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court of protection or local authority

lacey1962

Registered User
Jan 9, 2016
41
Crawley
Hello,

My father has had dementia for 3 years and is in a care home which Is partly funded.

Mum stayed in their house for 2 years until she fell and broke her shoulder, she could not look after herself so came to stay with me for her recovery, she then broke her hip 3 months later so did not go home and continued to stay with me. She does not want to go back to her house as its to far from me and wants to sell the house and buy another nearer me.
While staying with me she has had direct payment funding from my LA to pay for her to go to a care home for a shower and hair wash as my bathroom is not suitable for her to use. ) Will it look like we have left the property empty for a year on purpose ?
Does she need permission from the Local Authority and Court of protection.? I am in the process of court of protection for my father as I was advised mum would not be allowed to sell without this..
 

Katrine

Registered User
Jan 20, 2011
2,839
England
Hello lacey1962. I think the reason you have not had much response is because it isn't clear what you see the problem as being. I think you are worried that the LA has been paying for your mum to receive the bathing service because she has been living in your house, when in theory she could have been living in her own house and therefore wouldn't have needed the bathing service?

I don't think there is any problem here. She was staying with you to recuperate from injury and because she couldn't manage living alone. Now she has decided to move to a property that is more suited to her needs. When she moves she won't need the bathing service at the CH. You would inform the LA at that time.

However, IMO it would be a good idea for her then to have another SS assessment to be sure her needs for assistance are still being met. She might need another service, such as carer support, and could continue to receive some level of direct payment for this. Better not to lose the DP once awarded because she would go to the back of the queue again if she had to reapply from scratch.
 

nitram

Registered User
Apr 6, 2011
20,054
North Manchester
"I am in the process of court of protection for my father as I was advised mum would not be allowed to sell without this."

Assuming that the property is in some form of joint ownership it cannot be sold without the involvement of the COP, either as a separate order or by appointment of a deputy.

Note that selling the property will mean that the LA will regard half the proceeds as your father's capital. This half cannot be used to purchase a new property for your mum although the LA have discretion to allow some of it to be used in exceptional circumstances.
 

Katrine

Registered User
Jan 20, 2011
2,839
England
Does she need permission from the Local Authority and Court of protection.? I am in the process of court of protection for my father as I was advised mum would not be allowed to sell without this..
Are you asking if your mum needs permission from the LA or COP to sell her own house and to buy another one?

If your dad's CH fees are being paid by the LA under a deferred payment scheme then they will want their money back when the house is sold. This may conflict with your mum's need to have funds to buy a suitable property. Half of the value of their existing property is (I guess) hers anyway, but she might find this isn't sufficient to buy what she needs.

It may still possible for her to spend more than half the proceeds on another property, as nitram wrote above. You need advice from a solicitor, preferably one who specialises in this area of law. Google 'Solicitors for the Elderly' to find one local to you. If you're already applying to COP for your dad then you may already have a solicitor who can help you.

nitram wrote: "Assuming that the property is in some form of joint ownership it cannot be sold without the involvement of the COP, either as a separate order or by appointment of a deputy." This is regarding your dad's joint ownership of the property. Your mum doesn't need COP permission in her own right unless there is a registered and active POA in place for her. If you are not sure what to do, the Office of the Public Guardian has helpful advisors you can speak to on the phone.

If I have misunderstood the issues, I apologise. Please clarify your concerns and post them. There are others more knowledgeable than me who can advise further.
 
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lacey1962

Registered User
Jan 9, 2016
41
Crawley
Hello lacey1962. I think the reason you have not had much response is because it isn't clear what you see the problem as being. I think you are worried that the LA has been paying for your mum to receive the bathing service because she has been living in your house, when in theory she could have been living in her own house and therefore wouldn't have needed the bathing service?

I don't think there is any problem here. She was staying with you to recuperate from injury and because she couldn't manage living alone. Now she has decided to move to a property that is more suited to her needs. When she moves she won't need the bathing service at the CH. You would inform the LA at that time.

However, IMO it would be a good idea for her then to have another SS assessment to be sure her needs for assistance are still being met. She might need another service, such as carer support, and could continue to receive some level of direct payment for this. Better not to lose the DP once awarded because she would go to the back of the queue again if she had to reapply from scratch.

Hi Katrine,
I am new to all of use so apologies for not putting all the facts down.

Mum has broken her shoulder and is unable to shower or wash hair without assistance and is unable to get into my roll top bath as its too dangerous which is why I had SS come and access our situation. I was told to apply for carers allowance and attendance allowance as she was struggling to wash, dress or look after herself and I was doing everything for her.
I have been trying to get the court of protection for over a year and it has taken ages due to various other family issues and still have not got the full part that gives permission for me to help mum sell their property. I am under a difference LA from my parents so have had direct funding from them. Someone had told me I should not have left the property empty for so long and I am concerned that my mums council will think I have left their property empty to avoid paying Dads came home fees as it has been so long.I don't know if I need to get permission from their LA as I am doing the court of protection, If I need their permission how do I go about this.
Thanks for replying.
 

lacey1962

Registered User
Jan 9, 2016
41
Crawley
"I am in the process of court of protection for my father as I was advised mum would not be allowed to sell without this."

Assuming that the property is in some form of joint ownership it cannot be sold without the involvement of the COP, either as a separate order or by appointment of a deputy.

Note that selling the property will mean that the LA will regard half the proceeds as your father's capital. This half cannot be used to purchase a new property for your mum although the LA have discretion to allow some of it to be used in exceptional circumstances.
Hi Nitram.
I have posted again to give more info.
Thanks for your reply
 

lacey1962

Registered User
Jan 9, 2016
41
Crawley
Carers Cafe

Hello,
I am trying to find a Carers Café near me in Crawley, West Sussex but have not been able to find one.
Can anyone suggest where I look?
Thank you
 

Spiro

Registered User
Mar 11, 2012
522
Below is the link to your local Carers Support organisation. The head office is in Crawley and they should be able to sign post you to other local services. Make sure your GP knows you are a carer as well.

http://www.carerssupport.org.uk/our-organisation

I don't know how up to date this website is, but if you click on the tab marked "local support" you will see a list of carers cafes.
 

lacey1962

Registered User
Jan 9, 2016
41
Crawley
Below is the link to your local Carers Support organisation. The head office is in Crawley and they should be able to sign post you to other local services. Make sure your GP knows you are a carer as well.

http://www.carerssupport.org.uk/our-organisation

I don't know how up to date this website is, but if you click on the tab marked "local support" you will see a list of carers cafes.
Thank you Spiro, I will get in touch with them.
Sally
 

lacey1962

Registered User
Jan 9, 2016
41
Crawley
Independant Financial advise for the elderly

Hi,
Can anyone recommend an Independent Financial Adviser who specialise in the elderly.
I need some advise for my parents re selling their home.
Thank you
 

nitram

Registered User
Apr 6, 2011
20,054
North Manchester
As I understand it the property is jointly owned, your father has dementia, and you by now should be a COP deputy.

If this is correct, for assistance in selling the property, I suggest you find a solicitor by searching on http://www.sfe.legal/

For advice on what to do with the proceeds you will need financial advice, half the proceeds will belong to your mother and half to your father with you acting on his behalf.
 

Pickles53

Registered User
Feb 25, 2014
2,474
Radcliffe on Trent
Thank you,
I looked up their website today and they gave me a very helpful man in Horsham, who spent 15 minutes of his time for free. So many thanks Pickles53
You're very welcome. I found that talking through the options with a knowledgeable but independent expert really helped me clarify my thoughts and come to a decision.
 

lacey1962

Registered User
Jan 9, 2016
41
Crawley
As I understand it the property is jointly owned, your father has dementia, and you by now should be a COP deputy.

If this is correct, for assistance in selling the property, I suggest you find a solicitor by searching on http://www.sfe.legal/

For advice on what to do with the proceeds you will need financial advice, half the proceeds will belong to your mother and half to your father with you acting on his behalf.
Hi nitram,

I have become a deputy for my father as of last week, it has taken over a year to get to this point. Our solicitor informed me that we now have permission to sell the house but COP had neglected to tell us if my mother can use any of my fathers share to rehouse her ( we have to wait for another 3 weeks for their answer. She needs to move to be near me. I have seen a suitable property for her but it is more than her half so we now need to wait to find out if we get permission.

The financial advisor I spoke to this morning asked if the LA had put a charge on their home but I do not know as I have not been informed by the LA.
I hope this wont hold up the sale as Mum is getting excited at the thought of moving as she has lived in their old home for 54 years.