EPA - accounting for cash?
- Thread starter Tender Face
- Start date
I think it might be a good idea to wait a while after signing if for no other reason that should someone choose to look closely at the situation, if she was at the point the EPA needed to registered, she would, in theory be unable to sign it. So signing and then immediately registering could potentially send up red flags. Also, you need to feel comfortable with doing it.
Not so much a night owl: my mother's in the U.K. but I'm in the U.S.A.
Jennifer
Not so much a night owl: my mother's in the U.K. but I'm in the U.S.A.
Jennifer
An incredible thead
This has been really interesting. There has been lots of good information (not for me, because of geography) and lots of emotion.
It does seem thar janishere has a really thick skin, not really upset by the comments made by others but instead thriving on them. So it seems to me, janishere, that you like to stir the pot a little.
I understand the point you were trying to make originally, that we shouldn't worry about what other people and/or organizations think, not let them run our lives etc etc. However, it really could have been better expressed. It's not what you said, it's how you said it.
But perhaps you were looking to get things going. That may be good for other bulletin boards but it's not appropriate here. There are some very emotionally vulnerable people here and I am in no way implying mental illness or anything like that. Taking care of someone with AD is so overwhelming.
I have to ask - are you taking care of anyone? Are you so angry that you need to lash out? Or are you simply not a particularly empathetic person?
This has been a rather blunt post for me. I normally strive for balance and gentleness. But you don't seem to mind so I have taken the gloves off and been very direct, with no careful choice of words.
Tell us what your problem is.
Joanne
This has been really interesting. There has been lots of good information (not for me, because of geography) and lots of emotion.
It does seem thar janishere has a really thick skin, not really upset by the comments made by others but instead thriving on them. So it seems to me, janishere, that you like to stir the pot a little.
I understand the point you were trying to make originally, that we shouldn't worry about what other people and/or organizations think, not let them run our lives etc etc. However, it really could have been better expressed. It's not what you said, it's how you said it.
But perhaps you were looking to get things going. That may be good for other bulletin boards but it's not appropriate here. There are some very emotionally vulnerable people here and I am in no way implying mental illness or anything like that. Taking care of someone with AD is so overwhelming.
I have to ask - are you taking care of anyone? Are you so angry that you need to lash out? Or are you simply not a particularly empathetic person?
This has been a rather blunt post for me. I normally strive for balance and gentleness. But you don't seem to mind so I have taken the gloves off and been very direct, with no careful choice of words.
Tell us what your problem is.
Joanne
Previously janishere was temporarily banned, but her status restored after that.margarita quoting janishere said:
One of the things I am addressing in the role I have taken on as AS moderator, is to put in place a public procedure that explains the banning process, so that everyone knows what is happening.
Frankly, banning takes place extremely rarely, except for the Internet spammers who attack TP constantly. They get banned immediately we identify them, though sometimes they manage to get something posted.
For everyone else, we generally work on a "3 strikes and you're out for good" procedure that is intended to protect the membership from habitual intemperate posters.
There's no harm in a bit of humour anywhere - yes, life is too short to be without. A problem can be that humour does not always transfer to words well, unless obviously put. Language can tell us so much, but it is a multi way medium where all sides have to understand the message as well as possible, or total confusion reigns....margarita said:
I quite can’t get the jiff of that , banning someone yourself , what happen don’t you see they post in the thread ?
I feel now that it’s a really hard job , letting someone be an attorney of a will , I did not understand the implication of being one when my father made me the attorney .
My father house was in his name on the deeds around 15 years ago my father added my mother on the deeds, done a will leavening me as the attorney (on the advice of the solicitor) so if anything happen to him they would be no complication, every think went to my mother, if anything happen to my mother it was lift to my brother and I , but I was the attorney
My father done that because I new something would go wrong if it was not in both they name I think it would of gone in to probate , but I never quite understood why the solicitor put me as the attorney . What is the meaning of being an attorney in a will?
When my solicitor sorted out my EPOA for my mother , he made a will up for my mother and I , now 5 years on I am learning more of the reasonability of what the law says and what one can and can not do , that I am not sure now that I want my son to have so much control
As I have put my son as an attorney on my will and I am thinking now would that mean, could he with hold, control things in how the money is handle, even thought I have left every think equally to the 4 of them
really would like to know what is the point of an attorney of a will ?
I feel now that it’s a really hard job , letting someone be an attorney of a will , I did not understand the implication of being one when my father made me the attorney .
My father house was in his name on the deeds around 15 years ago my father added my mother on the deeds, done a will leavening me as the attorney (on the advice of the solicitor) so if anything happen to him they would be no complication, every think went to my mother, if anything happen to my mother it was lift to my brother and I , but I was the attorney
My father done that because I new something would go wrong if it was not in both they name I think it would of gone in to probate , but I never quite understood why the solicitor put me as the attorney . What is the meaning of being an attorney in a will?
When my solicitor sorted out my EPOA for my mother , he made a will up for my mother and I , now 5 years on I am learning more of the reasonability of what the law says and what one can and can not do , that I am not sure now that I want my son to have so much control
As I have put my son as an attorney on my will and I am thinking now would that mean, could he with hold, control things in how the money is handle, even thought I have left every think equally to the 4 of them
really would like to know what is the point of an attorney of a will ?
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J
janishere
Guest
Margarita said:
No Maggie, it just means that the person cannot post again until things have calmed down, or as Bruce says, after three warnings, the moderators can ban someone altogether. As far as I know, the posts remain.
Margarita said:
I think you're confusing two terms here. I think you mean executor of a will.
This just means that when your dad died, it was your responsibility (and there is usually a solicitor too) to make sure his wishes were carried out, appropriate people notified,and all bequests went to the right people.
In my experience with both my parents, the solicitor in fact did all the work, and I just had to check everything was OK. But I suppose if I had wanted to, I could have done it myself.
So you've nothing to worry about with your son until you're dead!
Have I got that right, Sue?
Power of Attorney is something very different, as you know.
Love,
Skye said:
I think Margarita may have been referring to the posts about using the 'ignore' function and how that would work.
Brenda
janishere said:
Well I feel I'm getting to the crux of the matter here, Janishere ..... and I would ask you to respect that many of us here are fighting just to keep our own sanity and preserve the best quality of life for our loved ones .....
Some of us are less concerned about 'estates' but the here and now ....
I've looked back on your previous posts and seen the link (amongst other things) to the 'Fight the Bureaucracy' campaign .....
I personally am becoming more and more disappointed that this thread has been 'hijacked' for the purpose of campaigning - there is the Raising Awareness section for that ..... and yes, when I've got energy for fighting for other things you'll find this dimwit even ventures there ......
Ellie, please don't feel you have been overlooked - will get back to you ...
Karen......x
the problem I have
is as sensible as this is, circumstances arent as they were before. My mother would benfit enormously by my using some of her money to upgrade the car to a wheelchair friendly one..but she isnt in any state to understand the details of this, and is probably quite capable of accusing me of stealing her money to do so and she already did accuse me of stealing to buy my exisitng car and this was before I even had any acess to her money!!
Grannie G said:
is as sensible as this is, circumstances arent as they were before. My mother would benfit enormously by my using some of her money to upgrade the car to a wheelchair friendly one..but she isnt in any state to understand the details of this, and is probably quite capable of accusing me of stealing her money to do so and she already did accuse me of stealing to buy my exisitng car and this was before I even had any acess to her money!!
Thanks everyone for getting this thread back into what it was intended for - to answer questions and help people.
Natashalou: I assume from what you say us that you do have access to your mother's money now? If she needs something and I can see that a wheelchair accessible car would be close to a neccessity I can't see any problem using your mother's money to buy or modify one. However, it sounds not so much that you would have any problem with that in itself, but her reaction. Have I got that right?
You have to understand, as I'm sure you do, that these accusations would occur no matter what. It's not pleasant, goodness knows, but even if you spent none of her money, she'd probably still accuse you if she felt so inclined. What I'm trying to say is, since she no longer understands the details you have to make those decisions for her, and you might as well be hung for a sheep as a lamb. If you can think of it in this way: a bigger purchase is in some ways a lot easier than a smaller purchase. After all, why would you purchase a wheelchair accessible vehicle for any other reason than your mother's benefit, and moreover, it's there for everyone to see, which will make any accusations to anyone else much more obviously her fantasies. When Person A tell Person B that Person C has stolen £50, that's a lot harder to rebut than when Person A tells Person B that Person C has stolen money to buy a car for Person C when it's clear for all to see that the car in question is for the benefit of A.
Did that make any sense? I hope so
Jennifer
You have to understand, as I'm sure you do, that these accusations would occur no matter what. It's not pleasant, goodness knows, but even if you spent none of her money, she'd probably still accuse you if she felt so inclined. What I'm trying to say is, since she no longer understands the details you have to make those decisions for her, and you might as well be hung for a sheep as a lamb. If you can think of it in this way: a bigger purchase is in some ways a lot easier than a smaller purchase. After all, why would you purchase a wheelchair accessible vehicle for any other reason than your mother's benefit, and moreover, it's there for everyone to see, which will make any accusations to anyone else much more obviously her fantasies. When Person A tell Person B that Person C has stolen £50, that's a lot harder to rebut than when Person A tells Person B that Person C has stolen money to buy a car for Person C when it's clear for all to see that the car in question is for the benefit of A.
Did that make any sense? I hope so
Jennifer
Hi Natasha,
If you need to transport your mother and her wheelchair, and the wheelchair won`t fit in your car, if your mother has the money, change the car.
If your mother accuses you of stealing her money, tell her you`ll pay her back.
Sorry if that sounds too strong, but that`s what your mothers money is for, to be used in her best interests. This is why you have access to it.
I understand how difficult it is coping with someone who is unreasonable and suspicious, but this is part of her condition and, although you still would like to respect her as your mother, you should try to develop some confidence and faith in your own judgement.
Your mother is lucky to have you.
If you need to transport your mother and her wheelchair, and the wheelchair won`t fit in your car, if your mother has the money, change the car.
If your mother accuses you of stealing her money, tell her you`ll pay her back.
Sorry if that sounds too strong, but that`s what your mothers money is for, to be used in her best interests. This is why you have access to it.
I understand how difficult it is coping with someone who is unreasonable and suspicious, but this is part of her condition and, although you still would like to respect her as your mother, you should try to develop some confidence and faith in your own judgement.
Your mother is lucky to have you.
Hi,
Yes Hazel you are right, an executor of a will is the person basically entrusted to collect in the assets of the estate, pay off the debts and then distribute the assets and the money in accordance with the terms of the will.
I would take issue with your comment 'usually there is a solicitor too'. Be careful of solicitors who automatically put themselves in as executors. Usually there is no need to have a professional executor of a will. If there are relatives/friends able to act (and remember a beneficiary can be an executor), then 'when the time comes' the executors can decide whether to instruct a solicitor and if so which one (where there is a solicitor executor and you use a different firm you may end up paying double costs) or whether to deal with things personally.
Having said that there are occasions when it is a good idea to put the solicitor in as an executor. Sometimes there is no one else suitable, sometimes a person may trust their solicitor more that their family, somtimes a solicitor will be able to act as referee where there is potential conflict between beneficiaries and sometimes a person may feel that their family will need help with a complicated estate.
Margarita, I am not sure why you have only appointed one of your children as executor. Are the others under 18 or out of the country? You could appoint all 4 and then 'when the time comes' they can decide whether or not they want to act as executors or not. I think I would appoint at least 2 if you can. On the one hand you are placing a lot of trust in your son but on the other hand you are putting a lot of responsibility on your son to act alone. It may leave him open to accusations of delay and worse from the other 3.
Sue
Yes Hazel you are right, an executor of a will is the person basically entrusted to collect in the assets of the estate, pay off the debts and then distribute the assets and the money in accordance with the terms of the will.
I would take issue with your comment 'usually there is a solicitor too'. Be careful of solicitors who automatically put themselves in as executors. Usually there is no need to have a professional executor of a will. If there are relatives/friends able to act (and remember a beneficiary can be an executor), then 'when the time comes' the executors can decide whether to instruct a solicitor and if so which one (where there is a solicitor executor and you use a different firm you may end up paying double costs) or whether to deal with things personally.
Having said that there are occasions when it is a good idea to put the solicitor in as an executor. Sometimes there is no one else suitable, sometimes a person may trust their solicitor more that their family, somtimes a solicitor will be able to act as referee where there is potential conflict between beneficiaries and sometimes a person may feel that their family will need help with a complicated estate.
Margarita, I am not sure why you have only appointed one of your children as executor. Are the others under 18 or out of the country? You could appoint all 4 and then 'when the time comes' they can decide whether or not they want to act as executors or not. I think I would appoint at least 2 if you can. On the one hand you are placing a lot of trust in your son but on the other hand you are putting a lot of responsibility on your son to act alone. It may leave him open to accusations of delay and worse from the other 3.
Sue
For information
please note that another thread has relevance to this one http://www.alzheimers.org.uk/talkingpoint/discuss/showthread.php?t=6207
please note that another thread has relevance to this one http://www.alzheimers.org.uk/talkingpoint/discuss/showthread.php?t=6207
ellie 123 said:
Dear Ellie ... have felt so much the same ...... in essence registering mum's EPA meant cutting off a financial lifeline which I knew would provide - at worst - an 'interest free loan' when some crisis occurred I couldn't immediately fund ....
My now nearly clapped out car is one 'subsidised' by a generous gift some years ago ..... because of my need at that time to transport my father to and from hospital ..... at that time there was no hint of an EPA for either mum or dad - but if there had been I would - and no doubt anyone else - legal/professional or otherwise - have seen it as in (mum and dad's) 'best interests' that I could and did run a car .... and was 'on call' like a private taxi service!!!! Yes, there were ambulance or private services maybe could have helped ..... but it helped everyone all round physically and psychologically for all us to have the 'comfort' of being independent..... and their finances 'allowed' that and seemed 'good use' ....
Where I stand now? Just in my own personal circumstances, I would find it hard to justify that my primary purpose for using any of mum's savings towards financing something on the magnitude of a new car would be for her benefit ......
No EPA, and I know I could have expected to be offered the money I needed if I simply suggested ..... the problem, to me, is that where mum has given generously to me in the past ... she can't differentiate between giving willingly to me or some stranger who might knock on her door ......
My take on this, part of my reason for starting this whole thread, is that we seem to have legal (never mind our moral/personal .. whatever people like to call them) .... obligations but that there is so little 'black and white' in this area ... just various shades of 'grey guidelines' we are trying to do our best to interpret and work with ....
Don't suppose any of that helps much ..... but just to let you know someone empathises and sympathises with your situation....
Love Karen, x
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