EPA - yes, again!

[jenniferpa]

I live my life in a barely supressed state of panic, so no change there.

On another note, I called the EPA help line and was told to put my state where the county is and the zip code in the post code box. Also, that even though I am the attorney for what appears to be this phantom EPA I put my name down in Part 7 (notice to relatives) as well as every one else.

 

[Skye]

It's good that there's no problem about registering from abroad. Very strange though, that you have to be notified that you have registered POA!

 

[Skye]

I've been registered for ages, but haven't had to use it till this year. Previously, I could write John's signature and he could copy it. This year, he can't even do that, the letters are just meaningless squiggles to him.

I would advise getting it registered, particularly as David doesn't mind you taking over. It's one thing less to worry about.

Jan, woke up in the middle of the night thinking I might have given you wrong information!

Here in Scotland, it seems to be the practice for the POA to be registered immediately, but for the solicitor to keep it until it's needed. John continued to sign himself for as long as he could.

I believe the situation is different in England, and once the POA has been registered, the person is no longer allowed to sign.

Please check this (Sue may be able to help later), before registering.

Love,

 

[jenniferpa]

Yes, do I have to give myself a letter do you think? Talk about being of two minds.

 

[Skye]

Talk about being of two minds.

Common problem, I'm afraid!

 

[jenniferpa]

Ha had a brainwave, and have sent one of the carer's to look in my mother's document box, so in a while I should know one way or the other (fingers and toes crossed).

 

[sue38]

Jan, woke up in the middle of the night thinking I might have given you wrong information!

Here in Scotland, it seems to be the practice for the POA to be registered immediately, but for the solicitor to keep it until it's needed. John continued to sign himself for as long as he could.

I believe the situation is different in England, and once the POA has been registered, the person is no longer allowed to sign.

Please check this (Sue may be able to help later), before registering.

Love,

The situation in England and Wales is that you don't need to register the EPA (and shouldn't) until the donor has become or is becoming mentally incapable of dealing with their own affairs.

EPA's aren't solely for people who are worried about the deterioration of their mental health, my sister who is 43 and perfectly well, has done an EPA in favour of me and my sister as she lives in Athens and isn't here to sign things. This doesn't stop her from signing when she is here. She still has the power to sign along with us.

The effect of registration is that the donor can no longer revoke the EPA, without the permission of the Court, presumably on the assumption that they no longer have the mental capacity to do so.

I can't see that anything the donor signs after the EPA is registered is automatically invalid, but I suspect that a bank or similar who had a copy of the registered EPA would no longer accept the donor's signature.

 

[Margarita]

I lost mine that even the solicitor who originally , done it 5 years ago can not find it .

I phone up the place where your meant to Reg it , they was not of no help so gave up on it . As I am my mother appointee anyway so they said I should have no worry as her money can go into my account .

Did you sort out appointee with your mother for her attendance allowances and pensions ?

I suppose its different in your case as your mother may have large saving in a bank , that may be are all solely in her name is that why you are worried in Reg it ?

 

[jenniferpa]

I have a third party mandate for her bank account. The problem is she also has premium bonds plus an ISA at a building society AND I need to sell her flat (back to the company that she purchased it from, but still things need to be signed).

Still waiting for a call back.

 

[fluff]

...If on the other hand your Mum appointed you and then made a proviso for your husband to be appointed in the event of your death (not very likely with an EPA - I have never seen it, but quite common with wills), then only you can apply to be registered.

I think it can be written that way though. My mother recently set up a EPA in case of future need, naming my sister (who lives closest to her) but with my brother to take epa if my sister was unable to for some reason. Solicitor seemed to think this common and discouraged mum from naming all of us because she said it would be too complicated. Maybe she was simply trying to avoid argument if we all ahd an equal voice on any decisions.

 

[Margarita]

I do hope you find it xx

 

[Tender Face]

I can't see that anything the donor signs after the EPA is registered is automatically invalid,

Yikes Sue!!!! The 'biggest' reason I registered mum's EPA (after managing nicely on Third Party mandates for years) was to prevent her being able to enter into any kind of contract that she may not understand!!!!

So, if this evening she gets a call from a representative of, say, the 'Save the Dandelion Society' asking her to sign her house over to them and she did (she's a very compliant lady if people smile sweetly at her ) ... that 'contract' (assuming she could manage to sign - and she still can write her name on a good day) ......
could possibly have any legal standing after an EPA has been registered with COP because of mental incapacity?????

If there's a competition on for panicking - I'm winning by a mile just now ....

Love, Karen, x

 

[sue38]

Karen,

Please don't panic. The contract should be voidable (i.e. cancellable) if it can be shown that the other party knew that your mother was not mentally capable of understanding what she was signing or if the contract is unfair. But I am not an expert on this.

There are also rules concerning cancellation rights for signing certain contracts in your home. Again am no expert.

 

[BeckyJan]

Skye and Sue - thanks a lot for your replies to my query.

I always thought this EPA issue was easy and I felt at ease about having set up these years ago with our solicitor, who holds the original and we have a copy!.

I think you were right to raise this

EPA's aren't solely for people who are worried about the deterioration of their mental health,

In fact we set our up well before alz. became an issue and our daughters (aged 34 and 29) have both set up EPAs should anything happen to them.
This followed a young friend having brain damage as a result of car accident and his wife had one hell of a job to sort things out.

Sue - the predicament is 'at what point is my husband 'mentally incapable'. I have to say that whilst his memory is dreadful and he no longer has the reason and logic he had, he is still able to absorb a little re financial affairs and would be aware if anyone was trying to make him sign something and he would ask me first.

You have both helped me to get my thoughts together on this and I accept that at this stage it is probably not necessary to register.

Best wishes all Beckyjan

 

[jenniferpa]

Yippee - Happy Dance!

My mother's EPA has been found! Yes, I had put in her document box (which is reasssuring because I had a clear picture in my head of doing so, but I was beginning to think I'd imagined it). It is now in the safe - note to self IT'S IN THE SAFE!!!

It's now clear to me that it couldn't be any less safe in someone else's hand, so as soon as I get to it it's going off to the guardianship people to be registered.

 

[Skye]

Yippee!

Glad it's found! Now just the airport to panic about!

Love,

 

[BeckyJan]

Well done - pleased you have found it!! You are not so daft - you obviously knew all along where it was, just having a blank moment or two (too much on your mind I guess).

Let us know when it has been registered (and how long that takes, as I am interested).

I have just caught up on the post about Shingles. How is that now?
Best wishes Jan

 

[sue38]

My mother's EPA has been found! Yes, I had put in her document box (which is reasssuring because I had a clear picture in my head of doing so, but I was beginning to think I'd imagined it). It is now in the safe - note to self IT'S IN THE SAFE!!!

When my grandfather spent hours, days, weeks looking for something he would always say triumphantly when he finally found it 'Now THAT'S the beauty of knowing where you put a thing!'

I'm really glad you have found the EPA. I hope it's a good omen. I have spent the entire afternoon turning my office upside down looking for my driving licence (the paper bit that you never need), but for once I need it to sign some papers for the lease on my new car. Am going home now to look in the less obvious places.

 

[jenniferpa]

The things I normally have problems with are social security cards, particularly the children's. Over in the states you need your ss# for practically everything, but rarely do you have to show the card, so when it's needed, it's panic stations. Sometimes I feel like the Prisoner (I am not a number!) and it's not supposed to be used as an identifier due to concerns about identity theft, but that doesn't stop everyone wanting it.