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Thread: Ketones

  1. #16
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    This has been an interesting discussion. Our father, having been in pretty good form went downhill with Vascular Dementia and died within 4 years. He was still driving well aged over 87. Mother, who has always had a catastrophic diet and done very little exercise is in slow fall and has had FTD for a good 15 years. Her memory is now falling off a cliff and she had galloping Osteoporosis for longer. Lady A's comments are particularly interesting as they indicate the genetic element.

    With regards to aluminium drinks and food (of any sort) cans they are lined with a plastic coating. Without this, the drink or food would be spoiled. Beer, in particular, picks up tastes and Coke is so acidic the pipes in the Coke factory are renewed every 6 months.

    See link below:
    https://www.wired.com/2015/03/secret...modern-marvel/

    The reason we have a care epidemic is, having studied the statistics, is down in part to people surviving having been handicapped to some degree in accidents. Survival is so much better since the legal requirement for use of the seatbelt and huge developments in medical care improving survival rates. Other reasons will be better home heating and housing stock as well as the introduction of the universal state pension in 1948. Initially, the majority of people only survived 2 - 5 years after retirement. We are now surviving 20 - 30 years post retirement.

    I have friends, younger than I, who remember going to Grandparents homes that were damp and the furniture was being eaten by woodworm. They didn't dare put their feet on the chair rungs as they were likely to disintegrate!

    So, yes, take care of what you eat but live well in all senses. We are all going to come into contact with things that may, or may not, cause problems whether it be dementia or some other illness. How any substance affects is idiosyncratic. My poor youngest is universally banned from eating bacon. The preservative in bacon sends her loopy la la and she is at risk of being killed by those around her! Otherwise, she is generally delightful.

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by trismes View Post
    How do we know... well this is backed by a lot of studies all ready. As I've said before, there have already been studies showing the disease halting with bacteria transplants in mice models.
    Please be aware that so far nothing that has worked in mice modals has worked with people. Scientists are beginning to think that the mechanism in mice and humans is different, so mice modals wont tell us anything.
    Learning to sing in a cage

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by canary View Post
    Please be aware that so far nothing that has worked in mice modals has worked with people. Scientists are beginning to think that the mechanism in mice and humans is different, so mice modals wont tell us anything.
    Hey there, I'm not aware of any studies done using transplants with humans on dementia, but please do post them if you have.

  4. #19
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    Im really not sure of the relevance of this.
    There have been lots of studies of mice modals and lots of things that seem to work on mice that have been hailed as a breakthrough, but do not work at all on humans.
    Are you saying that your advice is based on transplants which have been done on mice? If so, how do you know that it would work on people?
    Learning to sing in a cage

  5. #20
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    OK ignore the mice for a minute.
    All of our microbiomes offer protection against a whole host of diseases, and are an effective second brain, with messages sent from the gut to the brain all the time.
    Many diseases, including dementia, have correlations with markedly different gut profiles to non dementia patients. Correlation or causation?

    So off the back of this, transplants have been tried with mice models. this is obviously a first step. And they worked.

    the use of transplants in this country is limited to c-diff at the moment so we went with specialised diet route, with advice. it's the next logical step, and yes it's working so far. So good.

    As I've said before, this is unproven. but it is easy for people to pick up the details, its cheap and if their GP agrees, why wouldn't you try it?

    If there is anything in it, it'll be years before being published and even longer before it becomes advice by which time it'll be too late for most of our relatives who've already been diagnosed.

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oh Knickers View Post
    So, yes, take care of what you eat but live well in all senses.
    Can't think of a better way of putting it!

  7. #22
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    Good question.

    I settled on Aluminium because of the links in early research on dementia showing it had higher levels in the dementia brain. This was the original thought in the seventies.

    McDermott, John R., et al. "Brain aluminum in aging and Alzheimer disease." Neurology 29.6 (1979): 809-809.

    Additionally the only cases of dementia reversal were in the kidney failure patients who had aluminium in the dialysis and became demented. Removal of the aluminium reversed some of the symptoms.

    Arieff, Allen I., et al. "Dementia, renal failure, and brain aluminum." Annals of Internal Medicine 90.5 (1979): 741-747.

    As you can see from the years this was in the late seventies. What happened was that the Aluminium lobby challenged this research with the point that although there was increased Aluminium it was not clearly linked to dementia. Research then moves on.

    This is exactly the same as smoking in the 1950's as although we had no clear scientific link it was obvious that it did damage.

    The principle in my mind is simple. In order to increase from a few cases in 1905 with Dr Alois Alzheimer to 47 million in just over 100 years it has got to be environmental and something that was not present prior to the past 150 years.

    That means Aluminium!

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