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Follow on from Dostburys question about losing ones home

Discussion in 'I have a partner with dementia' started by Jean1234, Oct 18, 2015.

  1. Jean1234

    Jean1234 Registered User

    Mar 19, 2015
    257
    Reading all the posts about safeguarding your half of the home once ones OH goes into care, I have a further question. It was mentioned about the patients savings not being over £14.000 and then a sliding scale. Can someone tell me what happens if the spouse has savings of their own separately? Does that get added on to the patients? Or is that money safe? Would be grateful if someone can tell me. Thanks
     
  2. Saffie

    Saffie Registered User

    Mar 26, 2011
    22,499
    Female
    Near Southampton
    Rest assured the spouse's money shouldn't be included in any assessment.
    The sliding scale is from £23,250 downwards to the £14,250, after which it stops and that amount is able, in theory, to be retained by the person it belongs to.
     
  3. Scarlett123

    Scarlett123 Registered User

    Apr 30, 2013
    3,802
    Essex
    That money is cast iron guaranteed safe! As I've mentioned before, when I was visited by the Finance Administrator, from the Council, who asked, casually, about my savings and income, and called me "love", I said:

    Actually, Eric, you don't need to know any of my information, do you, Eric, because it's my husband who's going into Residential Care, Eric, and not me. Eric.

    He waffled away about only asking, in case I qualified for Pension Credit, but I'd been forewarned. ;). If the potential Care Home Resident has over approx £23,5000, then they're self funding, between about £14,000 and £23,500 there's a sliding scale, and below £14,000 there's nothing to pay - but if they're not self funding, they lose their SRP and half of their private pension.
     
  4. jenniferpa

    jenniferpa Volunteer Moderator

    Jun 27, 2006
    39,438
    Can I just clarify about the

    bit: it just that there isn't a sliding scale (tariff income) on savings under £14250. They are still going to have to pay over their state pension plus half of their occupational pension (if their is a spouse) less their personal expense allowance even when they reach the lower boundary. I know you, Scarlett, know this, but I just wanted to make sure that anyone reading this subsequently gets the right end of the stick. :)
     
  5. pamann

    pamann Registered User

    Oct 28, 2013
    2,635
    Kent
    Hello Jean l am just going through financial assessment for my hubby, they take all his state pension, and half of his 3 private pensions, l have to top up £60 per week, they did not ask me if l had any savings. Hubby is below the lower limet, hope this reasures you. Pamann ☺
     
  6. sleepless

    sleepless Registered User

    Feb 19, 2010
    3,223
    Female
    The Sweet North
    The top up seems so unfair, pamann.
    They let you have half his private pensions, then take some of it off you?
     
  7. Chuggalug

    Chuggalug Registered User

    Mar 24, 2014
    8,007
    Norfolk
    Just be warned: My husband gets a single man's pension. It was rated by our LA as £188 per week. It's well below that. I have to cough up an extra £140 per month out of my meagre income, or else the bill wouldn't get paid, and I'm always two months in debt, which can't be avoided.

    No solution found for this after almost five months. We have no savings whatsoever. My income is made up of basic ESA and basic PIP. I can't afford to pay hubby's pocket money out of our current income, and it's all I can do to afford to visit him.

    The savings tariff didn't even come into how we were charged.
     
  8. Pickles53

    Pickles53 Registered User

    Feb 25, 2014
    2,475
    Radcliffe on Trent
    Pamann, you probably know this but just in case (and for others reading this thread).....the requirement for top-up fees is based on the assumption that there is no suitable home which can meet all the person's assessed needs which costs no more than the usual LA rate in your area. In other words, it is the family's choice of a more expensive home or larger room or sea view or whatever which results in the extra cost.

    If the LA cannot offer a suitable place at their 'usual' rate then top-ups should not apply and the LA must meet the full cost.

    See sections 8 and 9 of the guidance, specifically paragraph 8.37, and Annex A. 8.37 specifically states that the LA must offer at least one option which is within the person's personal budget and should ensure that there is more than one. (Personal budget is the amount allocated by the LA to meet the individual's needs.). Paragraph 12 of Annex A says clearly that the LA must adjust the budget if there is no suitable accommodation available.

    You should not agree to pay a top-up of any amount if no suitable home has been offered where top-ups would not be needed.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/upload...e_Act_Book.pdf
     
  9. jikkie

    jikkie Registered User

    Aug 23, 2015
    64
    "Just be warned: My husband gets a single man's pension. It was rated by our LA as £188 per week. It's well below that. I have to cough up an extra £140 per month out of my meagre income, or else the bill wouldn't get paid, and I'm always two months in debt, which can't be avoided."

    How can they get away with assessing a pension as being more than it actually is?
     
  10. Chuggalug

    Chuggalug Registered User

    Mar 24, 2014
    8,007
    Norfolk
    Because the assessment was done while hubby's benefits were in the middle of being taken away! I asked for a reassessment and got ignored. Phoned various charities, got nowhere.

    I do have one more thing up my sleeve to try, but it won't be a money-spinner for anyone. It'll be a way of saying, there ain't any more than "this amount" now. I'm just waiting for one of my claims to fail before making the next move. Which will mean me moving out and leaving only his income coming in. Maybe then, someone will listen and take a bit more notice.
     
  11. canary

    canary Registered User

    Feb 25, 2014
    10,795
    Female
    South coast
    Chuggs, thats dreadful that you have got to that stage. I am aghast reading it.
     
  12. Chuggalug

    Chuggalug Registered User

    Mar 24, 2014
    8,007
    Norfolk
    Just made yet another phone call to see if I'm allowed to negotiate a monthly payment while I'm waiting for ESA to finally get a move on and get paid, or fail. If it fails, then, that's it. I don't know what I'm allowed to do yet. If no advice comes, then I'll just make the sacrifice I promised on my wedding day. Everything I have is his, as vowed.

    I did tell the LA we needed reassessment but got ignored, Canary. They won't ignore me if there's no more than his pension coming in each month, now, will they!
     
  13. Tiller Girl

    Tiller Girl Registered User

    May 14, 2012
    91
    So if you know your OH has dementia is it best to reduce their savings ? Do you only get asked how much they have ?
     
  14. Pickles53

    Pickles53 Registered User

    Feb 25, 2014
    2,475
    Radcliffe on Trent
    It is only the income and savings of the person needing care that are counted. Joint accounts are split 50/50. If you are looking for LA financial support, they will ask for bank statements going back some way and would query any dramatic recent changes (eg converting a joint account to one person's or transferring savings to someone else). Essentially you are not allowed to move money around in a deliberate attempt to avoid/reduce how much the cared-for person pays. This is usually referred to as deprivation of assets.

    If you mean reducing assets by spending on things the person might themselves need, it shouldn't be a problem, but buying expensive items/gifts which are not part of the normal pattern of expenditure could well be queried.
     
  15. esmeralda

    esmeralda Registered User

    Nov 27, 2014
    3,072
    Devon
    You have to be very careful Tiller Girl as they will look at past bank statements and it may be seen that you are depriving yourself of capital if your OH reduces his savings. Your OH can spend money on essential expenditure - maybe disabled adaptations or work that needs to be done on the house.

    I don't know if LA's differ regarding spouse's assets. They cannot touch your capital, but when we had a financial assessment they wanted details of income and capital for both of us. I thought perhaps this was to see if my OH had transferred capital to me to avoid charges. The person who did the assessment said however that they assessed both parties because they would then base their decision on the income/capital of whichever partner had the least financial resources. I haven't heard anyone else say this however so it may be peculiar to our own LA.
     
  16. Scarlett123

    Scarlett123 Registered User

    Apr 30, 2013
    3,802
    Essex
    Sorry, you're quite right, and I haven't clarified it. Though I said "if you're not self funding you don't pay anything, but lose your SRP and half your private pension", I've contradicted myself. As my grandchildren would say "my bad". :eek:

    I should have said, as you did, that if you have less than £14250, then, regardless of the care home's charges, you lose your SRP, half your private pension(if you get one), Attendance Allowance (if you get one) less about £25 "pocket money".

    Sorry again, if my post was misleading. :)
     

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