Court of Protection
- Thread starter ceroc46
- Start date
Hi,
You'll need to get the paperwork done with a solicitor first. If they already haven't signed a PoA then the solicitor can sign it on their behalf. Ours was very good with home visits etc as Dad can't sign things properly so she acted as witness & that he had had it all explained / understood best as was possible.
I'm not sure how you actually use the powers yet, not got to that stage here as he'll let us manage stuff quite happily at the moment.
From what our solicitor said, it's not difficult as long as everyone is in agreement (solicitor, doc, his nominated representative - we have a friend of his also down to approve use of it when it's needed).
Cheers
S
Sent from my iPhone using Talking Point
You'll need to get the paperwork done with a solicitor first. If they already haven't signed a PoA then the solicitor can sign it on their behalf. Ours was very good with home visits etc as Dad can't sign things properly so she acted as witness & that he had had it all explained / understood best as was possible.
I'm not sure how you actually use the powers yet, not got to that stage here as he'll let us manage stuff quite happily at the moment.
From what our solicitor said, it's not difficult as long as everyone is in agreement (solicitor, doc, his nominated representative - we have a friend of his also down to approve use of it when it's needed).
Cheers
S
Sent from my iPhone using Talking Point
Are you meaning power of attourney or are you meaning Deputyship?
If your mother still has some mental capacity then do try to arrange LPA.
It is cheaper and quicker and far less onerous to administer.
Deputyship is far more complicated.
All the above I know to my cost!
The above post is, I think, referring to LPA not Deputyship. It is the OPG with which you register the LPA.
The Court of Protection is concerned with Deputyship as they are the ones who hold the actual power.
We are only the Court's Deputies.
If your mother still has some mental capacity then do try to arrange LPA.
It is cheaper and quicker and far less onerous to administer.
Deputyship is far more complicated.
All the above I know to my cost!
The above post is, I think, referring to LPA not Deputyship. It is the OPG with which you register the LPA.
The Court of Protection is concerned with Deputyship as they are the ones who hold the actual power.
We are only the Court's Deputies.
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Like Saffie, I too act as a deputy, for a couple of people actually.
On the whole, my dealings with the Court of Protection and the Office of the Public Guardian have been fine, although getting through on them phone isn't always all that easy! Emailing seems to work better for me.
On the whole, although the deputyship process takes a while and has attached costs, it's all very do-able. The forms aren't complicated and one certainly doesn't need a legal background to complete them.
But I've no experience of PoAs, so ignore me if that's what you're talking about.
On the whole, my dealings with the Court of Protection and the Office of the Public Guardian have been fine, although getting through on them phone isn't always all that easy! Emailing seems to work better for me.
On the whole, although the deputyship process takes a while and has attached costs, it's all very do-able. The forms aren't complicated and one certainly doesn't need a legal background to complete them.
But I've no experience of PoAs, so ignore me if that's what you're talking about.
I agree wholeheartedly with that.
LPA's are less complicated too and are able to be completed online.
There are more forms to complete with Deputyship applications and my application was further complicated by having to appoint a Trustee for the sale of our holdiay chalet, with associated witness statements etc. However, as Delphie has said the CoP are helpful, at least they were in my case.
Some points:
If this is about creating a Lasting Power of Attorney (either a Health and Welfare or Financial, or both) then you don't have to go through a solicitor. It is quite possible to do it all yourself. Mayb people elct to go through a solicitor because it's less hassle and also ensures (or should) that there are no errors or omisisons that invalidate the document. If you want the LPA to have conditions or restriction then these have to be put in a legally precise language.
The only real sticking point can be that the person creating the LPA - called the donor, that is th eperson who is nominating one or more other people called attorneys to manage their affairs - must have "mental competence" to do it. Basically, they have to understand what the LPA is and what it does. LPA's are very powerful instruments.
As far as I am aware, no one can sign an LPA on someone else's behalf - inability to sign would be construed as lacking competence. I guess there must be some provision for people who are mentally Ok but physically unable though. It doesn't make sense that someone unable to manage their affairs would be able to designate someone else to manage their affairs.
As said, so long as everyone is in agreement and you can obtain a suitable witness then it's not a big problem.
If someone has already lost mental capacity then whoever wants to act as an attorney for them has to apply for Deputyship. This is basically being made a sort of attorney but by the authority of the Court of Protection - without the permission and often without the knowledge of the person who has lost capacity.
Deputyship is a more complex and expensive process, since it is basically removing someone's rights to manage their own affairs - quite different from that person deciding to arrange this for themselves. The Court has to satisfy itself that capacity has been lost, that the attorney is suitable and so on. A Deputy is required to keep complete accounts of what they do - an attorney isn't obliged to, although it's good practise - and the Court also requires that deputies take out special insurance which protects against their potential mismanagement.
Deputyship as far as I am aware is only even made in regard of financial affairs - the Court simply doesn't award Deputyships for health and welfare affairs.
Applying for deputyship can still be done by a layperson. It would be far more expensive to do it via a solicitor as there's lots more time-consuming processes and paperwork
Not quite correct I think .
My understanding it that it can,and does, do this but rarely though someone on TP has it.
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My husband & I both did an Enduring PoA about 10 years ago.
My husband now cannot manage his affairs & I wanted to 'tidy things up' - particularly financially. However, his credit card company would not accept my say so to close his account.
So I registered my PoA for him with the Office of the Legal Guardians. Lots of forms, but not difficult - just boring.
I now have a registered PoA & can do everything on his behalf.
Its worth doing so I don't have to justify what I do now to anybody - financially or healthwise.
My husband now cannot manage his affairs & I wanted to 'tidy things up' - particularly financially. However, his credit card company would not accept my say so to close his account.
So I registered my PoA for him with the Office of the Legal Guardians. Lots of forms, but not difficult - just boring.
I now have a registered PoA & can do everything on his behalf.
Its worth doing so I don't have to justify what I do now to anybody - financially or healthwise.
Yes power of attorney is far easier to get and is one off payment. I've known on here for people to pay thousands of pounds for a solicitor to fill the forms in. I filled them in for my nan and grandad (both financial and health ones), it took a day to fill the forms in they aren't too bad just need to concentrate. We weren't sure if my grandad would be allowed to do the power of attorney (vascular and Alzheimer's dementia) but as people have said it is at the time they are asked, my granddad understood at the time but as you say forgot whilst having a cup of tea. His signature was different on most of the forms, and we have had an email saying they are waiting four weeks for the people (who you nominate) to say they aren't happy about the POA then after that the POA will be created. We had one witness and two people to decline the POA.
The court of protection route we have been advised against it is expensive and ongoing expense, we considered it for FIL who has a brain injury but it wasn't worth the effort or agro from MIL.
The court of protection route we have been advised against it is expensive and ongoing expense, we considered it for FIL who has a brain injury but it wasn't worth the effort or agro from MIL.
Thank you all for your replies. Clear as mud now!
Mum doesn't have mental capacity now, so I'm guessing I have to apply through the courts to be able to manage her financial/health affairs?
I might phone some-one tomorrow,at the DWP, because it sounds like a minefield.
Mum doesn't have mental capacity now, so I'm guessing I have to apply through the courts to be able to manage her financial/health affairs?
I might phone some-one tomorrow,at the DWP, because it sounds like a minefield.
If you ask your mum for example 'are you ok with me helping with your finances' and you have witness and your mum says yes there should be no problem. My grandads dementia is well progressed MMSE score last was 8/30 and we have managed to get POA I think that may be worth a try £200 approx, versus £600 (if I'm correct for COP). Hope this helps.
Correct.
It's not a DWP matter. They will at best point you at the Office of the Public Guardian.
That said, if it would be enough for you to receive you're mum's state benefits (such as state pension, pension credit, disability payments etc) and use this money to pay her bills then you could ask the DWP to make you an Appointee.
Appointees act like sort-of attoryneys, except they can only manage someone;s state benefits.
As an appointee you would have no access to your mum's other finances such as savings accounts, private pensions, etc. Only to receive and spend state benefits on her behalf.
Being made an Appointee is very easy - the DWP just send someone round to make sure everything is pukka.
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