Essex County Council S117 cuts

Relm

Registered User
Jan 24, 2011
49
I think you are underestimating how I'll someone has to be to be sectioned. There is absolutely no way my mum would have been able to attend anywhere voluntarily. She was psychotic and thought that everyone she encountered was trying to murder her. I cannot explain to you how at risk she was but also how at risk I was as her carer. She was violent and psychotic and my life was in danger. Sectioning is taken very very seriously as you are depriving someone of their liberty.
When I said "voluntarily" I did not mean they could go along on their own. My mum lives in her own home and has lost a lot of mental capacity and has frequent quasi-psychotic episodes. She refuses all help and all treatment and has no professional carers, she administers all her meds herself which inevitably goes wrong. This means the only outside help she gets is when members of the family or neighbours rush round most days in an emergency but she often insists they go away because she doesn't want any help.

With enough careful persuasion from various trusted friends and professionals it may be possible to get my mum to accept the need for an assessment. That is what I mean by have an assessment "voluntarily".

In my mum's case her circumstances get bad almost every day, so if she refuses all the cajoling and encouragement then the CPN and the Old Age Psychiatrist may have to section her to assess her. After she has been sectioned, it seems that S117 would pay for her nursing home care but not if she accepted all the advice she had been given to be assessed. That is a huge difference.

For people who don't have dementia, I believe there are various other rights a person has if they are sectioned compared to another another person who chooses to be admitted to a mental hospital. On the other hand I believe a sectioned person can't refuse treatments in the way a voluntary person can.

I'm open to more information about this process as I am still learning about it.
 
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Jesskle66

Registered User
Jul 5, 2014
99
Relm, your mum would only be eligible for s117 aftercare if she is put under section 3. When taken into hospital initially (and I hope for all your sakes that doesn't happen) she would be placed under section 2 for 28 days. Only if that is converted to section 3 would s117 be applicable after she leaves psychiatric hospital. Section 3 is again only applied if very strict medical criteria are met. It seems more common for DoLs to be applied for after section 2 and that may be because that 'loophole' means that s117 aftercare is not then available.
My mum was incapable of accepting any 'advice'. To be placed under section means that you are too ill 24 HOURS A DAY, 7 DAYS A WEEK to have any chance of treatment unless you are in hospital. Medical treatment is usually covert and there is no chance that the patient can be 'advized' to take it. I wish I could convey the hell of having your loved one being ill enough to be placed under section and the emotional, mental and physical trauma it was for me. For her I can only imagine the terrifying experience it was. Perhaps you could visit your local psychiatric hospital if you think it would be worth it to get s117 aftercare.
 

Jesskle66

Registered User
Jul 5, 2014
99
There would need to be 2 psychiatrists and one other appointed mental health professional to section your mum at an assessment together. They all have to agree that sectioning is the only possible way to assess her condition.Mum was only sectioned after her repeated phone calls to the police and a suicide attempt. She had also been physically violent towards me and told the police she was going to kill me and burn my house down. My daughter has been left with lasting psychological issues following what happened as have I. I would rather pay every penny I have to have prevented it. My mum was beyond any intervention than sectioning.
 

Kevinl

Registered User
Aug 24, 2013
4,774
Salford
The real question isn't why section 117 funding exists, it why people who qualify for CHC are being denied it and the spurious grounds on which it's being done.
My wife is still "in the care of the state" as they've decided she can never be left unsupervised as she is a danger to herself and others.
If the state want to detain you, like sending someone to prison they can hardly ask you to pay and means test it.
K
 

Jesskle66

Registered User
Jul 5, 2014
99
I realise I have been rather emotional in my responses and am not being terribly positive or supportive. We are all sufferers in the way that dementia affects not only our loved ones but ourselves. I apologise for not being open to the valid points that were being made.