any suggestions?

[JMU]

Hello,
My dad is still going through the diagnosis stages of his dementia- he had a CT scan last week. However, he only scored 15/30 in his last memory test.
Anyway, for over a year he's had a paranoia about money which has increased as his behaviour has got worse. I have applied for LPA but it will probably be a few months until it comes through. In the mean time I can't figure out what he's doing.
I live with him, I currently pay for everything barring direct debits. This came about even when I knew he still had money because he was going on and on about how he had none, how it had all been stolen from him etc. This is fine, I can manage the daily stuff.
But he is still convinced that all his money has been taken from him (even when he has a wad of cash in his wallet). He is going about telling people this, and also implying that I have beaten him with sticks to take it from him. One 'friend' even convinced him to call the police on me, and later called the social services on his behalf informing them I was a 'financial and physical danger to him'. A certain amount of this I can ignore, even his visits to the citizen's advice bureau, which were frequent at one point. What worries me is that he is still getting money from somewhere- in the last couple of weeks he has bought a pair of shoes, some expensive bottles of vitamins, and a new handbag for me, not counting all the unwanted food he brings home (invariably meat- we are vegetarian). Yet he won't allow me to see inside his wallet, or to touch his bank card. Today I caught him coming home from the bank, having tried to get money and failed. But I got the impression that he is going in there and handing over his card and they are giving him money. This really worries me as I'm afraid by the time I get charge of his accounts he will have done something irreversible. Also I work full time and have no control over what he does when I'm not here. We had a social worker visit last week who implied court of protection might be necessary, but I have no idea what this involves, or if in the long run it would benefit me. I can't do anything for him outright as he's getting more and more suspicious of me every day. I don't even have an opportunity to hide his bank card as he keeps it with him at all times. I found today he had hidden all his paperwork, including the house deeds, in a drawer in his room- I've taken these now. I'd really appreciate any suggestions on this.

 

[sue38]

Hi JMU,

It sounds like a worrying situation, and it's upsetting when you're accused of all sorts when all you're trying to do is protect your vulnerable father.

You say that the LPA will take a few months to come through. Have you sent it off for registration? If so it seems to be taking about 9-10 weeks to come through. If you're still in the process of setting up the LPA and getting someone to certify that your dad still has the necessary capacity then it may well take a few months. If he doesn't have the necessary capacity then you will need to apply to the Court of Protection for an order that you be appointed as your father's deputy to handle his financial affairs.

This factsheet may help.

 

[CollegeGirl]

Hi, this sounds very worrying ... I don't have any experience of this sort of behaviour so can't offer much in the way of advice, but one thing did strike me - would it be at all possible for you to speak to someone in the bank (the manager?) to register your concern? Just until your LPA comes through?

Another thought ... are you sure that your dad is paying for the things he's bringing home? Have you seen receipts? This is a horrible thought and please forgive me for mentioning it, but maybe there's a chance he's just picking things up and walking out of the shop?

I hope you get it sorted soon. Take care x

 

[Nebiroth]

I'm not quite sure what you mean when you say you have applied for LPA. Do you mean that your dad has created this and that you have now sent it in to be registered? This can take some weeks at least. Or do you mean you are going to get your dad to create the LPA which you will then register?

If it is the latter then there may be doubts over his capacity to create an LPA. Also, if he is paranoid about money and is convinced you are conniving against him, I do not see how you are going to persuade him to create an LPA which basically empowers you to take control of his affairs. Part of the test of his capacity to create the LPA will be that he understands this.

The social worker has mentioned the court of protection. They are probably referring to the process where someone can apply to the court to be made a deputy. This is being like an attorney, except that the authority is conferred by the court without the agreement or knowledge of the person whose affairs will taken control of. Gaining deputyship can be a lengthy and complex affair because, obviously, a lot of checks have to be made. A deputy can only have authority over financial affairs, whereas an LPA can grant an attorney authority over either financial or health & welfare, or both.

As said above, there is a chance that your dad isn't paying for things he is bringing home. Don;t worry - there's no chance in the world that he'd get into trouble since he's clearly not responsible for his own actions, so this is more a practical problem that needs dealing with. If you suspect this is happening, the best thing to do is to talk with the likely targets of pilfering saying you will try to ensure that gods are returned.

Accusations of theft or abuse are commonplace and very often levelled at those nearest and least likely to be guilty of them. Both the police and social services will have heard it all before although obviously they have to take reports seriously and investigate them. It will be immediately obvious they are groundless and it will be equally obvious that your dad's stories are unreliable.

As to the bank, if you are really worried, the only thing you can do is to tell the bank he has lost capacity to manage his affairs. Banks are obliged to freeze access if they believe that customers can't manage them appropriately. This would invalidate his card and the branch wouldn't give him money. But of course, there is going to be fallout from this.

In the meantime, you might think of becoming an appointee. An appointee is someone who can receive and manage someone else's state benefits - it's like being an attorney, but only for state benefits. As an appointee, you could receive your dad's state pension (and any other benefits) and use the money to pay necessary bills etc. It's quite straightforward, the DWP just send someone to interview the parties involved to make sure everything is aboveboard. Being an appointee wouldn't give you access to dad's bank account - only an attorney or deputy can do that - but you could receive his state benefits into an account in your name and pay bills etc with that. It might be a useful intermin measure whilst you sort out the LPA or deputyship application.

 

[JMU]

Thanks for the advice.
To clear up the bit about the LPA. It was all filled out but I have had to wait until recently to send it because, when he was more with it he would not allow me this kind of control. It is all going through at the moment, I have had a letter back to say it has been registered and we are now in the six week waiting period, in case there are any objections. Then it is however long it takes after that.
I don't think he is stealing anything. Some things he wouldn't be able to- like the shoes, and I have seen money in his wallet (at a distance), sometimes great wads of it. But I'm certain he doesn't really understand it's worth any more, and am worried that someone will just take it from him. Or that someone really will believe that he has no money- I read recently about a bank that gave a person with dementia a huge loan even though he lacked capacity, and this seems to be a likely situation with my dad. He seems very believable to most people, unless they get into a proper conversation with him. He is well known in the town and I can also imagine a situation where people would 'give' him things he wanted, expecting to be paid later, or possibly paid by me.
I'm interested in the suggestion about asking the bank to freeze his assets. What would be the fall out from this, and how would it affect the LPA?

 

[FifiMo]

JMU,

Firstly I would speak to his GP and tell him what has been going on and that you feel that irrespective of the diagnosis that is still awaited that things are deteriorating to the point that the paranoia is taking over and you are being accused of all sorts. Tell him that it has been suggested that he may no longer have capacity to manage his affairs, such is the extent of the deterioration. Tell them about SW and police and CAB involvement and how things are now out of control with a grave danger that he is going to be succeptable to financial abuse due to him no longer understanding the value of money etc.

With regards to the money, can you find his bank statements? When money was going missing with my mother, we could ascertain that there was a pattern to the money being missing, we could tell whether or not she had been out that day (perhaps a carer had used her card or someone else), and also whether money had been withdrawn from a cash machine or from the branch itself. It also gave us an indication of the amount of money we were talking about too. It could be that he is "recycling" cash that he's been accumulating at home for some time. My mother had thousands in her house at one stage when she thought my father was stealing her money. We kept recycling it back to the bank once we discovered what was going on.

The suggestion about freezing his account or at least his access to his account sounds like a good interim measure to me but you'd have to get the banks to agree. You might however find that they want confirmation that he no longer has capacity - hence the reason you need to get the GP involved asap!

I wish you luck, the whole money thing is tiring and emotive too.

Fiona