Advice about alcohol

[JanetP]

Hi there,
I've been hanging around and soaking up all the support and advice given out on this wonderful forum, I have even asked a couple of questions but not for a while now - I would really appreciate some advice on a very difficult situation.

Just to give you a bit of background - My Mother In Law was diagnosed with Alzheimers nearly two years ago, she has been taking Aricept since March and is responding well to it. She's still driving and doing a lot around the home. My father in law has mobility problems and suffers from depression and has found the diagnosis hard to deal with. He often cannot leave his bed because he is so down and MIL spends lots of time around the house on her own. My husband and I go there every day to make sure they have both taken their pills and to support them emotionally, but with two young children and jobs to hold down, we can't be there all the time.
Recently I arrived at 4 in the afternoon after the school run and MIL was falling down drunk. She was slurring her words and not making any sense. At first I was concerned it was a stroke but FIL said she had been drinking gin. Another time my husband found her face down in the front garden, very drunk. There are bottles of wine, port and spirits hidden all round the house, which we currently try to find and dispose of. But everything we throw away is replaced the next day. MIL's reaction to all this is denial and anger. Even when she was slurring her words and falling down, she was denying that she had been drinking to me. She's very independent and fiesty and doesn't really want any help from us, although she is getting lots already. We are also trying to relieve her boredom by taking her out more with us, so that she's not in the house to do the drinking but we can't be there all the time.

Are we right to be trying to stop the drinking? It seems to me that this situation is going to end badly for them, with an alcohol related accident.

What more can we do? Does anyone have any ideas?

Thanks
Janet

 

[Bristolbelle]

Oh dear....

Sadly things do look a bit difficult. The problems is that everyne has "rights" these days and it is your MIL's right to drink if that's what she wants to do. I know FIL has mibility probelms but does he really need to take to his bad or is he depressed? I ask because my hubby's family have a history of "taking to heir beds" whcih I find very annoying as everyone know the best waay to maintain the mobility you have is to use it. I see them as selfish and lazy. though I accept depression may also play it's part, and thie was to be my nety question. Are either of them depressed it sounds to me as if the both are? Alcohol is often an escape, and if FIL is immobile and demanding then Mil has ever right to get depressed.
I also think taking a conflicting stance may easier and more interesting
The drinking would annoy me and I probably would lose my cool even though I know that would be a bad thing. Also see if you can get Soc Serv involved for any further advice/support.

Good luck.

 

[Tender Face]

Hello, Janet, such a difficult situation and a worry. I am inclined to agree with Bristobelle that depression could be a factor and MIL is using (or rather abusing) alcohol to blot things out .... OR it could be she just doesn’t remember she has already had one glass and so has another ... and then another ...

My own mum went through a spell of drinking which concerned me greatly .... and at that point was independent enough to get herself to the corner shop and buy whatever she wanted – whisky mostly. (Mum had dementia, also on Aricept, and lived independently – but with no-one else to care for other than herself and of course with a lot of input from me). Discussions with GP and CPN were to ‘let it be’ unless I was finding her collapsed drunk, which I never did, so your situation is a tad further on and more worrying than I had to handle.

However, if it helps, what I did do was offer to ‘stock her up’ ... (‘Save you going out to the shop, mum’) ... buying only wines and drinks like advocaat – much lower ‘proof’ than the spirits she would buy for herself ..... even tried to slip in a few non-alcoholic wines .....

I wonder the disposing of the alcohol you find is just fuelling potential confrontation and may make things worse ..... (these ‘feisty independents’ don’t like being controlled or told they are wrong do they?)

The hiding sounds like classic ‘alcoholism’ – if there is such a thing? – or could be the dementia. (Did MIL like a drink before her dementia?) Perhaps MIL sees bottles of ‘goodies’ the way my mum would see hoarding plastic bags? (As well as her whisky ) Difficult to know .... but I think you are right – there is a potential crisis waiting to happen and I would seek advice/support from SS/CPN/GP and make them aware and seek their support.

Best of luck with it, Karen, x

 

[jenniferpa]

The problem with any memory loss and alcohol is that while one or two drinks may be fine, the memory loss means that people forget they have had one or two and continue on to 3, 4 and the rest. However, if she is still sufficiently well to drive, I suspect that that's not the primary issue here. Do you have any fears that she might drive after drinking? Because if so, thats another kind of accident waiting to happen.

I don't think removing the booze will work at all, to be honest, since she obviously has the ability to restock. All I can think of is that it might be worthwhile contacting their GP about both of them - he/she won't be able to discuss them directly, but at least you can make your concerns known.

 

[Sam Iam]

Jennifer,
you are so right, my mum is adament she only has one drink per evening ( we water her whiskey down before she fills it out with hot water i,e dilute a litre into a litre and 3/4.

I came home from a day out yesterday at 2.30pm and she was sitting with a drink and was guilty/surprised when I walked into her sitting room.
I have informed all of mum's medical/SW professionals and carer's of this.
I feel mum uses the alcohol as an escape.
For me I feel it would throw up more problems if we took alcohol out of the equasion and I have to close the door and leave my worries at home when I go to work (some will think I am lazy/uncaring but I have seen mum with out drink in the evening and no I will not go there again

 

[gigi]

Hello Janet,

You've had some very sound advice here which I can't add to.

I do feel for you as you really do have your hands full.it's a very depressing and worrying situation that you describe.

As Jennifer has suggested I think your first port of call should be your parents' GP...it sounds as though there should be some input here and maybe the GP can set the ball rolling.

Love xx

 

[JanetP]

Thank you so much for all your thoughts, it's good to know we're not alone in this
Both parents are on anti-depressants and for both a degree of depression is understandable, given one's disability and the others Alzheimers. It's a terrible and sad situation and I could do with a drink myself at the end of the day!
We are mostly concerned about the covert nature and hiding of the drinking, my husband has been watering and disposing of the bottles that are hidden but leaving the others. You're right, it is a point of confrontation alongside us checking the fridge for out of date food. It seems that we are the ones who do all the 'bad' stuff so we get all the negative attitude (we're also the only ones that go in every day to make tea, lunch and chat but that doesn't get remembered of course).

You're right Jennifer, we are concerned about the driving, because although the drinking tends to go on in the evening sometimes it leaks into the late afternoon and it's possible MIL will decide to drive to the shops after it - I hate to think what might happen then. I'm assuming that alcohol also has a negative effect on the Aricept?

I feel very let down by the health care professionals. My husband went to talk to the GP about the situation as a whole but he was pretty rubbish and came up with no solutions at all or any offer of help or support. We have at no point been offered any kind of district or community nursing. When I called Social Services to arrange home care for getting FIL up, washed and dressed each day, the social worker told me that as they have savings over a certain amount so I'd have to arrange it myself. When pressed she sent me a list of local care providers ranging from meals on wheels to care homes with no help identifying who did what. Basically we are feeling on our own and unsupported.

Thanks for listening, off-loading is now complete.

 

[imac.girll1]

I know Jennifer and others have mentioned this but i have again. The thing that worries me most is you say MIL is still driving....after she has had a drink? Now this concerns me probably ever so slightly more than the fact that she is lying face down in the garden!

If she is drinking then driving, and with the combination of dementia and probable depression also, this is something that not only could cause great heartache to you but maybe to another family.
Now its not easy to broach the subject of this but it is something thats needs to be covered, as if she has an accident she may not be the only one hurt!

Your DR and CPN and dementia psychiatrist are the ones who need to work if she is still able to - either that or it will end in a police situation and her licence being revoked immediately.

Is there any way if she is drink driving that her car keys could go 'missing', on your next visit or something.

I had to deal with this with my father and his dementia, and i basically walked and removed his car keys and said he could not drive anymore, it was hard, but it had to be done, and that had nothing to do with drinking, just the dementia side of things.

I know this may sound harsh with what I have said but this is something you need to be concerned about.

I hope you can find a way through it all and best wishes.

 

[JanetP]

Hey there, yes, it is the driving that worries us the most although we have no evidence that MIL is drinking and driving, the worry is always there. When my husband told the GP about it and asked about revoking her one year license, he said there was nothing he could do as it wasn't a medical condition. Her driving in general is very good, we're not worried about that at the moment.
Good plan about the car keys though, and it is what we do if we turn up and there's evidence of drinking going on.
What a mess.

 

[littlelins]

My dad was always a drinker and when he first started repeating himself & forgetting things, I thought he was just drunk! It was only when he had pneumonia and was admitted to hospital, therefore not drinking, that I realised it went further than being drunk. However, I still had no idea how much of a problem the drinking was until he had a fit, was admitted to hospital and then thanks to his blood readings, was classed as an alcoholic. We then discovered he was spending £200+ a week in the pub and was repeatedly going in, having a drink, leaving, reappearing an hour or so later and the same again and on and on and on. The fit was caused by alcohol withdrawal as presumably he forgot to go to the pub

With my dad, we discovered he was getting IOUs from the pub, so step 1 was the social worker went in the pubs in the area - only 2 or 3 - and asked them not to let him buy a drink if he didn't have money. Step 2, I restricted his access to money - I now just give him a little cash so he can go for 1 or 2 pints a couple of times week. Can you restrict her access to cash? I don't expect you can ask shops not to serve her though!

The driving is a real worry isn't it. I am inclined to think if she's getting so drunk she'll be found drunk in the garden, then she's not mentally capable enough to know/remember if she has had a drink and is capable of driving. But it's such a toughie - again I was lucky my dad lost his confidence driving and allowed me to get rid of his car, but in hindsight I think he probably did drink drive and thank the lord he didn't kill someone. I am wondering if you report the concern about drinking direct to the DVLA will they take action?

Wishing you all the best with this

 

[terry16]

Hi
I can identify with all the info given,because my husband has always been a heavy drinker and combined with alzheimers it can be a major problem.

But Terry has now decided that he gave up spirits several years ago!! and now ONLY drinks wine.

In truth I think he forgets sometimes and has an odd brandy but for the most part I keep reminding him that HE had decided to give up and that helps,he also knows that on the occasions when he has had a few extra it really effects the potency of the aricept.

It is one of the advantages of memory loss that you can guide their way of thinking if you keep repeating same mantra.

Terry had a couple of strokes several years ago so gave up driving quite willingly,but in truth he would not know whether he had had one glass of wine or three in an evening.

One small piece of advice if I may is to not attempt to deal with the problem if your mil has had a drink, total waste of time.
Try and get there early morning before she has had a chance to start and try reasoning then.

good luck
Jan

 

[Margaret W]

Hello Janet

If she has been a heavy drinker for a long while, then she is an Alcoholic. There are hundreds of definitions of what is and what isn't an Alcoholic, and most alcoholics deny that they are. I am one myself. I never drink in the day, but I drink too much at night, and every day. I would never drive after even one drink, and maybe (hopefully) she is the same. You will have to keep an eye on that. As everyone says, it might not just be her who gets hurt, it could be somebody's kiddie or any loved one.

I, too, would be bothered about the secretiveness. That takes it a step further (and more difficult to control), cos she is hiding it, and you don't know the extent of the consumption. I don't hide my wine (and I only drink wine, but I still drink far too much of it). It is there on the kitchen worktop, if not in my glass or my stomach.

Then we ask the question as to why she is drinking so much. I could go on at length (as I often do!) as to why I drink so much, but a key reason is depression. Alcohol itself is a depressant, so drinking adds fuel to the fire. It might not seem like that at the time, alcohol masks these things, but then makes them worse.

So if depression is a possibility, one of the first things to address is that.

At the end of the day, the drinker has to realise themselves that they are drinking too much. I'm not saying you shouldn't take the actions that you are taking, cos they all help, but the drinker will go and buy replacements, and will carry on drinking until the underlying reason is addressed. There is no point in shouting or insisting or hurling threats.

The doctor should be made aware of it of course, and yes, alcohol affects the rate of absorption of many drugs, making their effectiveness weaker or even resulting in different reactions.

But what else you can do,.........

And I typed all that in two minutes after 2 bottles of wine and ne'er a spellchecker in sight!

Amazing how we alcholics can cover up.

I wouldn't be happy with someone falling down drunk though.

I hope you can get to the bottom of it. I hope I can too.

Margaret

 

[JanetP]

Hello again,
I just returned after New Year and snow has been taking up my time to read these extra messages. Thanks so much for these thoughtful, helpful and honest remarks.
You're right, it is depression and boredom as well I think. We have done a lot in the last week or so and I think that we have come up with some solutions.
1. We have limited the amount of cash coming into the house
2. Carers coming in for 30 mins every morning to help FIL which will give some company to MIL too
3. Starting at an Alzheimers group once a week that will bring company and stop the boredom for one day at least

If I come up with any solutions that work particularly well, I'll let you know

Janet