to manage to get my number off her mobile.

Anyway, in this taxi ride she is saying that I have told her a huge lie and she isnt moving anymore, and also that she was going to the bank to draw out £2000 which first was for me and then was for someone coming around later that afternoon.

Obviously that was a concern so my sister drove an hour with 2 babies to go and see what on earth is going on. She said nan was quite dishevelled and that her eyes didn't look right (she started meds this week, has anyone known of a worsening after taking them?), but that basically nan found an old letter from either the memory nurse or the hospital where I had mentioned that she has let people into her home. This has now culminated in her mind that I am telling people she is "mentally retarded" and taking her money, so she doesnt want me acting on her behalf with the move.

She also called both sets of estate agents, and the purchasing agent is now starting to get concerned that nan isn't well enough to live there.

I have decided that I now need to back away because I cant have anyone even have a tiny thought in their heads that I would possibly take anything from her, so I am going to look at removing myself from the POA and I also want her to remove me from her will.

I feel bad that my sister is going to have to deal with this on her own, but i have told her I will support her in the background with whatever she needs, but i will no longer be visiting or calling nan.

I know people say "oh its just the illness" but this is just the beginning of her journey and it is going to get a whole lot worse, and i just can't mentally put myself through that.
 

margherita

Registered User
May 30, 2017
2,567
Italy, Milan and Acqui Terme
Hi @lensgirl ,
I would suggest you support your sister in the background, as you say you will, and wait for your nan's reactions to your not visiting and calling her any longer. She might also calm down...or not take notice of your new behaviour...or miss you.
Who knows. Dementia is so unpredictable.
I would neither remove myself from the POA nor ask your nan to remove you from her will.
The POA might be useful when her dementia worsens and in case you should help your sister with managing your nan.
Re your nan's will, your being removed from it may result in economic damage to you, only because you took offence of the whims and suspects of a demented old lady.
Is it worth it?
 
Last edited:

lensgirl

Registered User
Jan 14, 2020
49
Hi

I dont care about any loss I might have by not being in her will, I do not want there to be any reason, confusion, questions, doubts about my integrity. I dont want people thinking "there's no smoke without fire". I will absolutely support my sister but I dont feel that I can have any sort of relationship with my nan, certainly for the foreseeable future.
 

Grannie G

Volunteer Moderator
Apr 3, 2006
71,933
Kent
Hello @lensgirl

You are upset, hurt and angry but please don`t do anything in haste, just sit tight, take a deep breath and try to realise this is what dementia is and what dementia does.

I think anyone on this forum would be able to tell you tales of equal hurt, I know I could, but this is not your nan as she was, it is your nan with dementia and she can not be held accountable for what she says and what she does.

It`s the hardest lesson of all, to take the abuse and know if your nan was her own self she would be horrified by her behaviour.

You are right to have stepped back while still supporting your sister but believe me, tomorrow it could be your sister on the receiving end of the same behaviour you have experienced.

It is possible your nan won`t even be able to change her will. She may be considered not to have capacity.
 

Hazara8

Registered User
Apr 6, 2015
534
Hi

I dont care about any loss I might have by not being in her will, I do not want there to be any reason, confusion, questions, doubts about my integrity. I dont want people thinking "there's no smoke without fire". I will absolutely support my sister but I dont feel that I can have any sort of relationship with my nan, certainly for the foreseeable future.
Dementia conjures up all manner of distorted behaviour and indeed wordage. Try not to concern yourself about what others might " think " in respect of your anxieties described. You know the facts. Allow the transition into the " retirement place" to take place and assess as things progress. Alzheimer's is one of the most demanding challenges in terms of both Care and relationships and one needs to take a long deep breath and not allow it to compel you into something which might prove to be the subject of deep regret.

With good wishes.
 

Sarasa

Registered User
Apr 13, 2018
1,824
Hi @lensgirl, I think you've made a wise decision to step back for a while. My mother could switch in seconds between being nice and horrible to me.
I am wondering if the retirement place will really suit your nan's needs. My mum agreed to sell her flat and move to my brother's town two years ago. At the time I thought she needed more than the retirement places he had in mind, but as he was dead set on the idea I went along with it. After viewing several places mum agreed to move to an extra care flat in a small complex. I was still very uncertain, but at least it made mum keen to move. By the time we had a buyer for her flat at Easter last year two things had happened. My brother was seriously ill so wouldn't be able to do anything if she moved near him and mum's dementia had progressed so that he could see a care home was a more sensible option. Mum is now in a care home near me. I told her it was a temporary move while we got the flat sorted out near my brother, but in reality it is a permeant move.
Good luck with whatever you decide, but your nan is the best she is going to be today, and if the residential place have doubts now, you might find she is asked to move very shortly after moving in.
 

canary

Registered User
Feb 25, 2014
13,632
South coast
I had a similar problem with mum. She was accusing me of stealing from her and abusing her which was very upsetting, especially as my invisible brother didnt want to know so there was only me.

Yes, step back for a while, but dont do anything about the POA or the will.

Once mum moved into a care home all the paranoia went and she regained her old personality (although obviously not her memory!) so we became mother and daughter again and I was able to take her out for little trips too. I have some good memories of those times. Your mums present delusions are unlikely to be there forever.
 

DILhelp

Registered User
Jan 31, 2016
118
London
hi

Apologies for the ridiculously long post!

Since nans alzheimers started becoming noticeable and while we were waiting for the results, nan started getting verbally aggressive and i was the one it was always aimed at. Other family members were luckily not treated the same way, and she could be vile to me in one breath and nice as pie to them literally in the next.

We are currently in the process of selling her property and moving her to a retirement place where she will be a lot safer. I spoke to her yesterday at 8am and she was perfectly fine, but i did mention that I needed her bank card details to give the solicitors for the searches.

By 11am I had a phone call telling me she wasn't moving and she hung the phone up on me. About 5 minutes after that I got a phone call from a worried taxi driver about a job he had just done with my nan. Luckily his wife works with people with dementia and he knew straight away something wasn't right and was clever enough to manage to get my number off her mobile.

Anyway, in this taxi ride she is saying that I have told her a huge lie and she isnt moving anymore, and also that she was going to the bank to draw out £2000 which first was for me and then was for someone coming around later that afternoon.

Obviously that was a concern so my sister drove an hour with 2 babies to go and see what on earth is going on. She said nan was quite dishevelled and that her eyes didn't look right (she started meds this week, has anyone known of a worsening after taking them?), but that basically nan found an old letter from either the memory nurse or the hospital where I had mentioned that she has let people into her home. This has now culminated in her mind that I am telling people she is "mentally retarded" and taking her money, so she doesnt want me acting on her behalf with the move.

She also called both sets of estate agents, and the purchasing agent is now starting to get concerned that nan isn't well enough to live there.

I have decided that I now need to back away because I cant have anyone even have a tiny thought in their heads that I would possibly take anything from her, so I am going to look at removing myself from the POA and I also want her to remove me from her will.

I feel bad that my sister is going to have to deal with this on her own, but i have told her I will support her in the background with whatever she needs, but i will no longer be visiting or calling nan.

I know people say "oh its just the illness" but this is just the beginning of her journey and it is going to get a whole lot worse, and i just can't mentally put myself through that.
I am so sorry for all that you are going through. Dementia is a cruel disease. I am normally at the brunt of most outbursts from my 80yr MIL who I live with. When hubby is in the house I try to keep myself occupied with other things. She is in late stages but it doesn't seem to help me because I still go off quietly and have a good cry. Not sure how long I can cope with this but have therapy starting monday.
I'm sending you my prayers. I'm sorry you have to go through this xx
 

Louise7

Registered User
Mar 25, 2016
2,461
She said nan was quite dishevelled and that her eyes didn't look right (she started meds this week, has anyone known of a worsening after taking them?)
What meds has your nan started taking? Medication can sometimes take a while to start to work but if you are concerned about adverse side effects speak to her doctor.
 

lensgirl

Registered User
Jan 14, 2020
49
I am so sorry for all that you are going through. Dementia is a cruel disease. I am normally at the brunt of most outbursts from my 80yr MIL who I live with. When hubby is in the house I try to keep myself occupied with other things. She is in late stages but it doesn't seem to help me because I still go off quietly and have a good cry. Not sure how long I can cope with this but have therapy starting monday.
I'm sending you my prayers. I'm sorry you have to go through this xx
I really feel for you in that situation. We lived with my nan for a couple of months whilst we were moving houses, and after 3 months we had to move into rented because I just couldn't take it anymore
 

lensgirl

Registered User
Jan 14, 2020
49
What meds has your nan started taking? Medication can sometimes take a while to start to work but if you are concerned about adverse side effects speak to her doctor.
She has started on Donepizil, i dont know if its anything to do with them but my sister was really shocked at nans appearance as she is usually so meticulous and couldn't really describe to me what her eyes were doing just that they didn't look right
 

Bod

Registered User
Aug 30, 2013
1,335
Lensgirl, as others have said, do nothing regarding the POA, it will come in useful later. Again with the Will, do nothing, as mother has clearly lost capacity, then changing the will could not be done, however if at the time, you can make a "Deed of variation" in which your inheritance can be transfered to others.
Be aware both you and your sister, that mothers attuide to you, could be transfered to your sister, and likewise the goodness could come your way!
Find out exactly what behaviour the Retirement place will not tolerate, and would lead to her being evicted.
Also start looking for a Care home placement for her, in a place that can handle all aspects of Dementia. Some only want the easy early stages, and cannot manage the later more difficult stages.
Good on you for supporting your sister, she'll need it.

Bod.
 

lemonbalm

Registered User
May 21, 2018
678
I'm sorry you are going through this @lensgirl but I agree that you should do nothing regarding the POA or will. It's best to never knee jerk with dementia. My mum can one day be screaming at me, trying to hit or scratch me, calling me a traitor, that she hates me, that I am a wicked child and that I should die. Literally, in the next day or two she can think I am lovely. As others have said, step back for a while, support your sister and wait for the next phase. It could be a stage in the dementia, a need for a change in medication, a UTI (worth checking out,as they are the devil's invention when it comes to dementia) or just a bad patch. I agree with @Bod that you and your sister should probably be putting feelers out for care homes at this point. Keep posting for support from the forum.
 

canary

Registered User
Feb 25, 2014
13,632
South coast
She has started on Donepizil,
Donepezil can sometimes increase aggression, so keep a watch out for that, but aggression doesnt seem to describe what you are seeing with your mum - it seems like more of an increase in confusion (and I think this has been going on for a while before she started taking donepezil), which is more likely to be due to progression of the dementia.
 

Bunpoots

Volunteer Host
Apr 1, 2016
4,848
Nottinghamshire
My dad had problems with Donepezil @lensgirl

In his case it was the increase from 5mg to 10mg which made his behaviour unmanageable and he could flip from nice to vile in seconds. My daughter got the brunt of his vileness but he couldn’t remember any of it and once his dosage was reduced back to 5mg he was fine again.

sadly this broke his relationship with his granddaughter who he loved very much. She never trusted him again and was always on the alert for the next attack. I’m sure she understands exactly how you feel.
 

DILhelp

Registered User
Jan 31, 2016
118
London
I really feel for you in that situation. We lived with my nan for a couple of months whilst we were moving houses, and after 3 months we had to move into rented because I just couldn't take it anymore
We have been in this situation for at least 5yrs since we have been married. I think I will need to take a career break from my paid job, mentally I feel I have lost it. I feel I have lost my life. When me and hubby talk to each other MIL cannot tolerate and starts to shout at me. I know it's her condition. But its very hard. God bless us all to get through this xx
 

Rosettastone57

Registered User
Oct 27, 2016
1,372
Hi

I dont care about any loss I might have by not being in her will, I do not want there to be any reason, confusion, questions, doubts about my integrity. I dont want people thinking "there's no smoke without fire". I will absolutely support my sister but I dont feel that I can have any sort of relationship with my nan, certainly for the foreseeable future.
These sort of accusations , nastiness and verbal abuse from a person with dementia is normal. As others have said, I would do nothing about the POA or the will. The POA may be a vital tool you may need in the future and as to the will, it may be that your nan doesn't have the capacity to make another will. I think that your nan would probably be better in a care home where she would have 24/7 supervision , just a thought. It doesn't matter what others think, you really know what is going on , easy for me to say, I know. My mother in law was always telling others how awful family were, some believed her , others didn't. She often said how lovely we all were, one day, then would shout and scream at us, when things weren't going her way. I developed an invisible coat of armour every time I had dealings with her , it was the only way to keep myself from reacting to her abuse.
 

MrsChristmas

Registered User
Jun 1, 2015
178
Hello @lensgirl

You are upset, hurt and angry but please don`t do anything in haste, just sit tight, take a deep breath and try to realise this is what dementia is and what dementia does.

I think anyone on this forum would be able to tell you tales of equal hurt, I know I could, but this is not your nan as she was, it is your nan with dementia and she can not be held accountable for what she says and what she does.

It`s the hardest lesson of all, to take the abuse and know if your nan was her own self she would be horrified by her behaviour.

You are right to have stepped back while still supporting your sister but believe me, tomorrow it could be your sister on the receiving end of the same behaviour you have experienced.

It is possible your nan won`t even be able to change her will. She may be considered not to have capacity.
Hi there


I agree with the sage advice given here...this is the dementia talking, not your NaN as you remember her. This is a cruel, brutal disease that robs sufferers in the most awful ways.

please don’t take it personally it really isn’t directed at you. All your Nan is seeing is her house being sold but she probably doesn’t know why...this caused her to react. I would guess your Nan is feeling she’s losing in independence? Especially if she has a,ways been independent.

It was the same with my Mum when I tried to get her to see her GP for a diagnosis, she found out that I’d been contacting her GP Surgery for help and advice, her reaction was exclude me completely from her GP. I found that incredibly hurtful because all was doing was trying to help. But seeing it from her perspective I think I would be annoyed too.

I’ve learnt the hard way with Mum since she started in symptoms in 2015 is to speak to her first about anything I planned to do for her and if it’s a ‘no’ just to accept it. I found my brother (who saw Mum rarely) was better at handling our Mum because he was more emotionally detached.

Its a chicken and egg situation - if your Nan has capacity then she can make her own decisions rightly or wrongly but it’s getting the diagnosis of incapacity which gives the family permission to help the sufferer to make decisions.

I do know how you feel you want to help and you can see needs to be done but it has to be your Nans decision if she is deemed to have capacity.

Frustrating I know.
 

lensgirl

Registered User
Jan 14, 2020
49
Nan is very up for the move, we have never forced her but certainly guided her into going to somewhere secure but where she can live independently. She doesnt like the lack of control though as far as the solicitors goes, which is obviously how they work! I have given my sister all the paperwork including the POA and i have decided that i won't remove myself from anything, as she has asked me to give it some time. Nan called my mum today thinking it was me and she played along, however I have asked her not to do that again.

At the moment I dont want to have any contact with her, and I'm just going to back away and be quietly supportive of my sister in the background.