1. omnis

    omnis Registered User

    Feb 15, 2008
    2
    Advice and help please.
    I have a friend who is in what can probably best be described as the mid stages of Alzheimers. For the most part she is perfectly normal, performs all normal daily functions and routines, reads and fully comrehends the Telegraph, watches TV, keeps herself and her home clean and tidy. However with what is probably increasing regularity, she reverts back to life maybe twenty or so years ago. No major problems with that in itself, for her it is a pleasant place to be, with friends who are no longer of this life. She feeds herself, makes coffee when I visit, and holds perfectly normal conversations.
    Now comes the problem.
    Her family have decided that the time has come for her to move into a care home. For them it would be more convenient, less responsibility, and if I am brutally honest, more ready cash, as she has a considerable wealth.
    They haven't mentioned a word of it to her, and the plan is simply to take her to the home on the pretence that she is going to stay with one of them for a short holiday.
    She doesn't know what is planned, but it appears that another elderly friend has accidentally let the cat out of the bag, and this morning I received a call stating that she had absolutely no intention of leaving her own home, and that her family were just after her money.
    This afternoon,and fortunately I think, she has no recollection of the distress she was in earlier in the day.
    So, what to do?
    Do I simply sit back and let her family effectively "kidnap" her and incarcerate her into a home against her will, as for sure she will never be allowed out once she is there, or is there something that I can or indeed should be doing about this.
    I would appreciate any help and advice.
    Many thanks.
     
  2. noelphobic

    noelphobic Registered User

    Feb 24, 2006
    3,452
    Liverpool
    one thing that immediately puzzles me about this is why her family think they would be able to access this lady's cash if she were to go into residential care. Do they know how much residential care costs and that it is means tested?
     
  3. jenniferpa

    jenniferpa Volunteer Moderator

    Jun 27, 2006
    39,418
    Hi omnis and welcome to TP.

    Hmm - I don't think that the relation's plan will fly, to be honest. It is almost impossible to place someone in a care home without consent. Further even if they did, they might not find that they have as much spare cash as they think they would - residential care is expensive. Also, a residential home would perform an assessment before accepting her. Has this happened? This isn't the 19th century where people can be incarcerated in a lunatic asylum against their will.

    Can I suggest you get in touch with elderabuse? elderabuse.org.uk Because if this is a real plan it would seem to fall under their remit. They have specialised help line operatives around all these issues.

    Alternatively, or as well, you might be well advised to contact the help line of the Alzheimer's Society.

    Edited to add: cross posted with Brenda - two minds with but a single thought "Do they know how much residential care costs and that it is means tested?"
     
  4. omnis

    omnis Registered User

    Feb 15, 2008
    2
    Many thanks

    Firstly, we are dealing with a very wealthy person here. So, yes, they would indeed benefit to a considerable extent if she was no longer in charge of her own finances.
    Secondly, it is intended that she be "placed" into one of the larger chain of care homes, and an assessment of sorts has been carried out by their local representative, as the home that has been selected, and about which she is entirely unaware, is a considerable distance from where she is currently living. All I can gather about the assessment, is that they do not consider her to fall into the category of requiring secure accomodation, but would be happy nonetheless to take her as a resident.

    PS I put "Many thanks" into the title, but neglected to thank you both most sincerely for your advice. I confess this is something that I lie awake at night and worry about, so was mightily relieved to find this forum, and appreciate your advice.
     
  5. jenniferpa

    jenniferpa Volunteer Moderator

    Jun 27, 2006
    39,418
    With regard to finances - is there an existing EPA or LPA? The family would need one of those before they could take control of any money, AND they would have to notify her that they were doing so, which would give her the option to contest it.

    Look - I'm going to be devils advocate here. I understand that to you she appears fine, a little vague, perhaps, a little lost in time. But that may not be the extent of it. People with dementia can be quite adept at covering "slips" and that's fine, provide those slips aren't endangering themselves or others. Sadly, there does often come the time where full time care is required. Now personally, if I was in that position and I had the funds (and they weren't tied up in property which is often the case) I would look at going the route of full time assistance in my own home, which depending on where you are, may actually not be much more expensive than residential care (which ranges from £500 - £1000) a week depending on the location.
     
  6. Margaret W

    Margaret W Registered User

    Apr 28, 2007
    3,725
    North Derbyshire
    Dear Omnis, this is a serious case. If you feel that your friend is being fleeced for money, whatever her mental state, I would consider consulting a solicitor for advice. Or at least an organisation such as Help the Aged.

    Your friend may have tons of money right now, but with a "quality" care home costing, say £800 a week, £10,000 a year is going to disappear very rapidly, and I cannot actually see that her relatives are going to be able to get access to the rest of her capital if they do not have Power of Attorny. And even if they do, they are obliged to manage her money for her own benefit.

    I'd be tempted to contact the Court of Protection for advice before anything happens. No idea what they can do, but it just sound sensible.

    Good luck

    Margaret
     
  7. Margaret W

    Margaret W Registered User

    Apr 28, 2007
    3,725
    North Derbyshire
    Dear Omnis

    Despite being an accountant, I did my calculations wrong, a Care Home at £800 a week would cost £42,000 a year.

    Maybe she has that level of capital.

    I don't know what more to advise, in a way it isn't your business, but I appreciate your concern. It actually sounds as though your friend is still capable of making her own decisions, so a POA or whatever the new system is would not be easily obtained by the family. You could perhaps (guesswork) also suggest that YOU be better placed to be the Attorney. You probably have no automatic rights to be so, and it would probably cost a lot of money in legal fees to fight the family - but it might be worth considering.

    As someone earlier said, gone are the days when we can just bang an inconvenient relative into an Asylum and forget about them, which is what it seems your friends relatives are planning. But as someone else said, perhaps you don't know the full story.

    What an awful situation for you to be in.

    Keep us informed.

    Regards

    Margaret
     
  8. Margarita

    Margarita Registered User

    Feb 17, 2006
    10,824
    london
    #8 Margarita, Mar 5, 2008
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2008


    you could always call age concern or speak to someone in social services for the elderly in you area , because I from my own experience with social services for the elderly they would never of put my mother in a care home and fund it , they let her stay as independent as long as she could humanly be able , only now can I do it because its became a strain on me .

    seeing that this lady now knows what is happing you could tell her , her rights she can get a independent social worker for herself she may have to pay for one .

    This lady may seem OK like other have said , and her family may be looking at it in the long team that she won't be able to care for herself without someone living with her , so rather waiting for the disease to progresses they putting her in a home now.

    another option the lady could consider if she did not want to go into a home how , is get a paid live in carer , seeing that she has the money like you say
     

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